hoorta Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 Hey Johnny, kegger tonight! I heard you flipped off Pettine when he told you Hoyer was starting..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louisville Slugger Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 Manziel is still struggling big time with the playbook. As above Esiason thinks Manziel "will get killed" if he starts against the Steelers. He couldn't handle the Redskins vanilla blitzes. Care to take a guess what he'd look like against Le Beau's disguised ones? Le Beau is like 13-1 against rookie quarterbacks. Start JFF, and you can make that 14-1. It's the coaching staffs job to put these guys in the best position to win. If Manzeil is struggling with the playbook he is either not committed and will be a bum, or shannahan needs to pull back the reins. The key to us winning is a strong running game and a stout defense. That offense doesn't need to be super complex. All I'm saying is Hoyer looks horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 It's the coaching staffs job to put these guys in the best position to win. If Manzeil is struggling with the playbook he is either not committed and will be a bum, or shannahan needs to pull back the reins. The key to us winning is a strong running game and a stout defense. That offense doesn't need to be super complex. All I'm saying is Hoyer looks horrible. No one would disagree that Hoyer doesn't look like he did last year. I'll be the first to admit he's been flat out lousy. Fifty something qbr. If Shanahan is trying to fit Manziel to his complex playbook, JF will likely fail. One point I hadn't thought of that came up on another forum- there's a possibility Hoyer, Manziel, and the Browns offense looked so horrendous against the Redskins #1 defense is____________ Well, they practiced against Shanahan's offensive scheme all last year, and they were ready for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 No one would disagree that Hoyer doesn't look like he did last year. I'll be the first to admit he's been flat out lousy. Fifty something qbr. If Shanahan is trying to fit Manziel to his complex playbook, JF will likely fail. One point I hadn't thought of that came up on another forum- there's a possibility Hoyer, Manziel, and the Browns offense looked so horrendous against the Redskins #1 defense is____________ Well, they practiced against Shanahan's offensive scheme all last year, and they were ready for it. Excellent point. Perhaps he should make some adjustments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kvoethe Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 Its PREASEASON!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbedward Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 Its PREASEASON!!!!!!!!!!!! I kno rite. Regardless of Hoyer looking bad in the first two pre-season games, he played limited time and first game-speed play since almost a year ago when he tore his ACL. Honestly, the whole offense has looked terrible in the pre-season nearly across the board (nearly*). Manziel has not been an exception. Gordon's also looked awful in the first two pre-season games, if anyone's noticed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaJayJay Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 what ever happened to the "you got to earn it" bullshit pettine was blowing up our ass..."3 and out" hoyer didn't earn anything but the bench....but the homey is starting.....pettine is an idiot with no experience with an offense...that's what's painfully obvious.....i guess if you grew up in cleveland, you've "earned it"....pathetic.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 what ever happened to the "you got to earn it" bullshit pettine was blowing up our ass..."3 and out" hoyer didn't earn anything but the bench....but the homey is starting.....pettine is an idiot with no experience with an offense...that's what's painfully obvious.....i guess if you grew up in cleveland, you've "earned it"....pathetic.... Go drink some drano....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 what ever happened to the "you got to earn it" bullshit pettine was blowing up our ass..."3 and out" hoyer didn't earn anything but the bench....but the homey is starting.....pettine is an iidiot with no experience with an offense...that's what's painfully obvious.....i guess if you grew up in cleveland, you've "earned it"....pathetic....This is why I come back....I love the manzealot melts. Doesn't matter how terribly unprepared the Lil guy is....its everyone else's fault cause they didn't cowtow to scrambles. So sad how many of you think all a good QB needs is athleticism. So detached from reality.... Carry on....I had a bad day and need some laughs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaJayJay Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 i guess going 3 and out all the time and scoring zero touchdowns is what the browns' management calls "earning it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 wait, you're a manziel fan right? why on earth do you want him starting this year? do you want to see ur guy get utterly killed? I like him too which is why I want him holding a fucking clipboard till December quite frankly. He's just getting around on the playbook...it'll be another few years before he has a handle on reading defense's. FFS. Yes Hoyer isn't gonna do a whole lot better but at least he can see what's coming and try to get his o line in the right place for it. Johnny will get blindsided if he starts now. what ever happened to the "you got to earn it" bullshit pettine was blowing up our ass..."3 and out" hoyer didn't earn anything but the bench....but the homey is starting.....pettine is an idiot with no experience with an offense...that's what's painfully obvious.....i guess if you grew up in cleveland, you've "earned it"....pathetic.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 i guess going 3 and out all the time and scoring zero touchdowns is what the browns' management calls "earning it." Showing up every day of the offseason, being on-time for practice, knowing the playbook backwards and acting like a leader is "earning it". We all saw he can play at the NFL level last year. Still need to see that from the appropriately numbered #2. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaJayJay Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 wait, you're a manziel fan right? why on earth do you want him starting this year? do you want to see ur guy get utterly killed? I like him too which is why I want him holding a fucking clipboard till December quite frankly. He's just getting around on the playbook...it'll be another few years before he has a handle on reading defense's. FFS. Yes Hoyer isn't gonna do a whole lot better but at least he can see what's coming and try to get his o line in the right place for it. Johnny will get blindsided if he starts now. the best move for the browns would be to start rex grossman, and continue to develop manziel and shaw....i'd cut home town hoyer....he's played like shit.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 I actually had the same thoughts about Grossman. I would give him some reps in the remaining preseason games. Don't know about cutting Hoyer though....but for sure if Grossman come out and things run slick like oil cause he knows the system...well than it's hard to argue. Shaw from what I've seen is not a developmental talent. the best move for the browns would be to start rex grossman, and continue to develop manziel and shaw....i'd cut home town hoyer....he's played like shit.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaJayJay Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 browns have another pathetic year with hoyer as quarterback....but homey says, "i know i suck on the field, but i really excel in the off-season....." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 browns have another pathetic year with hoyer as quarterback....but homey says, "i know i suck on the field, but i really excel in the off-season....." that remains to be seen. Hoyer is probably still the best option if our O line is giving the qb 1.7 seconds to throw the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 in any case, Hoyer is the guy I'd rather have mentoring JF....not fucking Rex Grossman. Hoyer has at least tasted a pro offensive environment with New England. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Bone Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 The lil' fella is the backup. Fanboys deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 i guess going 3 and out all the time and scoring zero touchdowns is what the browns' management calls "earning it." I don't consider failure to grasp the playbook earning it either. Its not the incumbents task to keep down the competition....its the competitions task to unseat the incumbent. But continue your diatribe of excuses. Its quite amusing to see the vitriol of the sad manzealots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 After Shurmur and Chud, it's nice to finally have a coach that has balls big enough to make the tough decisions. He did not bow to media and fan pressure. Hey, it's his a$$ and his job that is on the line here. And I think he simply choose the "man" he trusted to lead his troops, as opposed to the one the TMZ/ESPN/FOX world wanted. He would have been a fool to do otherwise.......(shurmur woulda buckled by now) And so much for all the rumors about Haslam calling the shots on who starts...eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C Town's Soldier Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 Glad Hoyer got the nod, puts us in the best position to win game 1. However I dont think alot of you are watching the same practice/preseason footage. Instead of going into a 3 page rant. Know that: -Hoyer got the job simply because he can get the huddle to the line faster and more accurately (right now). He deserves that and its our best chance to win. -Hoyer played better in practice. Johnny played BETTER in preason. Yes he got blitzed. No he didnt take weeden sacks. Yes he tried to throw hot receiver. Offense looks confused as a whole. -Johnny isnt a bust... Yet (Personally, im pretty optimistic)He played pretty well for what he was expected to do. I think hes smart and has a good arm from what ive seen. He needs time to get it together, along with everyone else on the O. -I expect if things dont go well (1-2 before bye or worse) we will see johnny week 5 or before the jags game when he should be able to competently call plays. I just expect better thoughts/views out of this board sometimes instead of "yeah johnny clipboard bitch!" or "Hoyer looked so much better!. Watch the games, i dont want debate football with that guy who only watches the superbowl every year. Ya know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 Glad they named a starter. This at least quiets some of the distraction surrounding this team, and now they can focus on scoring TDs instead of "who's going to start." I hope Hoyer works out. Problem is, if he struggles at all... at all... even in the first game... the media, and fans, are going to clamor for Manziel... this hasn't gone away... By the way, this in no way slams the door on Manziel. He was dead-even in a competition with a 5-year vet, and was passed over based on experience, something he cannot control. The kid is only 21 years old. He needs to mature, learn the offense, and get his feet wet a little more. I still believe he will be good, but I just hope we don't have to see him until next season... I agree almost 100%, but Johnny MAY be ready later this season if need be. I hope Fans understand that Hoyer can have a bad game without losing his starting position. He's the starter & I'll support him. Keep in mind too that LeBeau's Ds have chewed up some pretty fine VETERAN QBs over the years & he is 17-2 against rookie QBs since 2004. Funny thing is that one of those rookies was WEEDEN! Of course, that was the game where we got 8 turnovers. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 in any case, Hoyer is the guy I'd rather have mentoring JF....not fucking Rex Grossman. Hoyer has at least tasted a pro offensive environment with New England. ? The SB Bears weren't a pro environment? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 It's what trolls do Yeah, but it's a valid question in this case.. just does not need to be in every thread... Excellent point. Perhaps he should make some adjustments. My first thought was a stick and a box of dirt to draw in... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 Glad Hoyer got the nod, puts us in the best position to win game 1. However I dont think alot of you are watching the same practice/preseason footage. Instead of going into a 3 page rant. Know that: -Hoyer got the job simply because he can get the huddle to the line faster and more accurately (right now). He deserves that and its our best chance to win. -Hoyer played better in practice. Johnny played BETTER in preason. Yes he got blitzed. No he didnt take weeden sacks. Yes he tried to throw hot receiver. Offense looks confused as a whole. Watch the games, i dont want debate football with that guy who only watches the superbowl every year. Ya know? First, there's practice footage? Agree with a lot of what you said, but not that it was as simple as time-to-the-line. I also disagree that JM played "better" in preseason. JM made very few reads let alone correct ones and threw the ball poorly. He is still looking for the open guy, occasionally a second open guy. The main difference was that if he stopped at one (Detroit) and took off he'd post some yardage, but if he looked for a second (WSH), then the D ate him up. He simply is not ready... BH consistently made the proper reads, but threw poorly. He was the "better" option now just as he was in week 3 last year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted August 20, 2014 Report Share Posted August 20, 2014 I view these PRESEASON performances purely through the prism of how the QB, or any player, does their job. I put much less emphasis on the result of any play versus the execution of the play. There's so many moving parts in preseason that its hard to make direct comparisons. Vanilla play calling goes hand in hand with coaches calling plays to check a situation. Creating adversity if you will.... Bubble players constantly in and out of the lineups.... Scrambles put up a better stat line for sure....but that also tells the tale of how stats lie. Hoyers mid and long range accuracy was piss poor....but he was making the right read, getting the ball out on time, and into a catchable window. He simply missed the throws. That can be cured by reps. While concerning, it demonstrates that execution of a given play is greatly dependent on first and foremost, understanding of the play relative to the defensive scheme. Its impossible to consistently make good decisions if one lacks the knowledge and understanding to process the information at hand to reach a good decision. So while Boyer does not possess the natural athletic gifts of scrambles, he has probably the most important gift to succeeding at the NFL level....the understanding. Without that part, succeeding is so much more difficult. What remains to be seen is whether he can turn understanding into points and wins. Conversely....the Lil guy just doesn't know what to do with his athleticism. I'll be honest here....while even the stanchest manzealots are cringing an blaming the coaches, I'm become ever more a fan. I like what he says since TC has started. He's much smarter than I thought. I don't think it'll be long before the patterns in the playbook click, the defenses begin to look similar, and movements become predictable. I'm pretty excited to see him if it all comes together for him. I actually think it will....so step away from the ledge at least until next season. Fuck man....weeden got 2 seasons.....right? I think pettiness has done an admirable job considering the coverage around the browns for a first year HC. He's gonna make mistakes, either we accept that people are fallible and deserve some time to correct those mistakes, or we invite the revolving door that been this FO and team. Chill the fuck out, stop being so knee jerk and fickle and watch what unfolds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuNNerGatSKi Posted August 21, 2014 Report Share Posted August 21, 2014 Word Chico. I have been cracking the fuck up reading the board today. The majority of the hardcore, kneel down manzealots are hiding in their corners while the more reasonable individuals of our newly acquired manziel fans are beginning to come around and see the sense in Pettines decision. I agree with the majority of you guys in that they both have EXECUTED very poorly in the first two games. As has been said, Hoyer continues to demonstrate a thorough understanding of mental quarterbacking such as making great reads and progressions with above average pocket presence. Where he has faltered is with EXECUTING and ACTING on his understanding with accurate throws and loose play. He seems to play very tense to me. He sees the window, gets the ball out very fast, but the throws have been mostly poor to serviceable at best. That indicates a high level of tension and nerves in my opinion. Let's see if he relaxes and returns to his surgical game management we glimpsed in two and a quarter games last year. Manziel on the other hand has demonstrated, in my opinion, the athletic ability to EXECUTE and PERFORM at high level. What he has lacked happens to be Hoyer s greatest strength: a superb understanding of the mental mechanics to be an efficient and productive starting QB in the NFL. Just like Hoyer s issues can be remedied with a commitment of all first team reps and repetition solely to himself and the removal of what I have termed the "manziel effect' hanging so close over his head, Johnnys woes can cured with a heavy, heavy dose of film and playbook study and extra work with our QB coach Dowell Loggains on his mechanics and maintaining his poise under pressure. If only we can perform some sort of mind meld with Hoyer and Johnny: infuse Hoyer s superb understanding of the mental aspect with Johnnys supreme athletic abilities and instincts and wah lah we have a real Johnny Cleveland poised to take us to the super bowl. My only suggestion for all of us is supreme patience. And no, that does not mean tolerate another dumpster fire of a fucking season this year. We just need to be logical creatures while this process plays out. I know that's hard to do as Neanderthal football nuts, but we must persevere. Anyways, GO BROWNS! FUCK SHITSBURGH! FUCK THE RATBIRDS! AND FUCK THE ORANGE PUSSY CATS ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaJayJay Posted August 21, 2014 Report Share Posted August 21, 2014 i guess going 3 and out on almost every possession and never scoring a touchdown is what passes for "earning it" in cleveland....but the homey's going to start, so all's good.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaJayJay Posted August 21, 2014 Report Share Posted August 21, 2014 Glad Hoyer got the nod, puts us in the best position to win game 1. However I dont think alot of you are watching the same practice/preseason footage. Instead of going into a 3 page rant. Know that: -Hoyer got the job simply because he can get the huddle to the line faster and more accurately (right now). He deserves that and its our best chance to win. -Hoyer played better in practice. Johnny played BETTER in preason. Yes he got blitzed. No he didnt take weeden sacks. Yes he tried to throw hot receiver. Offense looks confused as a whole. -Johnny isnt a bust... Yet (Personally, im pretty optimistic)He played pretty well for what he was expected to do. I think hes smart and has a good arm from what ive seen. He needs time to get it together, along with everyone else on the O. -I expect if things dont go well (1-2 before bye or worse) we will see johnny week 5 or before the jags game when he should be able to competently call plays. I just expect better thoughts/views out of this board sometimes instead of "yeah johnny clipboard bitch!" or "Hoyer looked so much better!. Watch the games, i dont want debate football with that guy who only watches the superbowl every year. Ya know? well if you only talk to Super Bowl fans, you sure won't talk to anyone connected to the browns.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taco918 Posted August 21, 2014 Report Share Posted August 21, 2014 Lol @ Browns fans. You guys are so short sighted. I'm not going anywhere. Have fun taking pictures next to my statue in 10 years. How did it take this long for this handle to come up? I'm disappointed it's taken this long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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