Why you NEED an AR-15

[calfoxwc]

Nice article. History says so.

https://redstate.com/redstate-guest-editorial/2022/06/09/barsh-why-you-actually-do-need-an-ar-15-n575385

[TexasAg1969]

6 hours ago, calfoxwc said:

Nice article. History says so.

https://redstate.com/redstate-guest-editorial/2022/06/09/barsh-why-you-actually-do-need-an-ar-15-n575385

You only "need" an AR-15 with .223 ammo if you can't shoot worth a shit. Another in a long line of articles that have to stretch to make a case. Doesn't work.

[mjp28]

I don't have one   -but-   I would like one I guess.

However I don't want another 18, 19 year old psyco who's having a bad day or hates his school or family to just get (or steal?) some cash and legally go into gun shop and buy an AR and a few boxes of ammo and go shoot up a school or grocery store or whatever.

18-20  no AR style purchases or ammo at all. Period. NO.  

Red flag laws YES.

Background checks have become necessary whether we like ir or not.  YES.

The bare minimum right now.

I just hope that you have the guns and ammo you might need already in your gun safe.   

[DieHardBrownsFan1]

6 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

You only "need" an AR-15 with .223 ammo if you can't shoot worth a shit. Another in a long line of articles that have to stretch to make a case. Doesn't work.

I agree.  That's why I only shoot 5.56 NATO.

[TexasAg1969]

1 hour ago, DieHardBrownsFan1 said:

I agree.  That's why I only shoot 5.56 NATO.

So you were a scrounger, huh?😂

[hoorta]

9 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

You only "need" an AR-15 with .223 ammo if you can't shoot worth a shit. Another in a long line of articles that have to stretch to make a case. Doesn't work.

I won't bother reading stuff Red State dredges up.  However, this deflection is similar to the video in the other thread... Yeah it (an AR-15)  just a "gun"...   That is, until it kills someone... Then it's a "murder weapon"...     

[Westside Steve]

1 hour ago, hoorta said:

I won't bother reading stuff Red State dredges up.  However, this deflection is similar to the video in the other thread... Yeah it (an AR-15)  just a "gun"...   That is, until it kills someone... Then it's a "murder weapon"...     

Same as a Browning 9 mm high power.

Right?

WSS 

[calfoxwc]

4 hours ago, mjp28 said:

I don't have one   -but-   I would like one I guess.

However I don't want another 18, 19 year old psyco who's having a bad day or hates his school or family to just get (or steal?) some cash and legally go into gun shop and buy an AR and a few boxes of ammo and go shoot up a school or grocery store or whatever.

18-20  no AR style purchases or ammo at all. Period. NO.  

Red flag laws YES.

Background checks have become necessary whether we like ir or not.  YES.

The bare minimum right now.

I just hope that you have the guns and ammo you might need already in your gun safe.   

The AR-15 is just a rifle that is customizable. That is very cool. As far as 18 yr old not being allowed to buy one - I don't know what difference that would make - a violent kid can steal one, just buy one and go violent murder with it when he's 21....  It isn't the age. It doesn't address the cause of these sickening murders. Raise the age - ok, but it doesn't address what is going on with a few miswired kids.

Red flag laws are an obvious choice - what the problem is - can the write the law, with the caveat that false claims will be seriously prosecuted. That should also be obvious. The left seems to want red flag laws to intimidate gun owners, like suing gun manufactureres for violent outbursts by murdered - it's bs, but intended to intimidate the gun industry. Red flag laws - with NO legal prosecution for frivolous lies - NO.

Red flag laws - WITH serious legal consequences for anyone who tries to red flag someone for fraudulent ends? YES. The left though, has made laws a weapon - a camel nose under the tent. They hide the fact that they want the whole camel in the tent. Divorce? a fake red flag will probably happen. Religious disagreement in church ? possible. Resentment by siblings who get made about who is named exec of the estate? "red flag".... it will be a controversial farce.

Red flag a kid in hs who wears an American Flag on it? It will surely happen. That is how dangerously corrupt the left is now.

Which, the left will delight in.

Another problem with Red Flag laws - because of the left - is an obamao/biden gov could "red flag" GROUPS of people.

Like, all parents who protest cra at meetings. all veterans. all *conservative only* protesters. All those who believe the truth about there being only TWO GENDERS. All those who disagree with anything the left dishes out as a false narrative. etc.

The trouble is, like with Obamao's directions to schools to protect kids in trouble - it has encouraged troubled kids to act out.

We already HAVE background checks - anger issues, etc etc of kids in hs - need to be noted and communicated to authorities. No more coddling of violent kids, - but a school psychologist will surely be sued for any red flag notes eventually - by parents or the kids. It's a sue happy, "win lottery" subculture that is out there.

Frivolous litigation MUST be stopped - but right now, it is sanctioned by the left in our gov.

The ramos kid - they say he went very dark about two years ago. But it was never reported.

  

 

[hammertime]

Fix the family.

Stop killing babies.

Prayer in school.

Let parents parent.

Taking away AR-15 style weapons doesn’t do crap and everyone knows it.

[Browns149]

3 hours ago, Westside Steve said:

Same as a Browning 9 mm high power.

Right?

WSS 

I have both. 

[mjp28]

2 hours ago, hammertime said:

Fix the family.

Stop killing babies.

Prayer in school.

Let parents parent.

★ ★ Taking away AR-15 style weapons doesn’t do crap and everyone knows it. - and don't think about touching my guns, especially the ones that nobody  knows about. 

Society in general has turned to crap since the days we had that and starting the day with the Lord's Prayer and The Pledge of Allegiance every day.

And I went to a public school and got a very good education.

I still don't want an 18 year old snot nosed bad attitude kid walking into a gun store and getting an AR style semiautomatic rifle.

Magazines,  30 probably NO,  but in a pistol 10, 12, maybe 15 is OK with me but not this 5-6 stuff.

Addressing the many other problems in the USA cannot start soon enough.   It's a madhouse out there every night, the cops know most of  the bad apples but the how is the problem. 

Oh well, I have a loaded weapon 5' from me right now.......I'm fine with that. 

[Westside Steve]

1 hour ago, Browns149 said:

I have both. 

I've only got the Browning

WSS 

[Axe]

[hoorta]

9 hours ago, Westside Steve said:

Same as a Browning 9 mm high power.

Right?

WSS 

Wrong... 9mm muzzle velocity around 1,100fps.. That's the same as Cal's treasured- and total bullshit- comparison of .22LR (1070 fps) to .233 (3,100 fps). The scientists among us- as well as anyone who doesn't have their head up the NRA's ass... Knows this little formula.  F= M X A   Force equals mass times acceleration.    So allow me to educate you, as well as Cal- who thinks me and Tex are some rubes who are clueless over the matter...  .22LR bullets weigh about 40 grams.  .223 can go up to 85 grams.  So not only are .223 bullets 2X heavier, they're travelling 3X faster when they hit something.   F= M X A...  Ergo they have SIX times of the killing power when they hit something.  

BTW, Unless I'm wrong- Browning high powers aren't in production anymore...  I can only hope AR-15s have the same fate.  Shit, you want the ultimate close range weapon handgun?   US officers in WWII got equipped with .45 Colt ACP's.   You DON'T want to get hit by one of those hollow point slugs at close range.   

[hoorta]

7 hours ago, hammertime said:

Fix the family.

Stop killing babies.

Prayer in school.

Let parents parent.

Taking away AR-15 style weapons doesn’t do crap and everyone knows it.

Just keep on praying harder hammer while absolutely nothing of significance gets done... because there's already too many guns out there.  Defeatist attitude, or do you want to send sympathy cards to the surviving relatives instead? I doubt it..  And for the 10th time I'm anti abortion.    

Columbine

Sandy Hook 

Orlando

Las Vegas

Virginia Tech

Parkland

El Paso

Buffalo

Ulvalde

Did I miss a few?   Go hug your AR-15s....  BTW, MHO is the Second amendment has been perverted beyond belief by the gun lobby... An 18 year old kid (who's not part of a "well regulated militia") with an agenda shouldn't be able to walk into a gun store and buy a paramilitary rifle a few days after he turns that age.  Don't give me any crap or whataboutism either.. We both know- Canada has FAR stricter gun laws, and our neighbors to the North aren't going to hell because of it.  But they DO have far fewer gun homicides and mass shootings though. 

 

[calfoxwc]

that is so stupid. I never once compared velocities - the POINT to anyone who isn't stoned or drunk...

is that the semi-automatic functionality is the same as the semi-auto functionality of an AR-15.

To complain about caliber.... is stupid. Not the point at all. Millions of 18 yr olds are perfectly safe to own an AR-15.

The percentage of them who are violent and emotionally misfired etc, are a tiny percentage.

Las Vegas was NOT an 18 yr old. That murderer was 64.

64 <> 18.

[hoorta]

1 minute ago, calfoxwc said:

that is so stupid. I never once compared velocities - the POINT to anyone who isn't stoned or drunk...

is that the semi-automatic functionality is the same as the semi-auto functionality of an AR-15.

To complain about caliber.... is stupid. Not the point at all. Millions of 18 yr olds are perfectly safe to own an AR-15.

The percentage of them who are violent and emotionally misfired etc, are a tiny percentage.

Las Vegas was NOT an 18 yr old. That murderer was 64.

64 <> 18.

 

Oh you want to bring up I'm drunk again? Bite me.  Guess what Cal... a .357 revolver is a "semi automatic"- shoots as fast as you can pull the trigger...  64 or 18.. tell that to the relatives of the folks who got killed.  Mike drop...   Bottom line- high capacity semi auto weapons... and in the Vegas shooting, a weapon for all intents and purposes- was full auto.  

What YOU are missing... Is the outliers are going to cost you gun nuts severely.  I already listed the mass shooting over the past 20 years or so....  Go hug your guns Cal...   

[calfoxwc]

I'll hug our Constitution and Bill of Rights.

defund the police? Yeah, this is what you all voted for:

https://redstate.com/carcand/2022/06/10/report-over-12-students-in-uvalde-were-alive-during-the-hour-before-police-entered-classroom-n577137

Report: Over 12 Students in Uvalde Were Alive During the Hour Before Police Entered Classroom

[hoorta]

5 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

I'll hug our Constitution and Bill of Rights.

defund the police? Yeah, this is what you all voted for:

https://redstate.com/carcand/2022/06/10/report-over-12-students-in-uvalde-were-alive-during-the-hour-before-police-entered-classroom-n577137

Report: Over 12 Students in Uvalde Were Alive During the Hour Before Police Entered Classroom

FWIW, I NEVER supported "defund the police" or the George Floyd riots so STFU about that.   

But since you brought up our Bill of Rights", let me clarify....  I hate to break it to you, but when Moses came down from Mount Horeb with those stone tablets, they didn't include a codicil of the United States "Bill of Rights"...  In fact- they only exist on a sheet of paper that's  currently 231 years old.  It may come as quite a shock to you Cal...  But if enough of Americans (and their elected representatives)  came to the opinion your "sacred" LOL 2nd amendment is outdated, it could in fact go bye-bye. 

However... those stone tablets did say..  "Thou shalt not kill"...   (with semi automatic weapons)  and just to piss you off  "Thou shalt not commit adultery"...  Know anyone who fits that description?      

[Westside Steve]

3 hours ago, hoorta said:

FWIW, I NEVER supported "defund the police" or the George Floyd riots so STFU about that.   

But since you brought up our Bill of Rights", let me clarify....  I hate to break it to you, but when Moses came down from Mount Horeb with those stone tablets, they didn't include a codicil of the United States "Bill of Rights"...  In fact- they only exist on a sheet of paper that's  currently 231 years old.  It may come as quite a shock to you Cal...  But if enough of Americans (and their elected representatives)  came to the opinion your "sacred" LOL 2nd amendment is outdated, it could in fact go bye-bye. 

However... those stone tablets did say..  "Thou shalt not kill"...   (with semi automatic weapons)  and just to piss you off  "Thou shalt not commit adultery"...  Know anyone who fits that description?      

1 correct. You never openly supported the BLM riots. The party you ushered into office however has been a lot softer and forgiving.

2 as for the Bill of Rights let's just say that horse has left the barn long long ago. Decline of society or glorious shining path; you decide.

3 I'm certainly not a Biblical scholar but I have heard that the original translation is Thou shalt not murder. And there's something in there about the person without sin casting the first stone. I would be surprised if any member of this board has only ever had sex with one woman and then only for reasons of procreation.

WSS

[Westside Steve]

By the way yes Browning discontinued the high power, no idea why, but the most popular handguns in the world are 9mm, or similar caliber, semi-automatic. I think the number one manufacturer is Glock.

I just mentioned the high power because that's the pistol I own.

WSS

[Canton Dawg]

8 hours ago, hoorta said:

Did I miss a few?

Now do Chicago, and while you’re at it tell me how many AR-15’s were used.

[mjp28]

Good morning everyone,  it's beautiful outside,  we're having our coffee and Cleveland plays at 4 pm today.

OK niceties aside this AR 15 thread is a good one as long as it doesn't quickly turn into a pissing contest.....OK we know who can piss highest,  I think.  

Quickly without looking it up one thing hit me on this list, 18-21 year olds and well armed, in some cases body armor and loaded with tons of ammo.

Columbine....young, well armed   the model for all pissed off teenagers everywhere. 

Sandy Hook....Young, definitely mentally ill, stole mommy's AK and butchered mommy and some children.....also a model for pissed off teenagers. 

Orlando

Las Vegas....an old fart, well armed, even had hotel staff help carry his heavy loads of guns and ammunition to his room. Warning ! That will never happen again!! 

Virginia Tech

Parkland....young, knows that the AK style is the most effective way to kill in big numbers, see above. 

El Paso

Buffalo....young, see above

Ulvalde....young, see above

   OK I just cheated and had to look up some facts the median age (½ more ½ less) of school shootings since Columbine is 16 !  This is through 2021 and 2022 has been a brutal year.  Now include other shootings like the recent ones, soft targets like churches, stores and others and the numbers are off the charts.

One undeniable fact upset or mental teenagers with access to AK style firearms is a BAD idea.  That is a good and easy place to start NO purchases below 21.  Agreed ? The facts are undeniable.   Read on :

 

The Washington Post has spent years tracking how many children have been exposed to gun violence during school hours since the Columbine High massacre in 1999.

Beyond the dead and wounded, children who witness the violence or cower behind locked doors to hide from it can be profoundly traumatized.

★ WHAT !  ---> The federal government does not track school shootings, so The Post pieced together its numbers from news articles, open-source databases, law enforcement reports and calls to schools and police departments.

While school shootings remain rare, there were more in 2021 — 42 — than in any year since at least 1999. So far this year, there have been at least 24 acts of gun violence on K-12 campuses during the school day.

The count now stands at more than 311,000 children at 331 schools.

★ The Post has found that at least 185 children, educators and other people have been killed in assaults, and another 369 have been injured.

The most recent school shooting was 18 days ago.

[Westside Steve]

52 minutes ago, mjp28 said:

Good morning everyone,  it's beautiful outside,  we're having our coffee and Cleveland plays at 4 pm today.

OK niceties aside this AR 15 thread is a good one as long as it doesn't quickly turn into a pissing contest.....OK we know who can piss highest,  I think.  

Quickly without looking it up one thing hit me on this list, 18-21 year olds and well armed, in some cases body armor and loaded with tons of ammo.

Columbine....young, well armed   the model for all pissed off teenagers everywhere. 

Sandy Hook....Young, definitely mentally ill, stole mommy's AK and butchered children.....also a model for pissed off teenagers. 

Orlando

Las Vegas....an old fart, well armed, even had hotel staff help carry his heavy loads of guns and ammunition to his room. Warning ! That will never happen again!! 

Virginia Tech

Parkland....young, knows that the AK style is the most effective way to kill in big numbers, see above. 

El Paso

Buffalo....young, see above

Ulvalde....young, see above

   OK I just cheated and had to look up some facts the median age (½ more ½ less) of school shootings since Columbine is 16 !  This is through 2021 and 2022 has been a brutal year.  Now include other shootings like the recent ones, soft targets like churches, stores and others and the numbers are off the charts.

One undeniable fact upset or mental teenagers with access to AK style firearms is a BAD idea.  That is a good and easy place to start NO purchases below 21.  Agreed ? The facts are undeniable.   Read on :

 

The Washington Post has spent years tracking how many children have been exposed to gun violence during school hours since the Columbine High massacre in 1999.

Beyond the dead and wounded, children who witness the violence or cower behind locked doors to hide from it can be profoundly traumatized.

★ WHAT !  ---> The federal government does not track school shootings, so The Post pieced together its numbers from news articles, open-source databases, law enforcement reports and calls to schools and police departments.

While school shootings remain rare, there were more in 2021 — 42 — than in any year since at least 1999. So far this year, there have been at least 24 acts of gun violence on K-12 campuses during the school day.

The count now stands at more than 311,000 children at 331 schools.

★ The Post has found that at least 185 children, educators and other people have been killed in assaults, and another 369 have been injured.

The most recent school shooting was 18 days ago.

I know there's a point hidden in there somewhere.

One that comes to mind is that young people are f***** up.

WSS

[mjp28]

26 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

I know there's a point hidden in there somewhere.

One that comes to mind is that young people are f***** up.

WSS

Well sorta, some, a very, very few number of young people are f******ed  up.  In fact most are like we were at that age....if that helps.

BUT the very, very few that are "challenged mentally " can walk into a gun store or gun show or something  and plop down a few hundred bucks for an AK style amazing semiautomatic rifle some 30 round magazines and some great man killing ammunition and walk right out of the door.

Get online and say " watch me I'm gonna kill a bunch of kids or adults or Jews or whatever AND you can watch in real time."

NOTHING  hidden just the facts, it's that easy to become the next mass killer.  It's on the 6 pm news every night.

Oh what can we do ?  Hide and cry ? No.

Step 1.  Raise the minimum age to well  you know, at least 21 for an AK style.  It's that easy, period.

Step 2.  Up for discussion.   

[Westside Steve]

The thing about young people is that what's the age group that does the craziest s***. Hell I think of myself. When we reminisce about crazy stuff we did it was always in our teens or very early twenties. I think that's a great part of this problem.

WSS

[mjp28]

39 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

The thing about young people is that what's the age group that does the craziest s***. Hell I think of myself. When we reminisce about crazy stuff we did it was always in our teens or very early twenties. I think that's a great part of this problem.

WSS

Oh yeah the 60s and even 70s were great !  (Oh I graduated high school and started college in 1968, MLK and Bobby K. assassinated, Vietnam was really getting ready to blow up. Wild times.)

BUT when we were 13-19 we weren't online every waking minute and brag or idolize people who wanted to go and shoot up their school or a church or anything.   

We are in a violent world, why, well that is up for a lot of endless discussion but this toxic political climate is #1 on my list.   

SO what can we do about it ?  Start with small goals or objectives first.

Remember   goals have to have 3 things to start they must be :

1. Measurable  2. Achievable  3. Realistic.   (my years of management classes and experience here)

If they don't have all 3 you migh never complete them.  The hardest thing today is just to get people to the table to discuss anything.  Without that nothing will be done, in this case people will continue to be killed weekly, daily.   Not a good thing for anyone.

Oh the above 3 things are a start, you still have to work on the details that requires cooperation and if necessary compromise.  And everything requires leadership not the I'm  right and you're wrong childish behavior. 

And the 3 basics just sit and think about it, they do work.   

[TexasAg1969]

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/john-cornyn-linchpin-gun-safety-deal-seeks-tame-gop-fears-gun-rights-rcna32370

I still think 18 y.o. kids have no business with any guns at all. Can't drink a beer, but you can buy a rife (but not a handgun)? Something wrong there altogether.

https://www.texastribune.org/2022/05/26/gun-buying-age-texas-handguns-rifles-uvalde/

[hammertime]

14 hours ago, hoorta said:

Just keep on praying harder hammer while absolutely nothing of significance gets done... because there's already too many guns out there.  Defeatist attitude, or do you want to send sympathy cards to the surviving relatives instead? I doubt it..  And for the 10th time I'm anti abortion.    

Columbine

Sandy Hook 

Orlando

Las Vegas

Virginia Tech

Parkland

El Paso

Buffalo

Ulvalde

Did I miss a few?   Go hug your AR-15s....  BTW, MHO is the Second amendment has been perverted beyond belief by the gun lobby... An 18 year old kid (who's not part of a "well regulated militia") with an agenda shouldn't be able to walk into a gun store and buy a paramilitary rifle a few days after he turns that age.  Don't give me any crap or whataboutism either.. We both know- Canada has FAR stricter gun laws, and our neighbors to the North aren't going to hell because of it.  But they DO have far fewer gun homicides and mass shootings though. 

 

You can mock me all you want.

 I’m surprised your anti abortion but you should step back and look at the whole gun landscape.  Taking weapons away from responsible people is not going to save kids.  
The media has made a spectacle of these shootings for political reasons.  You can’t save the whole world.

 

[Vambo]

1 hour ago, TexasAg1969 said:

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/john-cornyn-linchpin-gun-safety-deal-seeks-tame-gop-fears-gun-rights-rcna32370

I still think 18 y.o. kids have no business with any guns at all. Can't drink a beer, but you can buy a rife (but not a handgun)? Something wrong there altogether.

https://www.texastribune.org/2022/05/26/gun-buying-age-texas-handguns-rifles-uvalde/