ballpeen

58 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

I guess the longterm silver lining is if this is true, and Chubb and Watson aren't compatible (pretty sure Chubb played in a Pro-Style Traditional offense at Georgia) that finding a RB in the draft that is used to playing in a shotgun, read/option offense won't be hard. 

Georgia was a pro style offense.

Let me be clear.  It's not so much that Nick can't play that way.  It just seems he preferred not.  I think the biggest discomfort level is Watson playing under center.  I think he likes to start processing the reads as soon as he touches the ball and not lose the time it takes for him to turn and get in to his set.

15 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

 There is some cause for a degree of excitement about the defense.  Believe me, of all people here, I'm the most appreciative of what they've done. 

 That said, let's be realistic too. We've faced several bottom dwelling offenses with a common theme - weakness up front.   The Ravens present a bit of a step up.  But the good news is, the defenses that have had the most success against them structure a lot of what they do based on 5 man rushes.  Something Schwartz has been favoring the last 3 weeks.   Only drawback is that you can't just scream into gaps now, with Lamar you have to be mindful of him taking off in a heartbeat.  

 But the matchup on paper, both the Browns offense AND defense, likely makes them early favorites.

No doubt we will have to have somebody a good portion of the time acting as a spy on Jackson.  That or the ends will have to subdue a bit and play some contain of the edge.

On 9/25/2023 at 7:09 PM, Dutch Oven said:

I'd be curious to know if yesterday was  more of the lightbulb going off for Watson or if Stefanski is doing a better job of matching what Watson does well with the plays/schemes continuing to evolve. Probably both.

Maybe both.  I think some is due to Stefanski not trying to match Cubb';s game to Watson';s game, or the opposite.  Watson doesn't like to work under center and Chubb likes the QB under center.

No right or wrong with either, but is is what it is.

On 9/25/2023 at 7:38 PM, Kvoethe said:

Chubb is not a run from the gun kinda back.  He does better then the Qb is under center.  

I know.  I have said that.  Watson will be a better QB without Chubb than if Chubb is in the game.  I love Nick Chubb the player.  He is everything you want.  I have heard 100 cases in the Cedartown courthouse annex.it was part of my territory for 10 years .It's part of my life..but, it is what it is, Nick and Watson don't play compatible football.

On 9/25/2023 at 9:49 PM, Orion said:

Ford had 10 carries for 18 yards (with a 9 yard long...so he had 9 other carries for 9 yards).  And early on he dropped a desperation, save-the-play pass by Watson...which would've been an easy catch for my 9 yr old grandson.

In Ford's  defense, the Titans are tough to run on and none of our RB's did much better.  But Hunt made a nice catch of a high pass on a middle screen and followed his blockers nicely to convert a 3rd down late in the game.  

So, it reads like I'm down on Ford...when in reality I'm not.  I just don't see him as a proven commodity...and I see Hunt as a league leading rusher with experience in the league. 

Ford's been here all of TC & preseason, although he didn't really play in any preseason games he's earned his spot in the backfield in Chubbs absence.  I just have more trust in Hunt.

I am not saying Ford is a proven commodity.  I am just saying he is the lead back and should be for a while.

Hunt was a FA for a long time.  Nobody signed him.  I don't buy this idea he was just waiting on us to sign.  If he had any kind of decent offer, he would have signed.  He is a football player.  Where else is he going to make $800,000 a year or whatever his minimum might be?

I do like Hunt.  he will be a good back with Watson at QB where I don't think Chubb was.  Hunt is a good stand a take the handoff back where Chubb need a running start so to speak.

We drafted Ford to end up the lead back....the time is here.  No doubt it will take several games to gain the confidence...then we find out.   As you said, the Titans are as good against the run as we are, the raves are tough, and so are the Niners.  I could take a while, then we find out if he is the guy or not.

22 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

The Redskins put up 72 in 1966 when they beat the Giants 72-41. 

Thank you.  I was going to say something similar.

Watson looked real good.

The big reason was he played out of the gun a high percentage of the time.  That is his comfort level.

This may not be popular around here, but Watson will probably play better without Chubb as the back.  Chubb and Watson don't play compatible football.  Chubb likes his QB under center and Watson likes the gun. 

Ford is the lead back and should be.  He played well. 

16 minutes ago, Orion said:

Well, back then the starters actually played in the preseason games so there was a better chemistry already groomed before the season started.  Now that's happening in the first month of the season.

Not only that, free agency was different back then.  Teams could protect maybe 35 players.  You didn't have as manytop players changing teams which also lead to continuity.

Back then I weighed a lot less, hadn't lost hair, and felt pretty good.  But, that was back then...lol

Just a few thoughts on the above posts.

First, i think you blow way out of proportion exactly what Depo might have to do with the gameplan.  I don't think Depo sits there with a red pen like a teacher crossing out this, this, and this and telling them to insert this, this, and this.

Plus, reporting to them on Friday is way late to change a game plan since the plan has already been communicated and practiced by the team.

Art Howe?  I am sure there was resistance.  That was what, 25-30 years ago?  It was a new concept then.  He was an old time baseball guy.   I am not sure using Art Howe is some sort of proof since every team uses the analytic process today and Art Howes method as been buried for 15  or so years now.

This isn't a dig at anybody, so don't take my comment personal, but I think we have a lot of posters stuck in the past and they aren't paying attention to what is happening in sports across the board.

On another board i got ripped maybe 15-20 years ago when I said the NFL was headed to a spread type RPO system.  My proof was for people to go to any HS football game and that is all teams were running.  In turn the colleges had to do that.  In the end, the NFL was going to have to change.  Well, here we are.  Look at the QB's of today v the QB's of 10 years ago.  The change has happened.

JMO

And McGahee's was while still in college...bowl game.  Nick has already had a serious injury to that knee.  I don't know how many times you can repair a knee, but it can't be unlimited.  Next year is Nicks last year on the contact.  If he is medically clear we can cut him or play him.  If not, we can IR him for the year and pay him around $12 mil or try to work out an injury settlement and release him.

Either way, I seriously doubt Nick plays for the Browns again.  Maybe not for anybody.  I was going to say probably, but didn't want to do that.

As for Watson, no doubt it is best if he starts playing like a top 10 QB.  If not, we took a shot and it didn't work out.  I wouldn't say it was a bad bet when we made it.  People may not have liked us signing him, but nobody can seriously say they ever doubted his skill level based on what he had done in the NFL before.

I do know that if we fire Berry or Stefanski, I doubt I renew my season tickets.  I might if we keep Schwartz and bring in a full spread O type coordinator.  Watson played it well at Clemson and in Houston.  If that is all he can play well, then we need to play him in that.

Just now, Orion said:

Detroit wasn't any good during his tenure.  A breakaway run or two per game didn't help them much.  The rest of the time they punted.  I'd actually rather have the consistent yards that Chubb gave us over Sanders.  But that's just me.

I don't disagree, but just like Sanders, Chubb isn't playing football this season.  But no doubt that sanders had a lot of 1-2 yard carries.  You just had to keep handing him the ball, waiting for that 60 yard run.

4 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Never forget, the Kareem will rise to the top. 

 

 

 

 

 

He very well might.  Ford might do the same.  Nobody knows at this point.  Heck, both might end up sucking ass.

I like Hunt as well, but he did lose a step last season.  He is good, but isn't going to carry a team.

I agree with something you said.  Browns fans are pretty good and not wanting to be impressed.  lol

The reality is Chubb is done for this year for sure, and there is a good chance for good.  He is like Joe Thomas, you aren't  going to replace the guy.  As fans, we have to move on and accept whatever the replacement can give because for many, no matter what the player brings it just isn't going to be good enough.

34 minutes ago, Flugel said:

It can't hurt to try that idea.  Even though there's 2 pretty good reasons named Robinson & Allgeier that he's now 3rd on Atlanta's depth chart - he's proven he can score from anywhere on the field as a Return Specialist, RB or WR.  

If not, Jerome Ford rushed for 106 yards in his first opportunity with significant action.  Even so, that was only in about 2.5 quarters of action.  On that long run, he outran a lot of guys with good pursuit angles on him and the only way he was going to get caught - was a Safety that was already back deep diving/hoping that was a better option than what all others failed to do. 

I can see Hunt and Ford giving us a Thunder and Lightning type of 1-2 punch.  Ford is still playing on a rookie salary cap restricted contract as a 2nd year player on a team with a salary cap that has to be about ready to suffocate in the very near future.

We might have cap problems, but we clear space this go around.

We will probably jettison Amari after this season.  We do have to hope at least one of Tillman or Moore balls out.  Wo do have a few vets like Bitonio we probably aren't going to extend any.

But at any rate, the loss of 1st rounders may start to hurt over the next few seasons.  Those are the guys that by year 3-4 have turned in to very good players.  On the flip side, berry has done a pretty good job with the 2nd through 4th round to get at least pretty good players, but it will be a good thing to start getting 1st rounders again after this next draft.

The key is that Watson gets his mojo back and starts playing.  If that doesn't happen, then we have problems because we are back to looking for a QB unless the rookie isn't just a mirage and actually turns in to a real deal player.  That said, we won't even think about moving from Watson for another 2 years.

5 hours ago, hoorta said:

Hunt is only 27, and still has a lot of tread on the tires. Guys usually don't start "losing a step" until they're well into their 30s.  He primarily was unsigned because the RB market tanked, and had (justifiably) a high asking price. 

Let me do a nickers for you 'peen. Ford is mediocre. Sucks. Cheap backup to Chubb that was only going to see limited time. Has all the power of an e-bike. Take away his big run, he averaged 2.5 yards a carry against the Steelers.  

I am not comparing the two, rather simply to point out you can't take away runs.  If you took away long runs from Barry Sanders, he would be a pretty average back.

6 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Excellent! If he fills in as #1 RB he may actually work better than when he was #2 to Nick. More carries with more opportunities like he had in KC. But we know he works well inside the opponents 10, so even as #2 that works. He sniffs out goal lines if we just play him that way and not get too f'n cute.

I think the team is going to ride Ford as the #1 unless he shows he isn't.  Either way, I could see a fairly even split in carries.

3 hours ago, Flugel said:

  @ballpeen mentioned he didn't like way he saw the Browns trying to use him the other day.  I'm not sure they have the slightest idea on how they can use their receivers a lot better than they choose to.

Yep, I think Moore had another whopping 35 yard game.  Something isn't working.  It seems all of the passes head to the boundary.  I don't know if that is by design or if Watson just won't throw over the middle.

It's only 2 games in to the season, so I am not going to start pointing fingers, but I will say that something in the passing game just isn't clicking, and they better figure it out, especially since Chubb is out for the season, if not forever.

3 hours ago, Flugel said:

 

 

Just now, Dutch Oven said:

Nick Chubb covered up a lot of Stefanski's sins.

He's gone for the year. I have no doubt of that.

And with that, I have no doubt Stefanski will be gone after this season. He has no idea what to do with Watson WITH Chubb. Without him? 

That was the knee blown out in college.   He's done, and not just for the season.

6 minutes ago, Flugel said:

Forget the no call - this PASSING GAME failed miserably.

 

Yep.  A total zilch.

Thew QB played poorly and Moore...36 yards....maybe coaching, i don't know.

I agree.  I think we probably should, but back to your original question, I am hard pressed to name a game we don't need to win.

Two wins is the start of a streak.  Then we have a chance to win 3 in a row.  Good teams consistently stack 2-3 wins over the course of the season.

If we dick around and win one, lose one, that isn't going to do anything.

8 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

I wouldn't call 7 targets "Schwartz gadget". Especially in a rain soaked week 1. 

Miami Dolphins on line 1, I was told they'd like a word with you. 

Think what you want.  Bubble screen all you want.  I'd rather see the pass moving more than a yard past the LOS.  I think Moore gained around 40 yards and 1 went for 30 or so yards.

That isn't all that great IMO, but it is a start.  Lets see more from Moore, and i am not blaming him..

32 minutes ago, gumby73 said:

Happy Game day morning  !  🥳

Coop did travel & get off the bus in Steel-town.. Cabot reports it's not serious & could go down to a warm-up decision. Take the bet it's decided later this afternoon..

PS has 2 options with possible call up

80	Watkins Jr., Austin WR

16	Darden, Jaelon WR

slim, but still a option when suiting up only 3 

72	NSEKHE, TY OT

74	Leatherwood, Alex OT

 

Let's hope we get some good news that Coop can go !   🤞

Indeed.  If not, we get a longer look at our receivers of next year.  I think both Tillman and Moore will get lot's of looks.

I want to see Moore played more as an actual receiver and not so much as the Schwartz, gadget guy replacement.  Screw the gadget crap.  You can't live on that.  I want to see him going out on pattens and catching passes, and not just quick bubble screens.  You can't live on YAC either.

Baker looked good yesterday.  I got the Sunday ticket and ended up watching much of the Buc's game.  I have always been a Bucs fan of sorts.  My parents retired to the area and my Dad bought season tickets for their 1st season and held them many years.  I always went to the Browns game when they played in Tampa. I also went to many non-Browns games.

I don't know if it is so much about the receivers as much as it is about Baker.  I think he has matured and possibly been humbled a bit.  He finally understands that he doesn't need to be "the guy"  He just needs to move the team down the field.

If he was still in Cleveland, it still wouldn't be working out for him.  He would still be trying to be "the guy" and the fans would still be expecting him to be that.  I think he has finally settled in to a place where he can be comfortable.

We were waiting on you to start the thread!