Caravan of illegals

[tiamat63]

Every time I hear or see the word caravan I think carnival for some reason.  Then I immediately think of that music video AiC did for.I Stay Away...

Anybody else.getting that or nah?

[cccjwh]

1 minute ago, OldBrownsFan said:

Facts don't lie. Obama was fine with catch and release. Your democrats are the ones who want to do away with ICE. Your democrats are the ones promoting open borders. I said Obama would have done nothing to stop an illegal immigrant invasion at the border and he wouldn't have. There is nothing more Trump can do to stop the illegal invasion except to send the military to the border and even that may not work but at least he will have tried.  

You guys need to get your stories straight Obama did nothing. CJ putting kids in cages and just like Obama did. Again I'm not going to move on to your next talking point until you can admit your last talking point is bs. "Obama did nothing". 

[cccjwh]

7 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

To you maggots everything to the right of Prada is a hate group.

😍

WSS

Like I said. I posted it for those who care. You don't care that the study comes from a group who whole reason for existing is to slow or stop immigration into the US. I'm sure if the Klan release some studies about Jews you would also think it was a credible source. Well if it confirm your opinions about Jews.

 

[OldBrownsFan]

2 minutes ago, cccjwh said:

Like I said. I posted it for those who care. You don't care that the study comes from a group who whole reason for existing is to slow or stop immigration into the US. I'm sure if the Klan release some studies about Jews you would also think it was a credible source. Well if it confirm your opinions about Jews.

 

That study was in the Washington Examiner newspaper just another newspaper hate group you would say. The fact is the left have been targeting many conservatives as being hate groups when their real sin is they don't line up with the views of the left:

Southern Poverty Law Center Gets Creative to Label 'Hate Groups'

Principled conservatives are lumped together with bigots.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2017-09-07/southern-poverty-law-center-gets-creative-to-label-hate-groups

 

[cccjwh]

2 minutes ago, OldBrownsFan said:

That study was in the Washington Examiner newspaper just another newspaper hate group you would say. The fact is the left have been targeting many conservatives as being hate groups when their real sin is they don't line up with the views of the left:

Southern Poverty Law Center Gets Creative to Label 'Hate Groups'

Principled conservatives are lumped together with bigots.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2017-09-07/southern-poverty-law-center-gets-creative-to-label-hate-groups

 

Again for people who are care. I know the people suffering from TDIMS here, do not care that a study comes from a hate group. 

 

 

[OldBrownsFan]

10 minutes ago, cccjwh said:

Again for people who are care. I know the people suffering from TDIMS here, do not care that a study comes from a hate group. 

 

 

What I care about is way the left singles out many conservative groups and falsely labels them as hate groups in an attempt to shut them down. I don't know what TDIMS means but I do know what TDS means and you seem to fit that bill.

[DieHardBrownsFan]

27 minutes ago, OldBrownsFan said:

What I care about is way the left singles out many conservative groups and falsely labels them as hate groups in an attempt to shut them down. I don't know what TDIMS means but I do know what TDS means and you seem to fit that bill.

I'm sure it's some clever (in her mind) insult on Trump.

[cccjwh]

50 minutes ago, OldBrownsFan said:

What I care about is way the left singles out many conservative groups and falsely labels them as hate groups in an attempt to shut them down. I don't know what TDIMS means but I do know what TDS means and you seem to fit that bill.

What you care about are sources that confirm your opinions. If you really cared you would read why the Southern Poverty Law Center classified the CIS as a hate group. Put it is just convenience for you to dismissed the classification because anything you don't agree with is fake. Liberal conspiracy against the poor conservative. Nobody plays victim better than conservatives. So spare me your excuses that make it OK that the CIS is a hate group. 

[OldBrownsFan]

Just now, cccjwh said:

What you care about are sources that confirm your opinions. If you really cared you would read why the Southern Poverty Law Center classified the CIS as a hate group. Put it is just convenience for you to dismissed the classification because anything you don't agree with is fake. Liberal conspiracy against the poor conservative. Nobody play victim better than conservatives. So spare me your excuses that make it OK that the CIS is a hate group. 

And you need to read up on the Southern Poverty Law Center and their record on who they label as hate groups. This is from the Washington Post, a liberal rag which may meet with your approval of acceptable media outlets:

The Southern Poverty Law Center has lost all credibility

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-southern-poverty-law-center-has-lost-all-credibility/2018/06/21/22ab7d60-756d-11e8-9780-b1dd6a09b549_story.html?utm_term=.a9e502856b27

 

 

[hammertime]

4 hours ago, cccjwh said:

Again for people who are care. I know the people suffering from TDIMS here, do not care that a study comes from a hate group. 

 

 

Do you believe we should have an open border to Mexico?

[cccjwh]

3 hours ago, OldBrownsFan said:

And you need to read up on the Southern Poverty Law Center and their record on who they label as hate groups. This is from the Washington Post, a liberal rag which may meet with your approval of acceptable media outlets:

The Southern Poverty Law Center has lost all credibility

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-southern-poverty-law-center-has-lost-all-credibility/2018/06/21/22ab7d60-756d-11e8-9780-b1dd6a09b549_story.html?utm_term=.a9e502856b27

 

 

If you bother to read the link you will notice the word "opinions". But that's OK. I read the piece and it doesn't say anything about the CIS being a hate group. I'm sure you can make an excuse for some the things they do to get on the list.

1.  Repeated circulation of white nationalist and antisemitic writers

2. That CIS reports have been widely criticized and debunked. Because they "torture the data to make it arrive at the conclusion they desire, which is that immigrants are criminals and a burden on the U.S. and our economy."

3. That the founder of CIS was a believes in eugenics and also founder other anti-immigrant organization.

It goes on and on. But since they re enforce what you want to believe, so you are OK with it.

 

[cccjwh]

1 hour ago, hammertime said:

Do you believe we should have an open border to Mexico?

No, almost no one wants that. Sorry the Fox News made up left doesn't exist. Most people don't see immigration as a major problem. The one that do get that idea from CIS, which has been pushing about anti-immigrant garbage for years. But CJ needs someone to blames everyone's problems on, so here we are.

[OldBrownsFan]

1 minute ago, cccjwh said:

If you bother to read the link you will notice the word "opinions". But that's OK. I read the piece and it doesn't say anything about the CIS being a hate group. I'm sure you can make an excuse for some the things they do to get on the list.

1.  Repeated circulation of white nationalist and antisemitic writers

2. That CIS reports have been widely criticized and debunked. Because they "torture the data to make it arrive at the conclusion they desire, which is that immigrants are criminals and a burden on the U.S. and our economy."

3. That the founder of CIS was a believes in eugenics and also founder other anti-immigrant organization.

It goes on and on. But since they re enforce what you want to believe, so you are OK with it.

 

What it does say is the source you claim as the arbitrator for telling us who are  hate groups has lost all credibility because of their leftwing bias. Enough said.

[hoorta]

39 minutes ago, hammertime said:

Do you believe we should have an open border to Mexico?

My answer is a qualified no. Do I have a good answer for those who have a BIG problem with illegal immigrants from south of the border? The answer is no there too. Those fixating on the bad apples that make it through are turning a blind eye to the majority of the good ones who just want a better life in the USA. BTW, we have enough of our own folks killing themselves with fentanyl overdoses (brought to you from China), or shooting up schools, businesses, and churches-  the latest being that very American guy who went Nazi and thought it was a good idea to take out Jews in a Synagogue. 

However, Trump's multi billion boondoggle wall is plain stupid, and a huge waste of taxpayer dollars. I'll sort of address this to Cal, since he's old enough to remember- how did the Ruskies Berlin Wall turn out? And that's minor league compared to what The Donald is proposing. Researching it, the cost is likely to be 5 or more times what Trump is advertising. It really won't work as planned, (my architect pal agrees) it might slow border crossings down, but it won't stop them. Anti climb tops? people will still throw ropes over it, unless you want to top it with razor wire, tunnel under it, or blast a hole through it with dynamite. Scurry across before the Border Patrol gets there.  

I'm not a major tree hugger- but I do love pristine outdoors that are rapidly disappearing. That wall would cut through several National parks, (Big Bend most notably) and screw up migration of several endangered species. Just a big no to that part of the wall. 

[OldBrownsFan]

Just now, cccjwh said:

No, almost no one wants that. Sorry the Fox News made up left doesn't exist. Most people don't see immigration as a major problem. The one that do get that idea from CIS, which has been pushing about anti-immigrant garbage for years. But CJ needs someone to blames everyone's problems on, so here we are.

Let's make a distinction between legal and illegal immigration...you left that out. Most people don't see legal immigration as a problem but I don't think you speak for most people when you say that most people don't see illegal immigration as a problem. 

[OldBrownsFan]

5 minutes ago, hoorta said:

My answer is a qualified no. Do I have a good answer for those who have a BIG problem with illegal immigrants from south of the border? The answer is no there too. Those fixating on the bad apples that make it through are turning a blind eye to the majority of the good ones who just want a better life in the USA. BTW, we have enough of our own folks killing themselves with fentanyl overdoses (brought to you from China), or shooting up schools, businesses, and churches-  the latest being that very American guy who went Nazi and thought it was a good idea to take out Jews in a Synagogue. 

However, Trump's multi billion boondoggle wall is plain stupid, and a huge waste of taxpayer dollars. I'll sort of address this to Cal, since he's old enough to remember- how did the Ruskies Berlin Wall turn out? And that's minor league compared to what The Donald is proposing. Researching it, the cost is likely to be 5 or more times what Trump is advertising. It really won't work as planned, (my architect pal agrees) it might slow border crossings down, but it won't stop them. Anti climb tops? people will still throw ropes over it, unless you want to top it with razor wire, tunnel under it, or blast a hole through it with dynamite. Scurry across before the Border Patrol gets there.  

I'm not a major tree hugger- but I do love pristine outdoors that are rapidly disappearing. That wall would cut through several National parks, (Big Bend most notably) and screw up migration of several endangered species. Just a big no to that part of the wall. 

 There are cases where walls work nice. Israel had great success in reducing terrorist attacks when they built a wall. That may be an apples and oranges comparison though with a wall on our southern border. I think you make some good points against it.  I liked the idea of a wall but I'm open about it. Maybe there are things we can do today with technology that might be effective and even better than a wall. I think right now the most pressing issue is to fix our broken immigration laws.

[calfoxwc]

To Mr. Hoorta:

     In regard to your reference to the Berlin Wall, yes, I am plenty old enough to remember. However, the reference has major flaws, rendering it invalid.

Fault 1 - the Berlin Wall was to keep people from escaping communism/fascism/oppression.

Fault 2 - People who got past the wall to freedom in the West wanted to be free that badly. Freedom is a fundamental desire of people around the globe.

Fault 3 - NOBODY was allowed to pass through the wall gates. The Israeli and American wall would have legit ports of entry.

  As to your point about the wall crossing National Parks - I agree - that would suck. The flip side problem with NOT building a wall on our BORDER... is this:

What good are "National Parks" when they are deadly to Americans because of drug cartel traffic that tends to "own" the areas?

Five Federal Lands in Arizona Have Travel Warnings in Place | Fox ...

https://www.foxnews.com/us/five-federal-lands-in-arizona-have-travel-warnings-in-place

Jun 18, 2010 - Elsewhere, at Organ Pipe Cactus National Monument, which shares a ... should be aware that "drug smuggling routes" pass through the park. ... exhibiting suspicious behavior or engaged in dangerous activities. ... That strikes of running a policy of appeasement to drug cartels instead of fighting back.

Arizona's Organ Pipe park is a 'paradise' for tourists but a death trap ...

https://www.theguardian.com/us.../organ-pipe-national-monument-migrants-mexico

Oct 15, 2015 - The death of a park ranger at the Organ Pipe Cactus National ... America's refugee crisis: death, danger and the border crackdown ... pointed to one tragic incident: drug cartel gunmen shot and killed a park ranger, Kris Eggle.

Signs in Arizona warn of smuggler dangers - Washington Times

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/.../signs-in-arizona-warn-of-smuggler-danger...

Aug 31, 2010 - “Mexican drug cartels literally do control parts of Arizona,” he said. “They literally have scouts on the high points in the mountains and in the ...

[calfoxwc]

We MUST build our wall. If there was some magic laser zapper that would work on illegals, I'm good with that.

A force field dome.

I ain't areckonin' that they got such a fool thang, so...

build the wall NOW.

[OldBrownsFan]

29 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

To Mr. Hoorta:

     In regard to your reference to the Berlin Wall, yes, I am plenty old enough to remember. However, the reference has major flaws, rendering it invalid.

Fault 1 - the Berlin Wall was to keep people from escaping communism/fascism/oppression.

Fault 2 - People who got past the wall to freedom in the West wanted to be free that badly. Freedom is a fundamental desire of people around the globe.

Fault 3 - NOBODY was allowed to pass through the wall gates. The Israeli and American wall would have legit ports of entry.

  As to your point about the wall crossing National Parks - I agree - that would suck. The flip side problem with NOT building a wall on our BORDER... is this:

What good are "National Parks" when they are deadly to Americans because of drug cartel traffic that tends to "own" the areas?

Five Federal Lands in Arizona Have Travel Warnings in Place | Fox ...

https://www.foxnews.com/us/five-federal-lands-in-arizona-have-travel-warnings-in-place

Jun 18, 2010 - Elsewhere, at Organ Pipe Cactus National Monument, which shares a ... should be aware that "drug smuggling routes" pass through the park. ... exhibiting suspicious behavior or engaged in dangerous activities. ... That strikes of running a policy of appeasement to drug cartels instead of fighting back.

Arizona's Organ Pipe park is a 'paradise' for tourists but a death trap ...

https://www.theguardian.com/us.../organ-pipe-national-monument-migrants-mexico

 

Oct 15, 2015 - The death of a park ranger at the Organ Pipe Cactus National ... America's refugee crisis: death, danger and the border crackdown ... pointed to one tragic incident: drug cartel gunmen shot and killed a park ranger, Kris Eggle.

Signs in Arizona warn of smuggler dangers - Washington Times

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/.../signs-in-arizona-warn-of-smuggler-danger...

 

Aug 31, 2010 - “Mexican drug cartels literally do control parts of Arizona,” he said. “They literally have scouts on the high points in the mountains and in the ...

Good point Cal. I also recognized Hoorta's point that a "big beautiful wall" might not look so beautiful going through national parks but the wall may be a necessity.

I thought this article was interesting:

Homeland Security secretary: Border walls work. Yuma sector proves it.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/08/22/homeland-security-secretary-border-walls-work-yuma-sector-proves-it-elaine-duke-column/586853001/

[Canton Dawg]

[cccjwh]

6 hours ago, OldBrownsFan said:

What it does say is the source you claim as the arbitrator for telling us who are  hate groups has lost all credibility because of their leftwing bias. Enough said.

I gave you a few of the reason why the CIS is a hate group. Instead of debunking those, you attack the source that listed the reasons.

 

5 hours ago, OldBrownsFan said:

Let's make a distinction between legal and illegal immigration...you left that out. Most people don't see legal immigration as a problem but I don't think you speak for most people when you say that most people don't see illegal immigration as a problem. 

I don't see illegal immigration as a major problem. If they would make businesses used e-verify that would solve a lot of the problems. Building a wall isn't going to fix anything. Make some contractors rich. Drugs will still coming into the country, they may make them more profitable for the cartels. Border security is turning into another military industrial complex. Prisons, massive construction projects, services for the giant government agencies that DHS, ICE, and Border Patrol have become. Money spent is going up and total apprehensions are going down. So we are spending more for less. 

[calfoxwc]

2 hours ago, cccjwh said:

I don't see illegal immigration as a major problem. If they would make businesses used e-verify that would solve a lot of the problems. Building a wall isn't going to fix anything. Make some contractors rich. Drugs will still coming into the country, they may make them more profitable for the cartels. Border security is turning into another military industrial complex. Prisons, massive construction projects, services for the giant government agencies that DHS, ICE, and Border Patrol have become. Money spent is going up and total apprehensions are going down. So we are spending more for less. 

shirley you can't be serious. Or, you just are ten slices short of a loaf of bread.

[JAFBF]

Quick input.

 

I'm hearing things are not as they appear, they are worse.

 

There are more Players involved in this situation than what we're seeing.

 

This has the potential to get very ugly, very fast.

 

There are innocents that are being used as fodder here - do not exclude the prospect of our full Military might used in this (hence the heavy hardware on the Trains heading South).

~85% of these people are Male and Military age, read into this what you will, there is more going on here than appearances.

 

There have already been armed assaults on the Mexican authorities from these people.

If these people are foolish enough to put lead over our Border   .   .   .   POTUS & Mad Dog can not be seen as weak at this time - connect the dots.

 

[DieHardBrownsFan]

[tiamat63]

Not a fan of the president talking about treating rocks as "rifles".

That uhh....  a bit much.  And potentially a warcrime.

[tiamat63]

10 hours ago, JAFBF said:

Quick input.

 

I'm hearing things are not as they appear

 

 

Oh I bet you have the inside track.  That twittersphere is 100% locked on right now.     Maybe toss in some 4chan.

Tell me, how did that Marine incursion go by the way?  Been dying to hear about it.  

[calfoxwc]

9 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Not a fan of the president talking about treating rocks as "rifles".

That uhh....  a bit much.  And potentially a warcrime.

Nope. it's an assault, and they can throw them with slings. I'd prefer rubber bullets, but with the probability

that they are armed with weapons, too...some have already fired guns at Mexican police.

https://www.breitbart.com/border/2018/10/30/armed-migrants-in-caravan-opened-fire-on-mexican-cops-say-authorities/

    If a couple hundred illegals are throwing rocks at me from 10 yards ? away and hitting me, I fire a few warning shots.

 

[tiamat63]

1 minute ago, calfoxwc said:

Nope. it's an assault, and they can throw them with slings. I'd prefer rubber bullets, but with the probability

that they are armed with weapons, too...some have already fired guns at Mexican police.

https://www.breitbart.com/border/2018/10/30/armed-migrants-in-caravan-opened-fire-on-mexican-cops-say-authorities/

    If a couple hundred illegals are throwing rocks at me from 10 yards ? away and hitting me, I fire a few warning shots.

 

That's cool.    But you're not allowed to retaliate with lethal force in Iraq when you get a rock thrown at you. 

Think it's any different here?   What happened (maybe) to mexican authorities is a separate issue.    If our boys are shot at, then it becomes another matter entirely.   Until then....?  They gotta stow it. 

[Westside Steve]

4 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

That's cool.    But you're not allowed to retaliate with lethal force in Iraq when you get a rock thrown at you. 

Think it's any different here?   What happened (maybe) to mexican authorities is a separate issue.    If our boys are shot at, then it becomes another matter entirely.   Until then....?  They gotta stow it. 

On the other hand they could just open fire and mow them down. Seriously how much worse would the news coverage be? 🤔

WSS

[Canton Dawg]

23 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

On the other hand they could just open fire and mow them down. Seriously how much worse would the news coverage be? 🤔

WSS

I heard you got rear ended (by a car)...probably by a lib. 😃