gftChris Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 I am NOT. I don't personally give a rats ass if you believe in God or not. But many who do feel they should help their fellow man find the truth. Not truth in your eyes, truth in their eyes. I think maybe bitterness keeps some people from understanding that not everyone sees the world in the same way. WSS You're trying to convince us that telling someone to stop smoking (or other science based issues) and telling someone to believe in god both have the same basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 You're trying to convince us that telling someone to stop smoking (or other science based issues) and telling someone to believe in god both have the same basis.no I'm not but I'm bored with the conversation now.(I am saying that if someone truly believes that they should try and help others but your bitterness gets in the way of seeing that.) WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 no I'm not but I'm bored with the conversation now. (I am saying that if someone truly believes that they should try and help others but your bitterness gets in the way of seeing that.) WSS About what am I bitter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 About what am I bitter?if you are too blind to see that Christians believe differently than you I can only imagine bitterness. I don't think my point is all that outrageous nor unfair.(nor hard to understand) WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 if you are too blind to see that Christians believe differently than you I can only imagine bitterness. I don't think my point is all that outrageous nor unfair. (nor hard to understand) WSS You may have missed the multiple times where I've professed to being Christian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 Steve nailed it. It's true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted June 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 You may have missed the multiple times where I've professed to being a jerk off. fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 You may have missed the multiple times where I've professed to being Christian.That is certainly possible. Easy to confuse since you spend so much time propping up our resident atheist evangelist.But if I am indeed mistaken then I'm even more puzzled by your inability to understand my very simple statement beind that I think those of faith are perfectly correct in trying to convince their friends of the truth. Unless, of course, they don't really believe it. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 That is certainly possible. Easy to confuse since you spend so much time propping up our resident atheist evangelist. But if I am indeed mistaken then I'm even more puzzled by your inability to understand my very simple statement beind that I think those of faith are perfectly correct in trying to convince their friends of the truth. Unless, of course, they don't really believe it. WSS I stand up for science over blind faith, which is mostly what Woody does, with the occasional insult thrown in there. I've known hundreds and possibly even thousands of christians through my charity work, and none of them is an evangelist. To a man (woman or child), the approach is 'this is what I believe, you're free to believe what you like; if you want to talk about it more I'd be very willing' rather than 'you must believe what I believe, or you'll go to hell!' I happen to feel the same as Osiris, that a good, kind atheist is much more likely to end up in heaven than a 'bad' christian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 I stand up for science over blind faith, which is mostly what Woody does, with the occasional insult thrown in there. I've known hundreds and possibly even thousands of christians through my charity work, and none of them is an evangelist. To a man (woman or child), the approach is 'this is what I believe, you're free to believe what you like; if you want to talk about it more I'd be very willing' rather than 'you must believe what I believe, or you'll go to hell!' I happen to feel the same as Osiris, that a good, kind atheist is much more likely to end up in heaven than a 'bad' christian. And of course you are exaggerating to argue with the point I've never made.So do you believe Jesus Christ was born of the Virgin Mary and is the Son of God sent to Earth to die on the cross for the sins of humanity? Also do you believe in a caring and loving God who has a plan for us and understands us? And do you believe that if you accept Jesus Christ as your Savior you will be able to experience eternal life? Or not? None of the other ancillary stuff matters at least in this question. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 Some people here have a hard time believing that two people can disagree on one issue and agree on another. Crazy right? I mean... Stop propping up my radical atheist agenda Chris! I clearly hate all Christians and am actively trying to wipe them out. Muslims are cool though because I'm a white guilt apologist... Or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 "You may have missed the multiple times where I've professed to being Christian." "I happen to feel the same as Osiris, that a good, kind atheist is much more likely to end up in heaven than a 'bad' christian." ************************************************** Really? This makes no sense. It is only by Grace we can enter Heaven. John 316 - "For God so loved the world, as to give his only begotten Son; that whosoever believeth in him, may not perish, but may have life everlasting." I'm stunned. Is this where a liberal simply changes the meaning of a word to suit his own argument? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 What makes a passage from an old book more believable than Chris and Osiris's personal belief? How does one take precedence over another? Unless you have proof that 1, heaven exists and 2, only Christians go there. (Plus I got my first Communion. That counts for something, right?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 And of course you are exaggerating to argue with the point I've never made. So do you believe Jesus Christ was born of the Virgin Mary and is the Son of God sent to Earth to die on the cross for the sins of humanity? Also do you believe in a caring and loving God who has a plan for us and understands us? And do you believe that if you accept Jesus Christ as your Savior you will be able to experience eternal life? Or not? None of the other ancillary stuff matters at least in this question. WSS What I believe in is what Jesus taught. I find the concept of the Virgin Mary highly improbable, and Jesus as the son of God not much more likely. But I do believe in a God watching over me, generally guiding me in a way that allows me to learn from my own mistakes, and pass on such wisdom to the generations coming after me. I'm a little fuzzy on the eternal life part, and what that would constitute - some concept of heaven? I mean, some good Christians' idea of heaven probably includes a couple of things that would be banned in a literal interpretation of the bible. Further, does everyone inhabit the same heaven, and at what age? Are most people in heaven old, or do they appear there as a younger version of themselves? In which case, do we have a heaven full of 25 year-olds where I see what my parents looked like when they were young? Or do we have an infinite amount of heavens, one for each person? Or, do we go for perpetual reincarnation? In which case, is there a limited supply of souls? Or do we have a finite stock of souls waiting to be sent to earth when a baby is born? I believe in a God that watches over me and everybody. I'm just trying to find a logical explanation for some of the things stated as fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 "You may have missed the multiple times where I've professed to being Christian." "I happen to feel the same as Osiris, that a good, kind atheist is much more likely to end up in heaven than a 'bad' christian." ************************************************** Really? This makes no sense. It is only by Grace we can enter Heaven. John 316 - "For God so loved the world, as to give his only begotten Son; that whosoever believeth in him, may not perish, but may have life everlasting." I'm stunned. Is this where a liberal simply changes the meaning of a word to suit his own argument? this idea that only Christians get in to heaven is ridiculous, to be honest. Supposing you believe that it's God's plan for every human to be born, as seems to be the general consensus in pro-lifers such as yourself (correct me if I'm wrong). How, then, do we reconcile the fact that he has put some people in these remote villages in the Amazon forest, untouched by civilisation, let alone western philosophy and religion and therefore denied the chance to become a Christian, with the fact that only Christians can get in to heaven? If that is your belief system, surely you're believing that God has planned for these people to go to hell? We're way in to the realms of theological debate here, and god help me I love this shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 Never mind the fact that the Christian god is the same as the Jewish god, and the god of Islam is essentially the same god with a different interpretation of the original teachings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 Never mind the fact that the Christian god is the same as the Jewish god, and the god of Islam is essentially the same god with a different interpretation of the original teachings. Fact? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 Fact? WSS It's a fact that the three religions all worship the same god. Whether or not the god exists is less fact based. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 Chris, What you mean to say then, is that you believe in God, You are spirtual, in the Godly sense, but when someone is a Christian, John 316 is what it is about. It's confusing that someone claims to be a Christian, but disputes the birth of Christ, and the entire? New Testament, believes in God, but doesn't believe in the Virgin Mary birth of Christ, and... eh..... let's just say you have your own religion, and that's fine. But "Christian" has already been used. Nothing wrong with having different spirtual beliefs. Looking for answers to all of life and human existence, is the human condition. And disagreement, say, about baptism, etc... will never end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 I gotta agree with Cal here. Its not that I think you shouldn't have the right to believe whatever you want to believe but it seems a little strange to call yourself a Christian yet not believe in any of the tenets of the Christian faith. I'd be interested to know just which of the teachings of Jesus Christ you follow. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted June 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 What I believe in is what Jesus taught. I find the concept of the Virgin Mary highly improbable, and Jesus as the son of God not much more likely. But I do believe in a God watching over me, generally guiding me in a way that allows me to learn from my own mistakes, and pass on such wisdom to the generations coming after me. I'm a little fuzzy on the eternal life part, and what that would constitute - some concept of heaven? I mean, some good Christians' idea of heaven probably includes a couple of things that would be banned in a literal interpretation of the bible. Further, does everyone inhabit the same heaven, and at what age? Are most people in heaven old, or do they appear there as a younger version of themselves? In which case, do we have a heaven full of 25 year-olds where I see what my parents looked like when they were young? Or do we have an infinite amount of heavens, one for each person? Or, do we go for perpetual reincarnation? In which case, is there a limited supply of souls? Or do we have a finite stock of souls waiting to be sent to earth when a baby is born? I believe in a God that watches over me and everybody. I'm just trying to find a logical explanation for some of the things stated as fact. After reading this I don't see how you consider yourself a Christian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 When playing make-believe, you can make up your own rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted June 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 When playing make-believe, you can make up your own rules. This is for you Logic. I know you don't believe in god. But you believe in ghosts, or something. What is it then? What is there that causes a ghost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted June 24, 2014 Report Share Posted June 24, 2014 Yes Logic, what causes ghosts? Or did we stump ya? You dumb atheist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted June 25, 2014 Report Share Posted June 25, 2014 This is for you Logic. I know you don't believe in god. But you believe in ghosts, or something. What is it then? What is there that causes a ghost? No clue. I know I definitely saw something that is unexplained. Maybe science will explain it down the road. Until then, I won't go attributing it to some great beyond ran by (insert religion). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted June 25, 2014 Report Share Posted June 25, 2014 No clue. I know I definitely saw something that is unexplained. Logic ********************* Did I miss that post? What did you see/thought you saw that you can't explain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted June 25, 2014 Report Share Posted June 25, 2014 No clue. I know I definitely saw something that is unexplained. Maybe science will explain it down the road. Until then, I won't go attributing it to some great beyond ran by (insert religion).Yeah that'd be silly. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted June 25, 2014 Report Share Posted June 25, 2014 We used to attribute all nature of unexplainable events to some higher power until science figured them out. So forgive me if I am not quick to jump on to the religion train to brainwash junction whenever I don't have an immediate answer for something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted June 25, 2014 Report Share Posted June 25, 2014 At one point we didn't know where the sun went at night, so we attributed that to a God. I assume that still is true, correct? At one point the church taught us that Earth was the center of the universe. I assume that is true as well. At one point we didn't know the answers so we filled the holes with gods/religion. And we all know how that turned out. We never put anything else in that gap.... nothing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted June 25, 2014 Report Share Posted June 25, 2014 "We" weren't around back in the stone ages, dumbass. Not so much on science either, eh, woodypeckerhead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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