2021 'Who are you watching?' NFL prospect thread.

[tiamat63]

So I'm working on another 10min cut-up of Alim McNeil vs Va Tech and I really can't stop gushing. Despite the fact the majority of this kids snaps from come from a classic heads-up nose, he still manages to consistently make plays well outside of the realm of his responsibility.  

I don't care what website or publication has them in rankings - Christian Barmore does have the higher ceiling.  But the better football player as of today is Alim McNeil, IMHO.

[TexasAg1969]

2 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

So I'm working on another 10min cut-up of Alim McNeil vs Va Tech and I really can't stop gushing. Despite the fact the majority of this kids snaps from come from a classic heads-up nose, he still manages to consistently make plays well outside of the realm of his responsibility.  

I don't care what website or publication has them in rankings - Christian Barmore does have the higher ceiling.  But the better football player as of today is Alim McNeil, IMHO.

I still take Barmore for the long term. He is a powerful guy who can learn from Jackson on a daily basis how it's done.

[SdBacker80]

13 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

I still take Barmore for the long term. He is a powerful guy who can learn from Jackson on a daily basis how it's done.

Way too much 2/3/4 round talent at IDL to take Barmore. 

[calfoxwc]

Mike Strachan, WR, Charleston. Grade: 6th Round

Height: 6’4”. Weight: 225 lbs.

track athlete, school 400 meter record holder...

very raw, Div II.

5th/6th round ?

[TexasAg1969]

12 hours ago, SdBacker80 said:

Way too much 2/3/4 round talent at IDL to take Barmore. 

So we have the makings of a Bama IDL passover a la Bama RB passover of Derrick Henry? So Brownsian!😛😂

[tiamat63]

20 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

So we have the makings of a Bama IDL passover a la Bama RB passover of Derrick Henry? So Brownsian!😛😂

Henry was passed over by 1 RB - Zeke.  That's it.  You make it sound like he's Terrell Davis.

[tiamat63]

Unless I missed it, I'm still anxiously awaiting to hear some IOL value picks from @Tour2ma

[TexasAg1969]

1 hour ago, tiamat63 said:

Henry was passed over by 1 RB - Zeke.  That's it.  You make it sound like he's Terrell Davis.

Browns passed him over for Coleman (now out of the league) and Ogbah. Great choices there. That is the kind of Passover the Browns have specialized in until Garrett & Baker. We even took a chance that Chubb might get lifted before us when we took Corbett two picks prior. Head scratcher. I was yelling at the TV, "Take Chubb dummies, take Chubb!" And then we take an unknown OL from the Mountain West instead of a high quality SEC RB. I went ballistic until they got him at #35.

And the comparison for Henry is closer to 14th overall pick in 1995 Eddie George if you want a RB listed that is a similar type back.

However if Henry had been a Brown he actually might have saved Huey from his goofball short yardage calls inside the 5, so at least there is that compensation.😂

[The Gipper]

17 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Browns passed him over for Coleman (now out of the league) and Ogbah. Great choices there. That is the kind of Passover the Browns have specialized in until Garrett & Baker. We even took a chance that Chubb might get lifted before us when we took Corbett two picks prior. Head scratcher. I was yelling at the TV, "Take Chubb dummies, take Chubb!" And then we take an unknown OL from the Mountain West instead of a high quality SEC RB. I went ballistic until they got him at #35.

And the comparison for Henry is closer to 14th overall pick in 1995 Eddie George if you want a RB listed that is a similar type back.

However if Henry had been a Brown he actually might have saved Huey from his goofball short yardage calls inside the 5, so at least there is that compensation.😂

I suspect that Henry wasn’t the only decent player that we passed over when we took Coleman and Ogbah   that year. So no real need to focus in on him particularly. We ended up getting someone just as good. But certainly those were not good draft picks. Which has been the bane of this franchise ever since at least 1999 if not before. Maybe since 1978.

[tiamat63]

34 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Browns passed him over for Coleman (now out of the league) and Ogbah. Great choices there. That is the kind of Passover the Browns have specialized in until Garrett & Baker. We even took a chance that Chubb might get lifted before us when we took Corbett two picks prior. Head scratcher. I was yelling at the TV, "Take Chubb dummies, take Chubb!" And then we take an unknown OL from the Mountain West instead of a high quality SEC RB. I went ballistic until they got him at #35.

And the comparison for Henry is closer to 14th overall pick in 1995 Eddie George if you want a RB listed that is a similar type back.

However if Henry had been a Brown he actually might have saved Huey from his goofball short yardage calls inside the 5, so at least there is that compensation.😂

So the Browns passed over a franchise RB, for what they felt at the time, was a franchise WR. 

Sorry, but I make that move 10 of 10 times.  And since Henry was a 2nd round pick, a more apt comparison in this case would be - who would you take... Michael Thomas or Derrick Henry?

The answer to that one is pretty easy.

[The Gipper]

Question:    Might the Browns be looking for a decent  punt and  Kickoff return man  this year in the draft.  I think it is fair to say that we have not really had a decent one of those since Travis Benjamin  was here....so, quite a number of years.     Or, is there anyone on this team that anyone think could be really good at handling those jobs.  (I am not seeing it).  

I know it is a "minor"  position,   but it could become a major asset if we really had one.   After all, think about what having a Josh Cribbs and an Eric Metcalf meant for us.  

Who is Kent State's  QB?    They seem to end up being really good at other positions. 

[The Gipper]

Browns 2020  Kick and Punt return stats.  Not impressive IMO.  

Kick & Punt Returns

 

 

				Games		Punt Returns					Kick Returns
No.	Player	Age	Pos	G	GS	Ret	Yds	TD	Lng	Y/R	Rt	Yds	TD	Lng	Y/Rt	APYd
	Team Total	25.6		16		24	115	0	13	4.8	36	795	0	43	22.1	7160
	Opp Total			16		25	229	0		9.2	38	998	1		26.3
11	Donovan Peoples-Jones	21		12	2	18	77	0	13	4.3	18	379	0	33	21.1	760
30	D'Ernest Johnson	24		16	0	3	13	0	10	4.3	14	351	0	43	25.1	544
19	Jojo Natson	26		3	0	3	25	0	13	8.3	1	31	0	31	31.0	59
25	Dontrell Hilliard	25		5	0						2	21	0	13	10.5	71
31	Andy Janovich	27		14	3						1	13	0	13	13.0	30

 

I mean, is Natson coming back supposed to vastly improve us in this department? 

[SdBacker80]

21 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

Browns 2020  Kick and Punt return stats.  Not impressive IMO.  

Kick & Punt Returns

 

 

				Games		Punt Returns					Kick Returns
No.	Player	Age	Pos	G	GS	Ret	Yds	TD	Lng	Y/R	Rt	Yds	TD	Lng	Y/Rt	APYd
	Team Total	25.6		16		24	115	0	13	4.8	36	795	0	43	22.1	7160
	Opp Total			16		25	229	0		9.2	38	998	1		26.3
11	Donovan Peoples-Jones	21		12	2	18	77	0	13	4.3	18	379	0	33	21.1	760
30	D'Ernest Johnson	24		16	0	3	13	0	10	4.3	14	351	0	43	25.1	544
19	Jojo Natson	26		3	0	3	25	0	13	8.3	1	31	0	31	31.0	59
25	Dontrell Hilliard	25		5	0						2	21	0	13	10.5	71
31	Andy Janovich	27		14	3						1	13	0	13	13.0	30

 

I mean, is Natson coming back supposed to vastly improve us in this department? 

Kickoff return is nearly an obsolete skill set with the way touchbacks happen nowadays.  

I was happy with the way DPJ secured punts.  1st job is always secure (catch it) and hang onto it most importantly we keep the ball but also we don’t give up field position

[The Gipper]

1 hour ago, SdBacker80 said:

Kickoff return is nearly an obsolete skill set with the way touchbacks happen nowadays.  

I was happy with the way DPJ secured punts.  1st job is always secure (catch it) and hang onto it most importantly we keep the ball but also we don’t give up field position

Yes,  true.  The league hates what was one of the most exciting plays in football.    But in my opinion, their concerns over safety associated with kickoffs is way overblown. 

And, sure.  Catching the punt is better than muffing it....but I am talking about getting someone who is a threat to take the ball back all the way....after he secures it. 

[SdBacker80]

2 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

Yes,  true.  The league hates what was one of the most exciting plays in football.    But in my opinion, their concerns over safety associated with kickoffs is way overblown. 

And, sure.  Catching the punt is better than muffing it....but I am talking about getting someone who is a threat to take the ball back all the way....after he secures it. 

Believe it is Luxury at this point.  Browns 5,10,15, 20 years ago it was more of necessity as a source of offense because we didn’t have the luxury of an actual pass/run score points offense.

Times are changing 

[tiamat63]

Punt return > kick return

[Tour2ma]

11 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

Unless I missed it, I'm still anxiously awaiting to hear some IOL value picks from @Tour2ma

lol... didn't do a lot of work on OL since we're pretty well set, but...

Vast majority of the late round IOLs are not ZBS fits, but there are a couple exceptions...

• Pitt kid... Morrissey... looks like best fit in 2nd half of Day 3, but he's basically a 2021 version of Nick Harris.
• Middle Tennessee's Robert Jones could be worth a 6th round flyer... played OT, and dominated lesser competition, he moves reasonably well, but is definitely moving inside. Hard to know when he will go in Day 3 tho. 5th round is not out of the question.
• Want to spend more? Stanford's Drew Dallman likely costs you a 4th. Good technician, but needs to hit the weight room.... hard.

OTs (since you didn't ask )?

If we trade down, then I think tu's Cosmi has to be considered late-1st/early 2nd. Instant backup everywhere except Center and brings cheap, cap-pinch value to our right side. That said... I doubt we go there, so in the economy class...

• tsun's Jalen Mayfield... OK not exactly ECON, but closer. Again he brings 4-position versatility and great value. Might be there late 2nd.
• Cheaper? Western Michigan's Jaylon Moore. Really fluid mover, and compact enough to handle OG with some work. Small school discount should land him in the 6th.
• Even cheaper? Iowa's Alaric Jackson... looked at him last year when it was believed he'd declare. For some reason he's fallen this year (maybe age?). Should be there very late... possible UDFA. Likely only an OT.

[Unsympathetic]

48 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

lol... didn't do a lot of work on OL since we're pretty well set

Not after 2021 we're not.. no re-signing of Teller and cutting Tretter/starting Harris to save 2+8 salary.  Sure, they could go another direction but.. late-round IOL is a lot more probable to become a productive/excellent starter than late-round WR.  So we need both a future RG starter and quality backups at both spots.  

[Tour2ma]

 

2 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

Not after 2021 we're not.. no re-signing of Teller and cutting Tretter/starting Harris to save 2+8 salary.  Sure, they could go another direction but.. late-round IOL is a lot more probable to become a productive/excellent starter than late-round WR.  So we need both a future RG starter and quality backups at both spots.  

Well... it's not as if I did not give any names.

[tiamat63]

10 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

lol... didn't do a lot of work on OL since we're pretty well set, but...

Vast majority of the late round IOLs are not ZBS fits, but there are a couple exceptions...

• Pitt kid... Morrissey... looks like best fit in 2nd half of Day 3, but he's basically a 2021 version of Nick Harris.
• Middle Tennessee's Robert Jones could be worth a 6th round flyer... played OT, and dominated lesser competition, he moves reasonably well, but is definitely moving inside. Hard to know when he will go in Day 3 tho. 5th round is not out of the question.
• Want to spend more? Stanford's Drew Dallman likely costs you a 4th. Good technician, but needs to hit the weight room.... hard.

OTs (since you didn't ask )?

If we trade down, then I think tu's Cosmi has to be considered late-1st/early 2nd. Instant backup everywhere except Center and brings cheap, cap-pinch value to our right side. That said... I doubt we go there, so in the economy class...

• tsun's Jalen Mayfield... OK not exactly ECON, but closer. Again he brings 4-position versatility and great value. Might be there late 2nd.
• Cheaper? Western Michigan's Jaylon Moore. Really fluid mover, and compact enough to handle OG with some work. Small school discount should land him in the 6th.
• Even cheaper? Iowa's Alaric Jackson... looked at him last year when it was believed he'd declare. For some reason he's fallen this year (maybe age?). Should be there very late... possible UDFA. Likely only an OT.

The Mayfield and Jackson names standout, being that they're players I've seen.

Appreciate the Intel buddy. Your Oline work is unmatched.

[darren15]

If Browns drafted Mayfield I just hope the coaching staff dont get them mixed up and he starts at QB

[The Gipper]

35 minutes ago, darren15 said:

If Browns drafted Mayfield I just hope the coaching staff dont get them mixed up and he starts at QB

Baker/Jalen .....one white, one black.  yea I can see how they could be confused.

By the way,  a little etymology:   As I understand it, the now ubiquitous  name of "Jalen"  for younger African Americans was  created by the mother of  Jalen Rose,  the Michigan Fab 5  basketball player.  It was an amalgamation of the names of his  grandfathers whose names  were  James and Leonard.  Ergo...Jalen.  

What would be your name if your parents combined  your grandfathers name to create a new name?   Mine would be  JaWill   or  WillJa.  (James and William).  

Perhaps more interesting would be if they did that for one of my sisters (I have 4)  it would be   EstLu.  

[Tour2ma]

1 hour ago, tiamat63 said:

Appreciate the Intel buddy. Your Oline work is unmatched.

Well.... I am almost 6' tall.

Lousy 1/4" shy... at my peak.

 

In H.S. I did not want to play OG... cause I wanted to hit people. Then I learned OGs did. Nothing beats ear-holing a DL that doesn't see you pulling his way.

Well... maybe blindsiding a QB on a blitz... or catching a WR coming across the middle... but my distinct lack of footspeed did not afford me as many opportunities for these.

 

I've loved the OL ever since.

Thanks... nice to be able to pay for my DB info in some fashion.

[tiamat63]

2 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

Well.... I am almost 6' tall.

Lousy 1/4" shy... at my peak.

 

In H.S. I did not want to play OG... cause I wanted to hit people. Then I learned OGs did. Nothing beats ear-holing a DL that doesn't see you pulling his way.

Well... maybe blindsiding a QB on a blitz... or catching a WR coming across the middle... but my distinct lack of footspeed did not afford me as many opportunities for these.

 

I've loved the OL ever since.

Thanks... nice to be able to pay for my DB info in some fashion.

Oh bitch you made it sound like you're 6"5 with your height supremacy. Turns out you're a 1/4in taller than me. 

 

Also catching anyone over the middle when I have a step just gives me butterflies.

[Tour2ma]

lol.... meanwhile back at the thread...

 

New Edge has caught my attention late... Pitts' Rashad Weaver.

Kid has had injury issues, but he measured close to, if not, off-the-proverbial chart.

Forget the 40 and focus on the 10-yd split, shuttle and 3-cone.

Should see Day 3.

[tiamat63]

33 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

lol.... meanwhile back at the thread...

 

New Edge has caught my attention late... Pitts' Rashad Weaver.

Kid has had injury issues, but he measured close to, if not, off-the-proverbial chart.

Forget the 40 and focus on the 10-yd split, shuttle and 3-cone.

Should see Day 3.

Is that the #17 kid that I mentioned when I was watching Jones?  If so, kid looked the part.

[The Gipper]

1 hour ago, Tour2ma said:

Well.... I am almost 6' tall.

Lousy 1/4" shy... at my peak.

 

In H.S. I did not want to play OG... cause I wanted to hit people. Then I learned OGs did. Nothing beats ear-holing a DL that doesn't see you pulling his way.

Well... maybe blindsiding a QB on a blitz... or catching a WR coming across the middle... but my distinct lack of footspeed did not afford me as many opportunities for these.

 

I've loved the OL ever since.

Thanks... nice to be able to pay for my DB info in some fashion.

It was much better to play centerfield as I did.  The only real  contact I had was when I kind of whiffed on a fly ball  that tipped the end of my glove and then struck me square on the forehead.

[tiamat63]

Who was it on here that mentioned Jaelan Phillips is a similar mold to TJ and JJ Watt?

If so, I see the "why" behind the comparison.  But it mostly has to do with how Phillips is used in Miami's system.   He looks, physically speaking, like Dion Jordan.    But his play on tape is infinitely better than what that sure-fire bust showed.    But how Miami moves him around the formation is the Watt thing - he'll play a lot of base end and then kick in to a more 3 or 4 tech when The U wants to switch up their looks on obvious passing downs.  

Early thoughts - hands and feet show a nice sync in pass rush.  Active hands/arms to keep himself clean of potential blockers and doesn't let IOL or OT's get into his chest.  That's the most promising thing I love seeing any young lineman have.

[MLD Woody]

Hey now, you're both tall on the inside guys. It's ok. 

[MLD Woody]

I don't think Jalen Mayfield will be there at the end of the 2nd round