Browns interest in Skins OT, Trent Williams

[jiggins7919]

16 minutes ago, SdBacker80 said:

But ultimately we need to decide if Williams moves the needle enough.  Does he fix Bakers mechanics, Freddie’s inexperience, incompetence with offensive schemes and calls, and overall discipline of this team. Flipside of this Does a rookie tackle come in a win a job right away and protect Baker next season and the seasons after?  Does this guy make Chubb better?  Does Williams presence make Chubb better? 

All terrific points. My question is, can Greg Robinson play RT? That's going to be the big question, assuming Trent is ready to actually PLAY. We don't know what kind of shape he's actually in, ya know?? 

Also, we're going to make SEVERAL moves this week, mark it down. We NEED a linebacker because Mack Wilson just isn't getting it done. He was TERRIBLE Sunday and he had the worst missed tackle of  the year that resulted in a 20 yard gain instead of a 1 yard loss. It was crushing and I'm pretty sure it was him. If it wasn't, he still played awful and we need a linebacker, NOW. Mack has potential, but it's not there yet. 

Also, we have a staggering NINETEEN skill players on the active rosters that are WRs and DBs. Nineteen! That's unbelievable and you have to change that when the team has glaring holes. Why isn't Avery playing? What is Chad Thomas giving you? Chris Smith? Anyone? Rashard Higgins was healthy and active but didn't play? REALLY? 

I have my doubts about us getting Trent Williams, but our OL will still look different because Wyatt Teller will now take over. If you don't know, Teller is a physical specimen and a much different type of player than Kush, who is known to be decent at pass protection. Teller was one of those combine freaks who benched 225 like 36 times or something, and he lives in the weight room. Did you notice that we pulled linemen at the goal line? You only do that when you can't trust your guys to move their guy. This is another reason why we don't often run that QB sneak...we can't trust our guys to get a push. If it's me, and I'm at the 1 yard line, I'm running a sneak no less than twice in 4 plays. 

Our team is going to look different for a variety of reasons in the coming weeks. Njoku, Hunt, Higgins, Ward, and Greedy. Those are BIG names, and we have to add them to the guys like Teller and possibly Trent Williams to make something magical. 

Oh yeah, and Baker has to start throwing effing TOUCHDOWNS. He does that, we win, and the luck we've been sorely missing will arrive. 

[TexasAg1969]

We also miss having a true roadgrading FB. May I suggest teaching Garrett how to be one for goalline plays. He's fast enough, big enough, strong enough and athletic enough to actually fill the bill. Got nothing to lose by trying it out during this two weeks of practice

[jiggins7919]

12 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

We also miss having a true roadgrading FB. May I suggest teaching Garrett how to be one for goalline plays. He's fast enough, big enough, strong enough and athletic enough to actually fill the bill. Got nothing to lose by trying it out during this two weeks of practice

Jesus lord, can I get an amen?  I realize that most teams in the NFL don't use a traditional FB, but I know they always give US fits, and I've always liked using them.  The guy we had for a brief moment in the preseason actually was doing quite well, but then he got a concussion and he was a goner. 

[jrb12711]

41 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said:

Jesus lord, can I get an amen?  I realize that most teams in the NFL don't use a traditional FB, but I know they always give US fits, and I've always liked using them.  The guy we had for a brief moment in the preseason actually was doing quite well, but then he got a concussion and he was a goner. 

The thing is running the ball isn't the problem at all. Chubb's at 100 YPG, 5.3 YPC clip and 2nd in the league to McCaffrey who is the next Le'veon Bell in terms of touches per game right now. I don't see any reason to mess up a good thing, we just need to keep feeding the beast. Can't ask for much better stat line than that through six games.

[SdBacker80]

56 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

We also miss having a true roadgrading FB. May I suggest teaching Garrett how to be one for goalline plays. He's fast enough, big enough, strong enough and athletic enough to actually fill the bill. Got nothing to lose by trying it out during this two weeks of practice

No way.  Bad idea 

Hes  an elite pass rusher.  You don’t screw that up and get his knee blown out on some LB cutting him. 

[jiggins7919]

1 minute ago, jrb12711 said:

The thing is running the ball isn't the problem at all. Chubb's at 100 YPG, 5.3 YPC clip and 2nd in the league to McCaffrey who is the next Le'veon Bell in terms of touches per game right now. I don't see any reason to mess up a good thing, we just need to keep feeding the beast. Can't ask for much better stat line than that through six games.

You're right, BUT...we aren't getting the goal line push, and some of the time Chubb is getting yards DESPITE our line.  We're missing that physicality, and it hurts us.  

[TexasAg1969]

1 minute ago, SdBacker80 said:

No way.  Bad idea 

Hes  an elite pass rusher.  You don’t screw that up and get his knee blown out on some LB cutting him. 

OLs try to cut him and grab him around the neck all the time. Likelihood of knee injury from a straight ahead block on a LB coming through a narrow gap is almost nil. He would roadgrade any of them in the game.

[SdBacker80]

1 minute ago, TexasAg1969 said:

OLs try to cut him and grab him around the neck all the time. Likelihood of knee injury from a straight ahead block on a LB coming through a narrow gap is almost nil. He would roadgrade any of them in the game.

I sign a guy for 300k to lower his head and lose brain cells  before Garrett does that.

we don’t need him in concussion protocol either 

[browns52]

22 hours ago, LondonBrown said:

According to the guy that first called OBJ being traded to the Browns

we have the 2 worse tackles in the nfl....makes sense....

[browns52]

4 hours ago, jiggins7919 said:

You're right, BUT...we aren't getting the goal line push, and some of the time Chubb is getting yards DESPITE our line.  We're missing that physicality, and it hurts us.  

what i have been saying all along...not only do we not have the physicality on the ol....it also exists on the defensive side even more so...god we need some physical db's...they are all finesse db's...everyone of them....starters included....they cannot tackle worth a shit....lb's and dl are not much better either....

[browns52]

5 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

We also miss having a true roadgrading FB. May I suggest teaching Garrett how to be one for goalline plays. He's fast enough, big enough, strong enough and athletic enough to actually fill the bill. Got nothing to lose by trying it out during this two weeks of practice

don't like that idea at all...

[PoeticG]

6 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

We also miss having a true roadgrading FB. May I suggest teaching Garrett how to be one for goalline plays. He's fast enough, big enough, strong enough and athletic enough to actually fill the bill. Got nothing to lose by trying it out during this two weeks of practice

I wouldn't really want to use Garrett as a FB... but maybe Ogunjobi or Avery would work?

 

[tiamat63]

6 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

We also miss having a true roadgrading FB. May I suggest teaching Garrett how to be one for goalline plays. He's fast enough, big enough, strong enough and athletic enough to actually fill the bill. Got nothing to lose by trying it out during this two weeks of practice

.......*blink*

 

 

[gumby73]

50 minutes ago, PoeticG said:

 as a FB... but maybe Ogunjobi or Avery would work?

Shelton Richardson as a Jet had 4 carries, 4 yards & 2 TD's... (how did we get here anyhow? we need a tackle if not 2) 

[bjh2130]

11 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

We also miss having a true roadgrading FB. May I suggest teaching Garrett how to be one for goalline plays. He's fast enough, big enough, strong enough and athletic enough to actually fill the bill. Got nothing to lose by trying it out during this two weeks of practice

How do we miss having a road grading fb? As a previous poster said chubb is 2nd in the league in YPG only to a guy who touches the ball 40 times a game. Who is this true roadgrading fullback we had last year? Or the year prior. The last time we had a full back on the final roster was the year we went 0-16. I sure as hell don't miss that season. I get it I like smashmouth football as much as the next person but what I like most is watching the browns win. Im not gonna romanticize some position just because it takes me back to my younger days. 

[TexasAg1969]

2 minutes ago, bjh2130 said:

How do we miss having a road grading fb? As a previous poster said chubb is 2nd in the league in YPG only to a guy who touches the ball 40 times a game. Who is this true roadgrading fullback we had last year? Or the year prior. The last time we had a running back on the final roster was the year we went 0-16. I sure as hell don't miss that season. I get it I like smashmouth football as much as the next person but what I like most is watching the browns win. Im not gonna romanticize some position just because it takes me back to my younger days. 

Maybe I should have phrased that somewhat differently. We don't miss what we never had, but we certainly could use one.

[jiggins7919]

3 minutes ago, bjh2130 said:

How do we miss having a road grading fb? As a previous poster said chubb is 2nd in the league in YPG only to a guy who touches the ball 40 times a game. Who is this true roadgrading fullback we had last year? Or the year prior. The last time we had a running back on the final roster was the year we went 0-16. I sure as hell don't miss that season. I get it I like smashmouth football as much as the next person but what I like most is watching the browns win. Im not gonna romanticize some position just because it takes me back to my younger days. 

It's a great question and I have your answer. I wish I had exact stats, but my eye test tells me that we completely suck at 3rd and 1. Let me ask you something...when we have 3rd and 1, what do we usually do? I'll give you a hint, it's NOT running the ball. We pass almost every 3rd and short, and we pass SO MUCH near the goal line, too! (ahem, Rams game anyone?). What's this mean? It means we aren't very good at running the ball when the defense KNOWS we're running it, and that's a problem. We have to pull linemen at the goal line...why? Because we can't trust our guys to get push. 

Chubb is excelling DESPITE our team at times. We do him NO favors by running that screen pass 20 times a game. 

[hoorta]

27 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said:

It's a great question and I have your answer. I wish I had exact stats, but my eye test tells me that we completely suck at 3rd and 1. Let me ask you something...when we have 3rd and 1, what do we usually do? I'll give you a hint, it's NOT running the ball. We pass almost every 3rd and short, and we pass SO MUCH near the goal line, too! (ahem, Rams game anyone?). What's this mean? It means we aren't very good at running the ball when the defense KNOWS we're running it, and that's a problem. We have to pull linemen at the goal line...why? Because we can't trust our guys to get push. 

Chubb is excelling DESPITE our team at times. We do him NO favors by running that screen pass 20 times a game. 

Excelling to the point it's f'n stupid for Freddie to not use him more. Like only 11 yards off the lead in rushing league wide. You don't know what Nick can do around the goal line- until you try it more than once Freddy. I saw something where these "young" HCs are going to pass in goal line short a lot more- for whatever reason. It flies in the face of logic though. 

[bjh2130]

1 hour ago, jiggins7919 said:

It's a great question and I have your answer. I wish I had exact stats, but my eye test tells me that we completely suck at 3rd and 1. Let me ask you something...when we have 3rd and 1, what do we usually do? I'll give you a hint, it's NOT running the ball. We pass almost every 3rd and short, and we pass SO MUCH near the goal line, too! (ahem, Rams game anyone?). What's this mean? It means we aren't very good at running the ball when the defense KNOWS we're running it, and that's a problem. We have to pull linemen at the goal line...why? Because we can't trust our guys to get push. 

Chubb is excelling DESPITE our team at times. We do him NO favors by running that screen pass 20 times a game. 

That logic is flawed. We fail at 3rd and 1 because we don't run the ball? Let's try running the ball more on these short yardage situations before we say we can't do it. You could say all we do all those things because we can't pick it up or can't get a push but we all know the line struggles to protect very long yet we still call tons of deep shots. If we're so self aware that we can't run on short yardage that we don't do it why dont the coaches have the same self awareness on calling deep shots? 

[calfoxwc]

I've always been a fan of Kosar's "screw with the defense's minds" approach. It isn't, imho, that we can't run, it's that teams generally do with such a short field, and the defense knows that. Like Kosar liked to throw a bomb on the first offensive play of a game just to mess with em. That is how Baker ended up being able to run the ball in for a TD.

And, the Browns don't have a dominant offensive line vs the best defensive sets to run the ball in the red zone, other teams know that, so you have to change it up. The next time, you fake a pass and hand the ball off. Keep them unsure about what you will do.

Just my goofy opinion.

[Vambo]

15 hours ago, calfoxwc said:

I've always been a fan of Kosar's "screw with the defense's minds" approach. It isn't, imho, that we can't run, it's that teams generally do with such a short field, and the defense knows that. Like Kosar liked to throw a bomb on the first offensive play of a game just to mess with em. That is how Baker ended up being able to run the ball in for a TD.

And, the Browns don't have a dominant offensive line vs the best defensive sets to run the ball in the red zone, other teams know that, so you have to change it up. The next time, you fake a pass and hand the ball off. Keep them unsure about what you will do.

Just my goofy opinion.

Shaquill Griffin knew what was coming against the Browns

https://sports.yahoo.com/seahawks-film-room-shaquill-griffin-231517537.html

1. Tedric Thompson's clutch interception before halftime

  The play: Cleveland faced 2nd-and-8 from Seattle's 10-yard line with 1:36 to play before halftime and a 20-12 lead. Baker Mayfield targeted Jarvis Landry in the right side of the end zone. Shaquill Griffin broke up the pass and Thompson made a diving interception.

The impact: It was at least a 9-point swing as the Seahawks were able to keep the Browns off the scoreboard while also scoring a touchdown themselves prior to halftime. (Seattle missed the 2-point try which is why it was a 9-point swing and not 10.)

The analysis: Griffin has been playing at an extremely high level all season, but this play might have been his finest work through six games.

"I remember the way he lined up – his actual split kind of gave up what he was going to do – or at least I felt he was going to do that," Griffin said. "He was tight to the numbers. You'll see prior to the play I was telling Ted(ric) that he was running that route. I was telling Ted, ‘He's coming this side, he's coming this side. Right to you, right to you.'"

Following the snap, Griffin opened his hips and gave up some cushion as Landry sprinted towards the goal line.

"I broke as soon as he broke and went inside," Griffin said. "I told myself to undercut (the pass) and try to go get it myself."

Both Griffin and Landry both got a piece of the football. Thompson, who was responsible for protecting the post on that particular play, was there to make the opportunistic interception for the second-straight week.

"It popped into the air, and Ted, knowing it was coming to him already, he knew just to be there in the area," Griffin said.

Griffin's confidence has gotten to the point where he's excelling at diagnosing plays pre-snap. His weekly film study proved to be especially worthwhile against Cleveland.

[Tour2ma]

On 10/16/2019 at 5:58 AM, gumby73 said:

WAit!! what...You broke your Leg? 🤕 or Trent playing on a broken leg?    Wrong Club?  or       bad uphill Tee lie? Golf Cart gone Wild?  

lol.... none of the above...

 

Excited Granddaughter... Grandpa feelin' his oats...

concrete ramp to Universal's M.I.B. "ride"...

Tangled feet... ramp and hip meet...

Gramps came up "craps" as femur snaps.

Ambulance to ORMC with surgery refusing to stay away... a much longer implant spike less than a day away.

 

Home today... feelin' OK....... ish....

[TexasAg1969]

👨‍⚖️

10 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

lol.... none of the above...

 

Excited Granddaughter... Grandpa feelin' his oats...

concrete ramp to Universal's M.I.B. "ride"...

Tangled feet... ramp and hip meet...

Gramps came up "craps" as femur snaps.

Ambulance to ORMC with surgery refusing to stay away... a much longer implant spike less than a day away.

 

Home today... feelin' OK....... ish....

We're headed to Orlando for a 5 night stay with all kids/grandkids during Thanksgiving break. I will be sure to look for the broken femur ride. Sounds like you really need this man though.👍👨‍⚖️🤑

 

[jiggins7919]

I hope we don't make this trade. People need to remember that our OL wasn't performing great last year and Baker was getting killed. Remember we were all worried he wasn't going to last? Then the coaching change and Baker couldn't be touched the rest of the year, and this too happened after the bye week. 

This can happen again. Are we going to make SOME changes? Yes, Dorsey made that pretty damn clear in the way he spoke about the tackles. Don't be surprised to see Kendall Lamm get a shot at tackle and Wyatt Tellar will definitely replace Kush. You may even see two new tackles, with McCray joining Lamm. What kills Dorsey and the coaching staff are the penalties. That last holding call effectively lost us the game. Instead of 2nd and 2, it was 1st and 20, and you know what happened next. It's a common theme with Robinson, and he NEVER gets the benefit of the doubt. The refs really could've let that one go, but that's how it's gone this year. 

For some reason I'm REALLY looking forward to the Patriots game. I just get the feeling that our team is on the verge of bursting out, and I'm not one to normally shout out optimistic proclamations. Baker has literally missed almost every single red zone read, and when he DID make the correct decision, it's been picked off. That WON'T continue to happen, and he's going to get healthy and refocus in the coming days. Against the Patriots, we'll need to use the pass to set up the run, and I think we will do just that. Seals-Jones will score again, as will Chubb (pass + rush), Landry, and a deep OBJ TD. 

Browns win 34 to 23. 

[jiggins7919]

1 minute ago, jiggins7919 said:

I hope we don't make this trade. People need to remember that our OL wasn't performing great last year and Baker was getting killed. Remember we were all worried he wasn't going to last? Then the coaching change and Baker couldn't be touched the rest of the year, and this too happened after the bye week. 

This can happen again. Are we going to make SOME changes? Yes, Dorsey made that pretty damn clear in the way he spoke about the tackles. Don't be surprised to see Kendall Lamm get a shot at tackle and Wyatt Tellar will definitely replace Kush. You may even see two new tackles, with McCray joining Lamm. What kills Dorsey and the coaching staff are the penalties. That last holding call effectively lost us the game. Instead of 2nd and 2, it was 1st and 20, and you know what happened next. It's a common theme with Robinson, and he NEVER gets the benefit of the doubt. The refs really could've let that one go, but that's how it's gone this year. Also, our staff is very excited about Drew Forbes, and he suffered that awful injury in the preseason JUST as he was skyrocketing up the depth chart. Luckily for him, it wasn't too serious, and he should be ready week 9. He's built like a tackle with freakish ability. 

For some reason I'm REALLY looking forward to the Patriots game. I just get the feeling that our team is on the verge of bursting out, and I'm not one to normally shout out optimistic proclamations. Baker has literally missed almost every single red zone read, and when he DID make the correct decision, it's been picked off. That WON'T continue to happen, and he's going to get healthy and refocus in the coming days. Against the Patriots, we'll need to use the pass to set up the run, and I think we will do just that. Seals-Jones will score again, as will Chubb (pass + rush), Landry, and a deep OBJ TD. 

Browns win 34 to 23. 

 

[TexasAg1969]

45 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said:

For some reason I'm REALLY looking forward to the Patriots game. I just get the feeling that our team is on the verge of bursting out, and I'm not one to normally shout out optimistic proclamations. Baker has literally missed almost every single red zone read, and when he DID make the correct decision, it's been picked off. That WON'T continue to happen, and he's going to get healthy and refocus in the coming days. Against the Patriots, we'll need to use the pass to set up the run, and I think we will do just that. Seals-Jones will score again, as will Chubb (pass + rush), Landry, and a deep OBJ TD. 

Browns win 34 to 23. 

Got a new book title for ya j. The Decline and Fall of the jiggins Hope Machine. LOL🤣

[jiggins7919]

2 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Got a new book title for ya j. The Decline and Fall of the jiggins Hope Machine. LOL🤣

LOL, I know, I know. I literally just watched the Seahawks game again, and if you think it becomes easier to digest the more you watch it, I've got bad news for you. 

Saying that, the game left me feeling like we should have won, no questions asked. We should have beaten the best team in the league, or one of them. And to be honest, the game probably shouldn't have been that close. What's amazing to me is our inexplicable knack for completely shitting the sheets when we need a play. It's uncanny! For example, let's look at the Seahawks' 3rd quarter touchdown with around 6 minutes to go I think. This is the score where Russell has all day to find someone, and eventually fires it over the middle to a receiver. Why am I bringing this up? Because it was 3rd down. We stonewalled them the previous two plays, and we needed one more play. We needed our star to make a play. 

As been the narrative much of the year, we failed to make said play. Myles Garrett got COMPLETELY shutdown, as did our other DE. What's worse? They were both blocked by one person. This was no quick release pass play, had Myles beaten his guy just BARELY, Russell would have thrown out out of bounds like he always does. 

But that's been the microcosm of the season, hasn't it? When you watch good teams win, their stars make plays when their team needs them. We do the opposite of that, and I can't figure it out. Just one strip sack. Just one interception. Just one amazing catch. Just....SOMETHING when we need it the most. Myles Garrett was blocked by one guy who is not very good, and blocked for a long time. We needed more. 

[TexasAg1969]

28 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said:

LOL, I know, I know. I literally just watched the Seahawks game again, and if you think it becomes easier to digest the more you watch it, I've got bad news for you. 

Saying that, the game left me feeling like we should have won, no questions asked. We should have beaten the best team in the league, or one of them. And to be honest, the game probably shouldn't have been that close. What's amazing to me is our inexplicable knack for completely shitting the sheets when we need a play. It's uncanny! For example, let's look at the Seahawks' 3rd quarter touchdown with around 6 minutes to go I think. This is the score where Russell has all day to find someone, and eventually fires it over the middle to a receiver. Why am I bringing this up? Because it was 3rd down. We stonewalled them the previous two plays, and we needed one more play. We needed our star to make a play. 

As been the narrative much of the year, we failed to make said play. Myles Garrett got COMPLETELY shutdown, as did our other DE. What's worse? They were both blocked by one person. This was no quick release pass play, had Myles beaten his guy just BARELY, Russell would have thrown out out of bounds like he always does. 

But that's been the microcosm of the season, hasn't it? When you watch good teams win, their stars make plays when their team needs them. We do the opposite of that, and I can't figure it out. Just one strip sack. Just one interception. Just one amazing catch. Just....SOMETHING when we need it the most. Myles Garrett was blocked by one guy who is not very good, and blocked for a long time. We needed more. 

Actually that was the most pressure I have ever seen on Wilson and the most times I have seen him throw it away to avoid the sack. Plus Myles sacked him twice which is more than happens to Wilson by a whole team in several games combined. I really fault the offense for screwing the pooch once again at key times, especially the INT just before the half that flipped the entire game.

[jiggins7919]

Just now, TexasAg1969 said:

Actually that was the most pressure I have ever seen on Wilson and the most times I have seen him throw it away to avoid the sack. Plus Myles sacked him twice which is more than happens to Wilson by a whole team in several games combined. I really fault the offense for screwing the pooch once again at key times, especially the INT just before the half that flipped the entire game.

I get it, I really do, and for the most part, you're right. We got a lot of pressure on him. I was simply saying there was a big play, on 3rd down, and our monster DE (both of them) got totally shut down when we needed them. I was using it as an example of how our stars don't shine when we need them the most. 

And you're right again, our offense totally shit the bed with that interception, as did our coach. But I'll argue that our defense should not give up a touchdown drive with 1:30 to go in the half. 

[Tour2ma]

4 hours ago, jiggins7919 said:

For some reason I'm REALLY looking forward to the Patriots game.

Me, too... any residual problem(s) we have should become very clear.