Browns trade for Za'darius Smith

[Flugel]

6 hours ago, nickers said:

I trust Jim Schwartz to put this unit in better situations to make plays.. Whereas in Joe Woods system.. It looked like failed lab experiments week in and week out....

While I like your point Nicks; it's a wonderful coincidence that the FO has made a lot of effort to upgrade talent/depth on the defensive line. 

[SdBacker80]

1 hour ago, Flugel said:

Very well said.   Keep in mind, the 1st year he worked with Baker - he helped Baker finish with a TD:INT ratio of 26:8.  While that's not anywhere near the elites with TD passes per say - there wasn't a carelessness that would have prevented this team from going 11-5 .  That worked pretty good with the running game IMO.  Stefanski also got some of the best football Brissett has played out of him; so I think he CAN do it.  If we shored up some of what was missing personnel wise and we add the mind of Musgrave to the brain trust to improve some of the pass game design - he may not have to make the occasional desperate calls you alluded.  I'm also hoping somebody picked the mind of Dabo Swinney to find out what he excelled at against teams like Ohio State and Alabama (with a lot of NFL prospects on them).  

Best of all, Watson will be there from the onset of training camp without the time off he was sentenced to last year.  This will get everyone on the same page and build on it.

I forget the influence he had on Baker and that’s a good point…you hope/think that same influence takes hold on a more finished product like Watson.  I have to dig in on this Musgrave guy…I was so excited about Schwartz (well anyone not named Woods) bubba and Musgrave went under the radar. 

 

4 hours ago, nickers said:

This is where Kevvy fails as a gameday coach... He over thinks it...

You can see him trying to set defenses up and doing well at times with it.  I just wish the situational awareness was there at times.  

[Flugel]

6 minutes ago, Unsympathetic said:

The name was Brent Venables on D. Dabo's O fell apart the last 2-3 yrs bc he wasn't good at ID'ing appropriate replacements for the coaches that won the 16 and 18 titles.  Swinney just hired Garrett Riley who is good enough to bring them back. To be clear he fired the guys he had internally promoted who were at lower-level jobs during 16 and 18.. this is pretty bad because he really should have known their capabilities better -- he'd already worked with them for years.

The most important skill of HC's both in college and pros is the identification [and hiring] of a good next staffer.. Bama's O was terrible last season because they employed Josh Gattis; if Tommy Rees isn't very good [and I don't think he is] then we may be seeing the "end" of the Bama dynasty because that would mean 2 pretty bad hires in consecutive years.

All very good points by you.  However, that wasn't why I brought up consulting with Dabo Swinney about the things Watson did extremely well at Clemson (and in particular against defensive/BCS playoff rosters like Ohio State and Alabama that were loaded with NFL draft picks).      

[syd]

1 hour ago, Flugel said:

While I like your point Nicks; it's a wonderful coincidence that the FO has made a lot of effort to upgrade talent/depth on the defensive line. 

Schwartz likes to play  man coverage(unlike woods who for some reason loved zone) and with the improvements made up front.yes i can see a top 10 defense 

[Dutch Oven]

1 hour ago, Unsympathetic said:

I happen to think Day will be just fine the next 3-4 years.. his most recent hire of Little Animal as a grad assistant is already paying recruiting dividends but the bigger question is if he can actually coach.

I hope you are right, because I have this nagging feeling that Ryan Day is Ohio State's Lloyd Carr.

[Flugel]

8 hours ago, syd said:

Schwartz likes to play  man coverage(unlike woods who for some reason loved zone) and with the improvements made up front.yes i can see a top 10 defense 

Let's get our minds off Woods.  There's been an experienced DC hired that probably has a lot to do with the personnel overhaul on the Dline and 2 veteran Safeties being added.  Seems like a much better way to play gridiron chess to me.  It should be refreshing to see the top 4 LBers on the depth chart aren't all on IR by midseason now that we have an IDL/DTs that can keep offensive linemen off the Backers.  Not only that, but stopping the run for a refreshing change won't suck either. There's a lot to this and personnel matters.  Last year, the FO blew off the IDL/DTs while they wanted to go with lighter LBers.  This year, the Browns added a DC with a philosophy that the foundation of his defense starts in the middle of the field upfront and goes back as far as the 2 veteran Safeties recently added.  Ideally, it's nice to have the personnel that allows your defense to vary and disguise its coverages - while it also enables Schwartz to blitz on our terms (as he put it).

 

[Flugel]

9 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

I hope you are right, because I have this nagging feeling that Ryan Day is Ohio State's Lloyd Carr.

That nagging feeling is getting contagious Dutch.  Meanwhile, the last 2 DCs at the school up north came over from the Ratbirds.  That's become quite a recruiting tool there and some their previous recruits have even been drafted by the Rats (OLB David Ojabo).   

I'd like to see Ohio State's defense get back to the level it was at.  For a while, they were getting corners and edge rushers drafted in the 1st round fairly consistently. It seems like Ohio State has been losing some very good defensive recruits/players to the University of Cincinnati (ie; Sauce Gardner and Ivan Pace Jr who 1st attended Miami of Ohio).  

[tiamat63]

11 hours ago, syd said:

Schwartz likes to play  man coverage(unlike woods who for some reason loved zone) and with the improvements made up front.yes i can see a top 10 defense 

 Having gone back to study a good bit of the eagles under his watch, I can tell you this is a very narrow take.  And the coverage rate differences might actually surprise you.  

[Flugel]

12 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

The name was Brent Venables on D. Dabo's O fell apart the last 2-3 yrs bc he wasn't good at ID'ing appropriate replacements for the coaches that won the 16 and 18 titles.  Swinney just hired Garrett Riley who is good enough to bring them back. To be clear he fired the guys he had internally promoted who were at lower-level jobs during 16 and 18.. this is pretty bad because he really should have known their capabilities better -- he'd already worked with them for years.

The most important skill of HC's both in college and pros is the identification [and hiring] of a good next staffer.. Bama's O was terrible last season because they employed Josh Gattis; if Tommy Rees isn't very good [and I don't think he is] then we may be seeing the "end" of the Bama dynasty because that would mean 2 pretty bad hires in consecutive years.

I happen to think Day will be just fine the next 3-4 years.. his most recent hire of Little Animal as a grad assistant is already paying recruiting dividends but the bigger question is if he can actually coach.

As I said, I agree with a lot of your points.  That said, when you have a Coordinator like Venables - you get spoiled to the point of complacency.  Your Coordinators are pretty much the ones training the coaches under them for their promotions on that side of the ball.  Venables was offered a very generous raise that couldn't compete with the opportunity to be a Head Coach at a football program like Oklahoma.  If anyone can overcome this kind of obstacle, it would be Swinney IMO. 

I think another major pot hole that program hit was the drop off at the QB position the last 2 years.  They were fine with Deshaun Watson and Trevor Lawrence.  Having said that, they have one of the top recruits in the country out of Texas ready to take over at QB.  He was a drastic improvement when he replaced the current starter during the game I watched them play against Syracuse as a true freshman.

The ACC has a very difficult challenge in competing with the SEC Schools for top recruits.  Swinney won that challenge consistently up against coaches like Steve Spurrier and Lou Holtz for the South Carolina Gamecocks in the same state as his program.  He was also doing as well as/better than the Head Coaches at UGA until Kirby changed that the last 2-3 years or more.

[Unsympathetic]

Total details released on ZDS trade

ZDS cap charge for 2023: About 3M.  So we got 10+ sacks for 3M and a 5th round pick.  This is the kind of trade you get playing Madden on Easy.

PFF Live mentioned that Vikes were able to remove the final year [2024] of ZDS contract which was a 20M charge to get the space to sign Davenport, who had only half a sack in 15 games last year for some reason.