Camp Campbell

[hammertime]

if we start 0-4 i'd expect to see a hoyer/campell debut.

 

yesterday looked like a team intent on the #1 pick in nexts years draft.

[Shep]

That was the knock on him coming out and it's never changed: Slow eyes and doesn't handle pressure well. Have we really seen anything that contradicts that scouting report? I know I haven't.

 

I wouldn't wanna be Chorv in a meeting with Banner/Lombardi right now. I think the screen savers in Berea probably say, "We Told You So." Or just, "E.J."

 

But it could end up well. I think Tajh Boyd is better than E.J. Manuel. But he'll also require a higher pick. Bridgewater will go #1 overall. I don't quite know how I feel about Johnny Cash Manziel yet. LOVE watching him, so much fun... but he looks so damn small on the field! He's supposed to be 1" shorter than Boyd? Doesn't look it.

 

And about half the arm.

 

 

 

 

Was at the game, haven't watched the tape yet, but Weeden threw far more horrible passes than good ones. Overthrowing guys that were wide open by 10'. It looked like DA II out there on a bad day. Unlike Z I'm not ready to throw BW under the bus yet- but he had better get it together in a game or two. You're probably right Shep that Weedster isn't the long term answer- if you can't throw a semi-accurate pass with pressure in your face, you're never going to cut it as an NFL starter. Didn't help Little did his best Braylon Edwards butterfingers imitation.

 

With the exception of Joe Haden and the defensive front 7 an all around stinker of a game.

[Mark O]

That was the knock on him coming out and it's never changed: Slow eyes and doesn't handle pressure well. Have we really seen anything that contradicts that scouting report? I know I haven't.

 

I wouldn't wanna be Chorv in a meeting with Banner/Lombardi right now. I think the screen savers in Berea probably say, "We Told You So." Or just, "E.J."

 

But it could end up well. I think Tajh Boyd is better than E.J. Manuel. But he'll also require a higher pick. Bridgewater will go #1 overall. I don't quite know how I feel about Johnny Cash Manziel yet. LOVE watching him, so much fun... but he looks so damn small on the field! He's supposed to be 1" shorter than Boyd? Doesn't look it.

 

And about half the arm.

 

 

 

 

I've only seen Manziel play a couple of times but the little bit that I've seen in highlights and stuff, I really don't like him. He looks small and he also seems like a punk and is going to be nothing but trouble. Ryan Leaf all over again in my opinion.

 

Bridgewater looks like a stud and so does Boyd.

[Shep]

I've got Boyd fever. Great, great kid, a locker room leader, great wheels, big arm, lightning fast release.

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

The bottom line is this: we sucked.

 

We took very few shots down the field, which led to the Dolphins being able to play closer to the line, which led to Richardson getting stuffed on almost every run, which led to is having to play outside of our gameplan.

 

Not having a deep threat hurt. Having Cousins play like a turnstile hurt. Dropped passes hurt. Weeden crawling back into his shell hurt.

 

A couple of deep strikes down the field and the game could have been totally different. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. It could be that Weeden lost his confidence after the INT in the endzone. It could be that our receivers weren't getting any separation. It could be that Weeden didn't have enough time for the longer routes to develop because of the shitty performance by the OL. It could be that Miami, for the most part, was in a Cover 2.

 

It could be all of those things together. It could be none of them. That's the beauty of football: one missed opportunity can change your entire gameplan for the rest of the day.

 

To me, it looked like a young team with a couple injured starters and a rookie head coach trying to play it conservative. It's not the end of the world. Weeden has 16 games to prove he's the one, and if not, we'll have a high draft pick to grab Bridgewater with.

 

Manning threw 3 INTs yesterday. He must suck too.

 

So, again, calm down.

[Mark O]

The bottom line is this: we sucked.

 

We took very few shots down the field, which led to the Dolphins being able to play closer to the line, which led to Richardson getting stuffed on almost every run, which led to is having to play outside of our gameplan.

 

Not having a deep threat hurt. Having Cousins play like a turnstile hurt. Dropped passes hurt. Weeden crawling back into his shell hurt.

 

A couple of deep strikes down the field and the game could have been totally different. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. It could be that Weeden lost his confidence after the INT in the endzone. It could be that our receivers weren't getting any separation. It could be that Weeden didn't have enough time for the longer routes to develop because of the shitty performance by the OL. It could be that Miami, for the most part, was in a Cover 2.

 

It could be all of those things together. It could be none of them. That's the beauty of football: one missed opportunity can change your entire gameplan for the rest of the day.

 

To me, it looked like a young team with a couple injured starters and a rookie head coach trying to play it conservative. It's not the end of the world. Weeden has 16 games to prove he's the one, and if not, we'll have a high draft pick to grab Bridgewater with.

 

Manning threw 3 INTs yesterday. He must suck too.

 

So, again, calm down.

 

 

I agree with all of that. I'm not sure Weeden gets all 16 games if he plays like that, but i'm not benching him after one crappy game. At least 2 of the picks that Manning threw last night were every bit as bad as anything Weeden did yesterday.

 

Let's see where we are after 4 games and then start to worry. He's got 3 more games before I'm calling for his head and starting the Bridgewater or Boyd camp.

[Shep]

Well, a couple things...

 

1. "Calming down" suggests hysteria as opposed to 14 years of hard-earned cynicism and fatigue. I think you need to recalibrate. Maybe, "Get happy!"

 

2. That well-worn "Tom Brady threw interceptions, so..." is, well, really well-worn. It'll hold water after Weeden wins a couple Super Bowls and earns All NFL a few times but not a moment earlier. Based on your logic, Joey Harrington should still be starting because, hey, Johnny Unitas had bad days, too!

 

The bottom line is this: we sucked.

We took very few shots down the field, which led to the Dolphins being able to play closer to the line, which led to Richardson getting stuffed on almost every run, which led to is having to play outside of our gameplan.

Not having a deep threat hurt. Having Cousins play like a turnstile hurt. Dropped passes hurt. Weeden crawling back into his shell hurt.

A couple of deep strikes down the field and the game could have been totally different. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. It could be that Weeden lost his confidence after the INT in the endzone. It could be that our receivers weren't getting any separation. It could be that Weeden didn't have enough time for the longer routes to develop because of the shitty performance by the OL. It could be that Miami, for the most part, was in a Cover 2.

It could be all of those things together. It could be none of them. That's the beauty of football: one missed opportunity can change your entire gameplan for the rest of the day.

To me, it looked like a young team with a couple injured starters and a rookie head coach trying to play it conservative. It's not the end of the world. Weeden has 16 games to prove he's the one, and if not, we'll have a high draft pick to grab Bridgewater with.

Manning threw 3 INTs yesterday. He must suck too.

So, again, calm down.

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

Well, a couple things...

 

1. "Calming down" suggests hysteria as opposed to 14 years of hard-earned cynicism and fatigue. I think you need to recalibrate. Maybe, "Get happy!"

 

2. That well-worn "Tom Brady threw interceptions, so..." is, well, really well-worn. It'll hold water after Weeden wins a couple Super Bowls and earns All NFL a few times but not a moment earlier. Based on your logic, Joey Harrington should still be starting because, hey, Johnny Unitas had bad days, too!

 

And there has been hysteria. I know you don't read anything posted by anyone other than me and you, but you should take a look around.

 

I don't care how many years of this you've been through. It's Week 1 with a new HC, new OC, our starting #1 WR suspended, and a patchwork offensive line.

 

But let's call for Weeden's head and for the backup QB because, hey...why not? That's what Clevelanders do.

 

Lets not give him a pass because, "hey...we gave McCoy a pass, BQ a pass, DA a pass, Frye a pass, etc. and frankly, I'm tired of it. So perform now or get out."

 

We need to start a thread called Overreaction Monday because that's all this is. That's all it has been for 14 years. When something fails, blow it all up and start over. There's a reason we've been bottom dwellers and no, champ, it's not solely because of our QB situation.

 

Based on your logic, any QB who throws a pick deserves to be run out of the league.

 

So, yes...calm down.

 

Now please respond by saying "pass rush" and "passing league" 18 times.

[Erie Dawg]

Sheps just throwing out feelers for some qb draft talk...

[Zombo]

Proud to be leading the overreaction charge.

 

http://dawgpounddaily.com/2013/09/09/overreaction-monday-already-rumblings-campbell/

 

Zombo

[Shep]

Thing is, the fans have been right over and over. Because they have eyes. Like someone here said, it's like making excuses to explain why your girlfriend is prettier than she appears. It probably means she's ugly.

 

Ain't like Quinn, Holcomb, McCoy, Anderson, et al, went on to greatness because they were chased from Cleveland with pitchforks and torches. They were called out for being bad or, at best, "okay." And in today's league, you either have a great one or you better be looking for one.

 

Does anybody here REALLY think Weeden's a great one? Seriously? I'm not saying he can't throw a football a long way or really fast, because I love his arm. I'm just asking, after 24 starts in Cleveland (including preseason), do you see greatness in him?

 

I don't expect the Browns to make the move to Campbell (or Hoyer) this quickly. I don't think Zombo does either. But one or two more shit games from Weeden and it raises the issue: Who's more likely to be mentoring Tajh Boyd next year, Jason Campbell or Weeden? Because it's Campbell. He's started way more games and is always regarded as a first class locker room guy who will accept his role with a smile.

 

And if that's the case, I'd like to see Campbell PLAY 10 games or so in this offense before he mentors Boyd (or Bridgewater). Yeah, if it's Boyd, Chud can incorporate some RO, which he loves and rightfully so.

[Shep]

Agree with article Zombo linked. Browns long-term quarterback IS wearing an orange helmet... at Clemson.

[Zombo]

Thing is, the fans have been right over and over. Because they have eyes. Like someone here said, it's like making excuses to explain why your girlfriend is prettier than she appears. It probably means she's ugly.

 

Ain't like Quinn, Holcomb, McCoy, Anderson, et al, went on to greatness because they were chased from Cleveland with pitchforks and torches. They were called out for being bad or, at best, "okay." And in today's league, you either have a great one or you better be looking for one.

 

Does anybody here REALLY think Weeden's a great one? Seriously? I'm not saying he can't throw a football a long way or really fast, because I love his arm. I'm just asking, after 24 starts in Cleveland (including preseason), do you see greatness in him?

 

I don't expect the Browns to make the move to Campbell (or Hoyer) this quickly. I don't think Zombo does either. But one or two more shit games from Weeden and it raises the issue: Who's more likely to be mentoring Tajh Boyd next year, Jason Campbell or Weeden? Because it's Campbell. He's started way more games and is always regarded as a first class locker room guy who will accept his role with a smile.

 

And if that's the case, I'd like to see Campbell PLAY 10 games or so in this offense before he mentors Boyd (or Bridgewater). Yeah, if it's Boyd, Chud can incorporate some RO, which he loves and rightfully so.

 

We are on the same page. He should be better by now. He fails the eyeball test, and that takes into account protection, playcalling and receivers. I hate starting over with another damn rookie next year, but it's going to happen unless Weeden surprises the shit out of us in the next few weeks.

 

And if he doesn't, you gotta pull the plug on him and go with Campbell. Of course, by the time we do that the season is more than likely lost ... which is a shame because everyone is 0-1 and we have a damn chance if we get our shit together because our defense is going to be good, we found a terrific young tight end, T-Rich is healthy and we get Gordon back soon.

 

I would pull Weeden now for Campbell, because I'm a fan and I've seen enough. But I understand Chud and Norv have invested the entire off-season in this guy and they are going to play it out.

 

But for the record ... there was a moment where I saw enough of McCoy, Quinn, Anderson (admittedly took me longer with him) et al . and I was right ... we were all right.

 

I would LOVE to be wrong about Weeden, I am hoping for a 2007 type turnaround in game 2 (of course we switched QBs then though) ... but that's a lot of hope. I could really see Campbell coming in, playing steady and this team going like 9-7. With Weeden I'm just hoping we don't shit the bed each week.

 

Zombo

[slowburn]

If Banner and Lobardi aren't having an Overreaction Monday then we can stay tuned for more piss poor play on the field

 

We've been talking about weeds athleticism, fundamentals and mechanics for over a year now. He has had more than a fair chance to develop and prove that he is a potentially winning QB and he has not been able to pull it off. Should there be any doubt after Sunday? 1 - 14 third down efficiency; only four career wins at home; totally out of sync with wideouts.

[gftChris]

Just a side note here. Imagine we'd drafted RG3? We'd have an injured Montario Hardesty as our no1 RB which means brandon jackson as the bell cow. No Schwartz at RT, so Cousins plays. Maybe Gilkey in at RG. No 1st rounder this year, so no Mingo. All other things being equal, I can't help but feel by not getting RG3 we're a little better off. Now we're just a top QB away from competing (probably need another WR and DB), rather than being an entire offense minus a QB away. If we have a stinker of a season and are drafting around 4th-6th again, we get that top QB and everything is in place.

[Tour2ma]

I'm still in the camp that RG3 will never survive to realize his "potential". Saw nothing last nite to change my opinion... so hell yeah... I'm happier with where we are.

 

A quality QB will come dear in the 2014 draft... and least we forget we are still shy at least one interior OL and one DB (actually leaning more to 2 here) to put competitive complementary players on the field.

[Rooster Dick]

This thread makes me laugh...lol

[Shep]

Not sure RG3 has the body for that style, but I hope so because he seems like an awesome guy and he's fun to watch. Boyd's built like a back.

[Shep]

This thread makes me laugh...lol

 

Well, laughter is healthy. Good for you.

[mohican]

This looks like Deja Vu all over again, Yogi!

[Tour2ma]

I just found my reason to stick with Wheezy... for now...

 

First play of the 4th quarter he stood in a took a shot from a blitzing LB that would have sent many starters to the sideline for the rest of the game... if not the season...

... and he did it while delivering a perfect strike to Little (yes, he caught it) for a first down.

 

Now, if he had only picked himself up and gotten in TR's face for ignoring the gaping hole the blitzer came through between Thomas and Greco in favor of drifting toward the middle of the line to watch the linemen block...

 

It was the second time in the game TR missed a blitz pick up.... a supposed strength. The first was on the INT Wheezy threw to end the opening drive.

 

It's OK to get mad, Wheezy...

Don't be the only passive redhead on the planet...

[miktoxic]

yes another big knock i've had on the kid. where's that competitive fire? i know he hasn't earned a lot of respect from fellow players but it's his job to lead the offense and if someone Fs up, get in their face ala all the good qbs in the league.

[Tour2ma]

Yup... and you don't have to be perfect yourself to get in someone's face...

 

Nearly every poster on this Forum is proof enough of that...

[jcam222]

 

OK .. so all of the football games you have seen Brandon Weeden play versus all of the football games you have seen Jason Campball play convince you that Weeden is better.

 

OK.

 

Zombo

--I think he sucks, let's move on

I think its is safe to say that Campbell has sucked a lot longer than Weeden. Weeden may or may not work out but lets talk about our shitty receivers who cant catch balls as well. Lets talk about how the right side of the O line may has well have stayed on the bench. While we are at it lets talk about Chud's stupid decision to go on 4th down. There is plenty to look at for the loss along with the QB.

[jcam222]

How about we just try to not throw the ball 100 mph when the WR is 9 yards away! Come on people! There is a reason the recievers looked like 'volleyball' players! Fuck it start Campbell

or we could get receivers that don't suck?? Favre made a pretty nice living throwing fastballs

[jcam222]

I'm kinda with you, Z. I'm tired of watching him throw it like a downs kid. As well, Benji should never be allowed to anything but special teams. He fucking killed us.

Totally classless post. If you need an explanation as to why perhaps you are the one with the gene mutation.

[The Cysko Kid]

Totally classless post. If you need an explanation as to why perhaps you are the one with the gene mutation.

Classless is where this board lives. You new or something?

[Shep]

Campbell habitually puts up passer ratings around 83 or 84. So-so, dirty starter numbers.

 

Sadly, for now, those are Weeden's wet dreams. As of today, Weeden career PR is like 71. He's shown no signs that he can be as good as Jason Campbell. Which is like jumping over a bar that's actually lying on the ground.

 

The point on starting Weeden over Campbell was "upside." But the truth is, it's like Rumsfeld's known unknowns and shit: "Well, we know Campbell is somewhere in the Not All That Bad area. MAYBE Weeden can be better? Possibly?"

 

So far, he's worse. Just facts. They've both had mitigating factors, as do all QBs.

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

Cut to:

 

Three weeks from today, Weeden's performances range from terrible (Miami) to strong (Vikings), with a solid performance in Cincy and an average performance in Baltimore. Cleveland sits at 2-2, with wins over Cincy and Minnesota.

 

ZOMBO: I knew Weeden had the potential. I thought he could be our QB. I was just testing you guys to see who were true believers in Cleveland.

 

SHEP: passing offense

 

 

ZOMBO: Gordon's back, Gilkey has been a surprise stud, and our defense is playing well enough and actually getting some stops, which means we don't have to score 40 to win. Things are looking well.

 

GIPPER: good, z. I think you mean "things are looking good".

 

SHEP: passing offense

 

GIPPER: Who was the last QB to throw left handed, bowl right handed, eat spaghetti both handed, and be married to the daughter of a man with two other daughters, both born under the sign of the water spider? And how long was Ronald Reagan's dick?

 

ZOMBO: couldn't tell you, pal.

 

SHEP: pass rush

 

GHOOLIE: I play the accordion and the meat flute.

 

ZOMBO: hey, so let's fuck the bills this week, right? No 2-17 performance from our QB this time, right?

 

 

 

POETICG: hey are you guys talking about Trent Richardson?

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

Campbell habitually puts up passer ratings around 83 or 84. So-so, dirty starter numbers.

 

Sadly, for now, those are Weeden's wet dreams. As of today, Weeden career PR is like 71. He's shown no signs that he can be as good as Jason Campbell. Which is like jumping over a bar that's actually lying on the ground.

 

The point on starting Weeden over Campbell was "upside." But the truth is, it's like Rumsfeld's known unknowns and shit: "Well, we know Campbell is somewhere in the Not All That Bad area. MAYBE Weeden can be better? Possibly?"

 

So far, he's worse. Just facts. They've both had mitigating factors, as do all QBs.

Let it be known, I have no qualms with starting Campbell.

 

I do, however, have qualms with the same schtick that's been going on around here for the last however many years.

 

Saturday: [insert player here] has great potential

Sunday: FUCK [insert player here]

Monday: I'm sorry for overreacting, but I always knew [insert player here] was terrible. Let's start [backup] because he's so much better.

 

Repeat as nauseum.