gftChris Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 You think OLB is a bigger need than ILB? Please explain cause I watched us get gouged the entire season up the middle. You can argue some fo that is on the D line for sure but when it comes down to it ILB'ers are responsible for the run, period. We failed to put any consistent pressure on the QB this year, outside of Kruger. Part of that is on the DL as well for sure, but Sheard was generally underwhelming and his contract is up, and Mingo has done nothing of note in the two years he has been here. Meanwhile, Dansby has been playing at a very high level, and Robertson was very impressive in the games Dansby was out and he needed to step up. Basically, I put run stopping on the DL, with ILB to mop up, and the DL hasn't been doing that effectively this season, nor generating pass rush. So for me, DL first, then OLB/ILB. I wouldn't be at all upset though if the FO had the priorities flipped, there's not much in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBrown Posted December 31, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Mingo is getting better and has basically been playing with one shoulder in use. I still have high hopes for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Mingo is getting better and has basically been playing with one shoulder in use. I still have high hopes for him. I'm not ready to give up on him just yet, and hopefully he can get his shoulder injury behind him, but he hasn't been exactly terrifying when healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 You think OLB is a bigger need than ILB? Please explain cause I watched us get gouged the entire season up the middle. You can argue some fo that is on the D line for sure but when it comes down to it ILB'ers are responsible for the run, period. They can't reliably stop the run if the D-line has already been pushed 3-5 yards upfield off the snap. When Taylor was in, the ILBs looked fine and the run defense was good. They were able to do their job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I'm not ready to give up on him just yet, and hopefully he can get his shoulder injury behind him, but he hasn't been exactly terrifying when healthy. Yeah he is still an undersized, finesse player when healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Mingo can't tackle worth a shit. Speak english. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Yeah he is still an undersized, finesse player when healthy. Yet he has the size to be an ILB - I wonder...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Mingo can't tackle worth a shit. Speak english. I was trying to be fair when talking about a Charmin soft tackler who can run fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Yet he has the size to be an ILB - I wonder...? He would be flattened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 He would be flattened. Most likely. DB? WR? P? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Most likely. DB? WR? P? We haven't seen him throw a football. However, he appears to be able to show up for meetings so he has a leg up on the competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andeftw Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Signing Justin Houston will take at least 15M a year and two first round picks if the Chiefs use the non-exclusive franchise tag, otherwise there is no chance of him leaving Kansas City. The Browns will have around 50M in cap room (including the carryover from 2014), I just hope they don't go on a shopping spree like the Dolphins and Bucs did in the past couple of years and overpay for mediocre players. Personally I'm a fan of the way the Packers do things (big surprise since I'm a Packer fan myself): build through the draft, re-sign your own players and let other teams overpay for your scrubs while getting compensatory picks in return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Yes, I'm not advocating anything ridiculous wrt signing big time free agents, just saying that if there was one guy I want it would be him. Of course, there's the franchise tags to deal with and everything else making it very unlikely. Can't stop me wishing though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I'd go ILB first as well. In part because I think Robertson belongs outside. Leonhard retired. And I am not so keen on keeping Sheard. He is too similar to Kruger, if they are both on the field as the same time we can't cover, I'd rather add a speedier outside linebacker. I know Leonard retired... doesn't mean I don't make him an offer... maybe a Player/ Coach deal assuming the CBA allows such a thing. He made $570k. Put $1 mm on the table with 750k guaranteed and see if he stays retired. Sheard is good depth if nothing else. I do not expect he'll get a "big" offer. Being a lot like Kruger is not a bad thing if Kruger were to go down. We have room to add a speedier OLB without using Sheard's spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I'd go ILB first as well. In part because I think Robertson belongs outside. I know Leonard retired... doesn't mean I don't make him an offer... maybe a Player/ Coach deal assuming the CBA allows such a thing. He made $570k. Put $1 mm on the table with 750k guaranteed and see if he stays retired. Sheard is good depth if nothing else. I do not expect he'll get a "big" offer. Being a lot like Kruger is not a bad thing if Kruger were to go down. We have room to add a speedier OLB without using Sheard's spot. I think Sheard is going to command a lot more money on the open market than you may presume. He won't be affordable as depth. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Sheard was a guy I really liked when we drafted him and Ive felt all along that he's out of position in this defense and at LB..... If I had a 4-3, then Id sign him and put him back at DE, where I think he'd be very productive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andeftw Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I'd go ILB first as well. In part because I think Robertson belongs outside. Maybe in a 4-3, he doesn't have the size to play outside in a 3-4. I think Sheard is going to command a lot more money on the open market than you may presume. He won't be affordable as depth. Zombo Let's hope that's the case and the Browns get a 3rd round compensatory pick. That would also open up room for Mingo as a full time player, although he's yet to prove he can stay healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I think Sheard is going to command a lot more money on the open market than you may presume. He won't be affordable as depth. You may well be right if, as Mud suggests, a 4-3 team has their sights on him. But how much do you offer for a guy you have not seen in that role for a year or more? Maybe in a 4-3, he doesn't have the size to play outside in a 3-4. Let's hope that's the case and the Browns get a 3rd round compensatory pick. That would also open up room for Mingo as a full time player, although he's yet to prove he can stay healthy. A third would be a nice consolation prize... and while not a total poison pill, it is enough to dissuade casual interest. If Mingo at 240 is "big enough" to play OLB, I don't see how Robertson falls short at 234. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 My question is when can you start to actually acquire free agent players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andeftw Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 You may well be right if, as Mud suggests, a 4-3 team has their sights on him. But how much do you offer for a guy you have not seen in that role for a year or more? A third would be a nice consolation prize... and while not a total poison pill, it is enough to dissuade casual interest. If Mingo at 240 is "big enough" to play OLB, I don't see how Robertson falls short at 234. The team that loses the player gets compensation but there is no poison pill because the team which signs the player doesn't lose a pick. The compensatory pick comes after the 32 traditional picks in each round. As an example, the Steelers got the 33rd pick in the third round in the 2014 draft because of Mike Wallace's deal with the Dolphins. The Packers got the 34th pick because Jennings signed a smaller deal with the Vikings than Wallace did with the Dolphins. Mingo is 6'4", he can add muscle to his frame and play at 260 like Clay Matthews or Suggs who are both 6'3". Robertson is 6'1". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andeftw Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 My question is when can you start to actually acquire free agent players? Teams can negotiate with players starting on March 7th but deals cannot be signed before 4 pm eastern on March 10th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 The team that loses the player gets compensation but there is no poison pill because the team which signs the player doesn't lose a pick. Mingo is 6'4", he can add muscle to his frame and play at 260 like Clay Matthews or Suggs who are both 6'3". Robertson is 6'1". That is true of compensatories... my bad for not remembering that. As for Mingo... We've been awaiting a weight gain for two-years running. He came out of LSU at 241 and is now 240. Some frames just don't gain. Given that I simply want the more compact player at the edge vs. the run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I like this idea: Signing the top guard available Iaputi, and making Greco the valuable depth guy we lacked so much this year: http://dawgpounddaily.com/2014/12/31/browns-free-agency-targeting-mike-iupati/ And then draft a tackle (Thomas and Scwartz won't both be healthy forever) and you done with the OL. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I like this idea: Signing the top guard available Iaputi, and making Greco the valuable depth guy we lacked so much this year: http://dawgpounddaily.com/2014/12/31/browns-free-agency-targeting-mike-iupati/ And then draft a tackle (Thomas and Scwartz won't both be healthy forever) and you done with the OL. Zombo Hard to argue against the top FA at a position, but as an alternative Willie Colon can likely be had for under $2.0 to be a back up OG and would be a good one. As for OT... Bito is likely better than any OT we are likely to land so you could double up on OG depth. But if you want to go seriously OT hunting in FA the Packers' RT Bulaga would be my target. He upgrades RT and offers damn good LT back-up. At $6MM+, he'd be pricey, but worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdl15 Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I draft best 2 lineman in draft then get really aggressive in FA. i. e. Julius Thomas TE and D. Thomas WR. Draft smart and buy ready to go talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andeftw Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 That is true of compensatories... my bad for not remembering that. As for Mingo... We've been awaiting a weight gain for two-years running. He came out of LSU at 241 and is now 240. Some frames just don't gain. Given that I simply want the more compact player at the edge vs. the run. That might be the case, we'll see if he manages to put on some weight. I just don't see Robertson as a pass rushing OLB. Maybe play him there in obvious running situations and then kick him inside on passing situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagitron Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 And how many successful teams add nobody in free agency and rely on rookies every year? If you draft well you shouldn't need to rely on rookies. Loading up in fa is a sign of poor drafting. Pittsburgh rarely signs high profile free agents and they aren't the only team. Hell I was shocked to see them sign a 25m dollar contract this season and they had to dip a little in fa because of some later round misses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagitron Posted December 31, 2014 Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 I draft best 2 lineman in draft then get really aggressive in FA. i. e. Julius Thomas TE and D. Thomas WR. Draft smart and buy ready to go talent.You are drunk if you think Thomas & Thomas are going anywhere. Edit: iupati? What makes anyone think he's going to hit the market? A lot of the guys mentioned are going to get tagged or resigned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted January 1, 2015 Report Share Posted January 1, 2015 Edit: iupati? What makes anyone think he's going to hit the market? A lot of the guys mentioned are going to get tagged or resigned. The Niners are over the cap as of now... makes their signing Iupati a matter of priorities. The Packers are far more likely to be able to keep Bulaga. Better worry about your Steelers... with only $4.4MM in cap space Taylor looks to be gone and signing Worilds is going to be a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted January 1, 2015 Report Share Posted January 1, 2015 They can't reliably stop the run if the D-line has already been pushed 3-5 yards upfield off the snap. When Taylor was in, the ILBs looked fine and the run defense was good. They were able to do their job. Thing is I saw our ILB'ers out of position constantly even in games where we did "ok" stopping the run. At the beginning of the season when our DL was healthy they were not getting blown off the ball.....at all. It was all on our ILB'ers. Yeah I know the DL started to get nicked and that of course doesn't help, but still run stopping is way more on the LB'ers than it is on the DL. Our guys just don't do it well, for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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