Browns sign Kareem Hunt

[Gunz41]

55 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

Lets leave my family out of it, and I will leave your family out of it.

My point is simply yes....legally, there is no difference between an assault by a male upon a female or upon a male. Only in a subjective punishment situation would it make a difference because of the views of the punisher.

And as long as you are surmising consider this:   

 Hunt is accused of assaulting a white woman. Would it have made any difference  in the punishment thereof to any of you if:

A. It had been a white male who called him the N word who he assaulted?

B. it had been a black female who called him the N word who he assaulted?

C. it had been a black male who called him the N word who he assaulted?

Better yet...surmise what Hunt's reaction would have been in each of these situation.

Well, I guess that kind of proves my point my friend. Legally it is the same, but nowhere in your post about it being sexist did you mention anything about legally. 

And the point with family was that most people would view their kids differently. But of course the way you seem to act as if you know most everything, I am not surprised you don't want to answer that. Because either you look insensitive or you are by your own definition sexist.

Of course there are many legit reasons why there is a difference. And instead of just answering the question, you throw out hypocritical things to deflect.

But you seem to be making the biggest issue in this situation the use of the "n word" instead of the assault. 

But to answer your questions, there would not have been a release if it were a male of ANY race, and the outrage and outcome would have been the same for a woman of any race.

So since you wanted to deflect about your family, even though I don't see why (unless obviously trying to avoid the question), you are a judge. You're telling me that if 2 assaults came in front of you, obviously guilty, that you look at them the same when one is a Male on Male, other Male on female? No, I dont mean legally.

I'll give you 2 examples. How come in their respective highs, the UFC didn't have the mega fight of Ronda Rousey vs Connor McGregor? Or maybe I just live in the wrong part of the country, I don't remember hearing the phrase, "A man should never hit a man."

[Clevfan4life]

Yup, missed the tjing of him being cut thats why we could get him early. Thought FA had started. Damn im ginna be antsy for another month. Clowney, lawrence, flowers, clark, ansah....theres alot of stud pass rushers gonna be on the market soon. 

I know its been said clowney is a lock to resign in Houston...but im wondering now. Watt is in decline and clowney may realize watson isnt gonna get them home. Only issue with the browns making a pitch at him is he may want a mack contract or possibly more. Maybe wuth the moves our offense is making, perhaps that could entice some of these guys to come for lil less cause the browns are looking scary. And u get to rush opp myles. My two favs tho are still flowers and ansah....

[choco]

Don't let all the cap space fool you. It's all spoken for after the next 2 seasons. There's no clowny coming to the land even if, by some miracle, he hits the market. 

With as many players on rookie deals as the browns have, Dorsey is going to have a hard time retaining them all as is. I just don't see the mega deal players this year. However, Dorsey also had the chiefs in cap hell by the time he left, so you may very well get your wish. 

[The Gipper]

1 hour ago, Gunz41 said:

Well, I guess that kind of proves my point my friend. Legally it is the same, but nowhere in your post about it being sexist did you mention anything about legally. 

Yes I did, you just missed it apparently.  It was clearly there.  I said: A. it was not domestic violence  and B. that it was essentially simple assault...and then I said that it is protective attitudes that feel that this is much more aggregious when it it a woman involved, even though legally it makes no difference.

And the point with family was that most people would view their kids differently.

Sure they would.....so go ask yourself that same question and don't bother me with it.

But of course the way you seem to act as if you know most everything, I am not surprised you don't want to answer that.

I know what the law is....and I know that I am free to not answer anything stupid like that.  So, let me ask you:  When did you stop beating YOUR wife?

Because either you look insensitive or you are by your own definition sexist.

I am pointing out that essentially it is "Reverse sexism"...or "protective sexisms"  that declares that an assault on a woman..such as this, is considered far more grievous than an assault on another man would be.  Do you deny that such an attitude exists or is in play here?

Of course there are many legit reasons why there is a difference.

Give us some...and we can decide if they are legit or not.

And instead of just answering the question, you throw out hypocritical things to deflect.

Not deflection....it goes to the very heart of the matter....the very heart of those "differences" you say exist.

But you seem to be making the biggest issue in this situation the use of the "n word" instead of the assault. 

Biggest issue?  By all accounts, her calling him that is what prompted his assault on her.  So, yes, it IS a very important factor in the events of what happened here. It was the apparent provocation for his reaction to her.  It cannot be just sluffed off as it appears that you want to do.

But to answer your questions, there would not have been a release if it were a male of ANY race,

I don't know what you mean by "release".  What sort of release?

and the outrage and outcome would have been the same for a woman of any race.

Fair enough. That is one of the questions I asked.

So since you wanted to deflect about your family, even though I don't see why (unless obviously trying to avoid the question),

Again, ask yourself that question.  I am under no compunction to comply with your request.  But the answer is:  I would likely be extremely anger in either instance...and since I am fortunate to have never had that happen....I don't honestly know how I would react.  Does that satisfy your prurient interest?  And I am glad to hear that you stopped beating your wife.

you are a judge.

I am...and I have had a share of these kinds of cases come before me.

You're telling me that if 2 assaults came in front of you, obviously guilty, that you look at them the same when one is a Male on Male, other Male on female? No, I dont mean legally.

Well...if I am acting in my capacity as a judge....doing things legally is the only way I am allowed to act.  FYI, be it a man assaulting a man or a woman....the charges would be exactly the same....and the legal maximum punishment would be exactly the same.  But as you  may or may not know, a  1st degree misdemeanor assault, while it carries a maximum  $1000. fine and a maximum  6 month jail sentence;  it is very rare that those maximum sentences are actually assessed.  However, in passing sentence, and to somewhat answer your question, I or any authority in this matter would have to take i NUMEROUS factors into account.  The actual sex of the victim would only be one of them...if I chose to consider it at all.  There could be many aggravating factors, and many mitigating factors.  Example....it is reported that this was his third incident.  If he were convicted of two priors..THAT would be a more aggravating circumstances than the sex of the victim.  How much damage or injury was suffered would be a factor.  Was there provocation?  That could be a mitigating factor (not an excuse...but a factor in mitigation). How aggrieved does the victim portray him or herself to be?  If, as in this case, there seems to be an absence of cooperation by the victim...or possibly a laissez faire attitude about their own well being, it is a factor.  There could be dozens of other factors involved beyond those that I describe here.  I have had to submit these on behalf of clients, and I have had to hear these arguments  (and the counter arguments). So, it may seem all that simple to you....but rest assured from someone who has been practicing for nearly 40 years, and hearing cases for nearly 30 years, your simplistic approach may be sufficient to give you peace of mind, but it is not necessarily always so black and white when the law, order, and punishment is concerned. 

I'll give you 2 examples. How come in their respective highs, the UFC didn't have the mega fight of Ronda Rousey vs Connor McGregor? Or maybe I just live in the wrong part of the country, I don't remember hearing the phrase, "A man should never hit a man."

You can hear it now:  

In the UFC situation, you have a contractual/consensual legal engagement that allows What would otherwise be considered an assault. Each party contractually has waived any sort of claim upon the other.

But outside of that, take it from me,  a magistrate of the law:

  A man should never hit a man.    

 You could be charged criminally. (but also....I do not want to go into the discretionary reasons why it may not be charged...suffice it to say that police/prosecutors/judges have a lot of discretion to do nothing:   case in point:  Hunt has never been legally charged for what seems like a clear case of assault in this situation.  You would have to delve into the minds of the police and prosecutors assigned to that matter to understand why that was not done)

 

[choco]

14 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

😲😂👍

Flip the script...how would one feel if hunt was a brother, husband, son?  This is what's fun about gunz....master of the obvious. Unfortunately, he seems to think he's found some new revelation that one's proximity to an issue has an affect on said person's opinion. Someone call the Norwegian Nobel committee....we gotta fuking genius on our hands 🤣

Tell me gip...how would you feel if hunt signed with the Steelers or pats? 

[Gunz41]

3 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

 

I'll answer some of these, but won't really delve much into the ridiculous idea that "I stopped beating my wife" as you are only trying to say this as some way to make some ridiculous point, which I have no idea what it is. 

I never said anything remotely about it being different legally. The point I was saying with you not using it legally, was saying that it is sexism, not that it is viewed the same by law. But I guess that statement can be viewed either way. We are good there.

Again with the family, you are purposely taking that out of context, as when I first said your son or daughter you said dont bring them up. I was pointing out that I was only bringing them up as people would view their own children more so than others. My point being, I certainly wouldn't like it to happen to either (even your kids who I have never met), but I view it differently a female being hit than a male.

Yes, that word may have incited the incident, but the biggest issue to me is the assault. I think the use of the word is horrible and hate, and how many times have I said something to the former board troll about things like that, but there have been many instances where this haneous word has been used and someone not assaulted. One doesn't make other right.

As for release, if Mr. Hunt had gotten into a fight with a Male, he wouldn't have been released by the Chiefs in all likelihood.

The point with you being a judge, and since you have had those cases, when you read what's on the docket, don't you feel differently about an assault on a female vs a Male? While they may carry the same sentence, etc. Dont you as a man view a woman beater as less than a man beater?

Oops, I skipped one. One major issue is the average size difference in males vs females. That isn't a sexist thing, it's a fact. I think I would get my tail whooped by someone like Ronda Rousey skillset, but on average there is a difference. Another reason is the way society views these things, whether right or wrong in your mind. Just look at the only reason I replied, as saying it was sexist. I think women beaters are horrible, and most probably agree. People will rally more to protect them more so than men. And I also think that everyone deserves a 2nd chance. Last thing I will say about legit reasons is the documented difference in violence level in the 2. Just look at the statistics on number murders and serial killers. Why is that? 

[Gunz41]

10 minutes ago, choco said:

Flip the script...how would one feel if hunt was a brother, husband, son?  This is what's fun about gunz....master of the obvious. Unfortunately, he seems to think he's found some new revelation that one's proximity to an issue has an affect on said person's opinion. Someone call the Norwegian Nobel committee....we gotta fuking genius on our hands 🤣

Tell me gip...how would you feel if hunt signed with the Steelers or pats? 

O man, do you really think I can win a Nobel prize. 

I am certainly done with this. Feel free to continue thinking whatever you want. Nobody on this end EVER said anything about not understanding what is being said. I haven't said anything about being against it. 

But I'll play along with your question. If Hunt were related to me, I would think that it sucks for him, but be extremely upset and ashamed at his conduct that day. Yet I would hope and think he should get a 2nd chance. I wouldn't try to sully the name of the accuser because they provoked it. Was she in the wrong from reports, absolutely. Would that be a reason for the retaliation, nope. I can ABSOLUTELY GUARANTEE NO MATTER WHAT, that I would never do that. 

[Brady Averch]

On 2/11/2019 at 2:05 PM, tiamat63 said:

Well...  At least we have the most talented backfield in the NFL. 

The media though 😱

Hey Browns fans, I know how some on you are happy about the Kareem Hunt signing, but I don't really like it. If you don't mind, could you read the link and tell me your thoughts about the situation?

https://couchreport.home.blog/2019/02/12/why-the-browns-shouldnt-have-signed-kareem-hunt/

 

 

[hoorta]

1 hour ago, Clevfan4life said:

Yup, missed the tjing of him being cut thats why we could get him early. Thought FA had started. Damn im ginna be antsy for another month. Clowney, lawrence, flowers, clark, ansah....theres alot of stud pass rushers gonna be on the market soon. 

I know its been said clowney is a lock to resign in Houston...but im wondering now. Watt is in decline and clowney may realize watson isnt gonna get them home. Only issue with the browns making a pitch at him is he may want a mack contract or possibly more. Maybe with the moves our offense is making, perhaps that could entice some of these guys to come for lil less cause the browns are looking scary. And u get to rush opp myles. My two favs tho are still flowers and ansah....

Just calm down about us picking up a stud pass rusher in FA.  We'll find out soon enough how many of those guys you mentioned are actually going to BE free agents. Teams can start using the franchise tag in less than a week- February 19th.  I'll buy your premise about Ansah, (several others I haven't researched yet) but there's near zero chance Clowney hits the open market. The Texans are on record they want to sign him to a long term deal http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001007820/article/texans-aim-to-extend-clowney-mathieu-contracts and if they can't, they have plenty of cap space (5th most in the NFL) to franchise tag him.  

[darren15]

I wonder if the Bengals will release Joe Mixon when they look at his assault tape again ?

[Orion]

21 minutes ago, Brady Averch said:

Hey Browns fans, I know how some on you are happy about the Kareem Hunt signing, but I don't really like it. If you don't mind, could you read the link and tell me your thoughts about the situation?

https://couchreport.home.blog/2019/02/12/why-the-browns-shouldnt-have-signed-kareem-hunt/

 

 

I don't have to read the link.  Hunt is an a-hole.  He's a punk.  A thug.  I friggin' hate him.  But he probably would've ended up a Steeler to replace Bell.  

We have him now.  Better here than there.  It's a talent driven league.  That's why Josh friggin' Gordon wound up on the Patriots.  Things get overlooked if you're good at playing football.

[hoorta]

11 minutes ago, Brady Averch said:

Hey Browns fans, I know how some on you are happy about the Kareem Hunt signing, but I don't really like it. If you don't mind, could you read the link and tell me your thoughts about the situation?

https://couchreport.home.blog/2019/02/12/why-the-browns-shouldnt-have-signed-kareem-hunt/

 

Guy is into political correctness I see. Played the Kaepernick card...  So where was his outrage when the Bengals took Joe Mixon- who didn't just kick, but knocked a woman out cold with a Mike Tyson right hook to the jaw?  Not a game lost in the NFL....  

Oh, I'm sure there's going to be media outrage that we signed the guy. Pretty sure we can handle the negative press, Dorsey certainly took all of that into account. By all accounts Kareem is a zero problem sort of guy in the locker room....  

[Clevfan4life]

24 minutes ago, hoorta said:

Just calm down about us picking up a stud pass rusher in FA.  We'll find out soon enough how many of those guys you mentioned are actually going to BE free agents. Teams can start using the franchise tag in less than a week- February 19th.  I'll buy your premise about Ansah, (several others I haven't researched yet) but there's near zero chance Clowney hits the open market. The Texans are on record they want to sign him to a long term deal http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001007820/article/texans-aim-to-extend-clowney-mathieu-contracts and if they can't, they have plenty of cap space (5th most in the NFL) to franchise tag him.  

I agree clowney is a major longshot, texans are gonna ball for him. Damarcus prob too....which is why ansah and flowers are at the top o me list although flowers is going to have alot of pussy thrown at him too

[darren15]

Reported today Hunt chose us over the Bears and returning to KC

[Clevfan4life]

1 minute ago, darren15 said:

Reported today Hunt chose us over the Bears and returning to KC

He was nt going back to kc that blew him off and trubisky sux......there ya go

[hoorta]

1 minute ago, darren15 said:

Reported today Hunt chose us over the Bears and returning to KC

Hey, he's from the Cleveland area. Playing for the hometown team and in front of family? Just don't get into any altercations in downtown hotels..  I could understand not wanting to return to KC, might not say it- but bad feelings he got the boot out of there... 

[Dutch Oven]

11 minutes ago, hoorta said:

Hey, he's from the Cleveland area. Playing for the hometown team and in front of family? Just don't get into any altercations in downtown hotels..  I could understand not wanting to return to KC, might not say it- but bad feelings he got the boot out of there... 

And if you know anything about his family history... this could be the absolute WORST thing for Hunt. 

[choco]

46 minutes ago, Brady Averch said:

Hey Browns fans, I know how some on you are happy about the Kareem Hunt signing, but I don't really like it. If you don't mind, could you read the link and tell me your thoughts about the situation?

https://couchreport.home.blog/2019/02/12/why-the-browns-shouldnt-have-signed-kareem-hunt/

 

 

I won't begrudge an opinion. Much of that is valid, sports...people in general... hypocritical with sliding scales. I'm an engineer...and even I get more slack because I'm damn good at what I do.

So, if if it's so offensive that people who do shitty things make a lot of money in entertainment, by all means, try to shut it down. Otherwise, don't watch if you don't like it. 

This position is not condoning anything...rather, I just happen to understand shitty people exist everywhere. Having rare talent, in any field, means your services are worth more. And someone will pay for those services. This is the reality of capitalism, and American in general. 

Point being, hunt was not criminally charged. He's absolutely deserves a civil penalty. If he pays that penalty, checks his life, then he has the possibility to come out a better man. Check the contract, he gets nothing unless he checks every box, and there's a lot of boxes. 

I appreciate the opinion piece, but dude wasn't charged, and thus has a right to work.  

[hoorta]

4 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

And if you know anything about his family history... this could be the absolute WORST thing for Hunt. 

Well, what do you know?  Seriously, I'm curious. My brother has lived in Willoughby for 10+ years, I'll give him a ring if there's any local info.     

[choco]

1 minute ago, hoorta said:

Well, what do you know?  Seriously, I'm curious. My brother has lived in Willoughby for 10+ years, I'll give him a ring if there's any local info.     

You not know about hunt fam? Like real?

[Dutch Oven]

1 minute ago, hoorta said:

Well, what do you know?  Seriously, I'm curious. My brother has lived in Willoughby for 10+ years, I'll give him a ring if there's any local info.     

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/chiefs/2018/12/14/ex-chiefs-star-kareem-hunt-family-criminal-history/2289525002/

[Dutch Oven]

For the record, I'm not angry about the signing of Hunt.

I'm just not able to be happy about it. 

It is what it is, I guess. 

[choco]

Cliff notes:

They basically a crime syndicate...

He had no role models...

But still sought for a higher goal...

Could be a good human 🤷

 

[hoorta]

1 minute ago, choco said:

You not know about hunt fam? Like real?

No, why would I follow something like that? He didn't play for the Browns, and I live in SW Ohio... Thanks to Dutch for the informative article. Sort of puts things in perspective. Hunt could have easily wound up being a druggie like Josh....  

[tiamat63]

1 hour ago, Brady Averch said:

Hey Browns fans, I know how some on you are happy about the Kareem Hunt signing, but I don't really like it. If you don't mind, could you read the link and tell me your thoughts about the situation?

https://couchreport.home.blog/2019/02/12/why-the-browns-shouldnt-have-signed-kareem-hunt/

 

 

It looks like it was punctuated then edited by a 5th grader.  

Good enough for my thoughts?

[choco]

7 minutes ago, hoorta said:

No, why would I follow something like that? He didn't play for the Browns, and I live in SW Ohio... Thanks to Dutch for the informative article. Sort of puts things in perspective. Hunt could have easily wound up being a druggie like Josh....  

My ASSumption that all browns fans know the local kids...my bad 👍

I wondered if jd would go down this road, but I think this means he's already pushing his chips in. Gonna take a shot at it while 6 is on his rookie contract. So buckle up man...cause a runs coming the next few years.

[D Bone]

22 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/chiefs/2018/12/14/ex-chiefs-star-kareem-hunt-family-criminal-history/2289525002/

...... what could possibly go wrong? 

[choco]

10 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

It looks like it was punctuated then edited by a 5th grader.  

Good enough for my thoughts?

Why he have to be a local kid...😖

[darren15]

18 minutes ago, D Bone said:

...... what could possibly go wrong? 

No guaranteed money ....we can walk away anytime ......nothing can go wrong for the Browns

[gumby73]

1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/chiefs/2018/12/14/ex-chiefs-star-kareem-hunt-family-criminal-history/2289525002/

As a Toledo grad I will continue to stay a mile away from this topic..But from most grads that i know from Hunt's classmates..^^this is the best "writing on the walls" that Hunt was up against most his life.very well written & spot on also.Hunt was at his happiest, simply staying on the Toledo campus..Good Luck Kareem & welcome home !!