heckofajobbrownie Posted May 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 Well, not all Christians believe the Bible is God's word top to tail, but we can save that for another time. Lots of people find much of it to be rather pedestrian and hardly indicative of some sort of supernatural intervention, and so they don't treat it as such. Plus, I'd be more interested in why you think it's the word of God, or why you think Christ was the Son of God, not that some Christians do. You can worry about the other question for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2012 Why is this thread here now? And T has micromanaged for no reason again!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicopee John Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Well, not all Christians believe the Bible is God's word top to tail, but we can save that for another time. Lots of people find much of it to be rather pedestrian and hardly indicative of some sort of supernatural intervention, and so they don't treat it as such. Plus, I'd be more interested in why you think it's the word of God, or why you think Christ was the Son of God, not that some Christians do. You can worry about the other question for now. You're getting at a fundamental element of claiming to be Christian and acting like a Christian, Heck. Unfortunately, many people like to create 'God' in their image when, just the opposite is true. God created Man in HIS image. Like it or not. That is why Christ is the LORD and Savior. Many folks love the Savior part but shudder to think about the 'Lord' part when their trendy views don't align with what God says. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 You're getting at a fundamental element of claiming to be Christian and acting like a Christian, Heck. Unfortunately, many people like to create 'God' in their image when, just the opposite is true. God created Man in HIS image. Like it or not. That is why Christ is the LORD and Savior. Many folks love the Savior part but shudder to think about the 'Lord' part when their trendy views don't align with what God says. Prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We need Tom Tupa Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 I'd add this as a question: do you feel there's any place for consenting adults to enjoy sexual pleasure outside of marriage? What's sinful about that? How about kissing, or rubbing each other's back outside of marriage? In your mind, what is the nature of this particular sin? I dont understand the question. What does "what's sinful about that?" mean? What do you mean by "the nature of this particular sin"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Well, John, if there were one interpretation of the Bible there'd only be one Christian denomination, wouldn't there? But there are lots of different denominations with different beliefs and rules. The Episcopal church by my house is run by a priest with a wife and kids and we usual speak in bars. He's pro-gay rights. That's not exactly what I grew up with in the Boston archdiocese. It's also different from the Jesuit who married me and my wife. When we were going through both the marriage ceremony and the baptism ceremony he happily discarded parts that he thought were "antiquated" or even "ridiculous." So, to believe that the Bible is the inerrant word of God and you can either accept it entirely or deny it may be your marker for what is and what isn't a Christian, but that would make millions of people who consider themselves Christian not Christian. Me personally (excuse the redundancy) I believe something similar to Jefferson - that Christ was perhaps the most important moral teacher/philosopher of all time, but not the son of God. Also don't believe Joseph Smith was visited by angels and Jesus also made a stop in America, or that Mohammed was a prophet, or that L. Ron Hubbard had much interesting to say. I've never seen any evidence of the supernatural or heavenly intercessions, and think there are reams of examples of well-meaning (and not so well-meaning) myths, as well as people imagining such things or making them up out of whole cloth. I don't think humans are very good at leaving the blanks blank when they have no answer for the question. I'm happy to say I have no idea, and to keep thinking about it because always been a very interesting subject to me. To some, the world makes far more sense with Christ in it, or Mohammed, or Joseph Smith's ridiculously tall tale. For me it makes infinitely more sense when you come to understand that it's just humans reaching, and that everyone is equally wrong, and that nothing supernatural ever happened anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 i didn't want to feed this monkey while heckless is spanking it. heckless, did you learn all of that while you were in prison? well I will take a stand for God and the truth and in my opinion you have twisted the words and the truth to appease your own mind while trying to manipulate how people feel about an issue. It's the truth? Prove it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Here's what I'd ask you, John: why aren't you Mormon? Because it turns out there's basically a sequel to the Bible, and it was revealed by angels to a teenage boy in upstate New York in the 1820s. Why don't you believe that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicopee John Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 >>Here's what I'd ask you, John: why aren't you Mormon? Because it turns out there's basically a sequel to the Bible, and it was revealed by angels to a teenage boy in upstate New York in the 1820s. Why don't you believe that? Heck, I don't believe your not-so-cleverly veiled ridicule of Mitt Romney is fooling anybody. The Bible - at least the New Testament - was primarily written by those who lived with and, actually, knew the living Christ. If you believe people of faith - all faiths - are ignorant, stupid or - otherwise - uninformed, just say it and move on. You are welcome to buy into whatever belief system you choose, or not. Any way, I have to get back to work and, rather than get into more detail about this, I'll be writing a blistering Letter to the Editor of our local newspaper about our State Senator. I only have so much venom to spew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 It's got nothing to do with Mitt Romney, nor do I believe all people of faith are stupid or ignorant. Far from it. I'm just wondering why you don't believe what millions of Mormons believe - that Jesus also preached in America and some day will come back to Missouri? If it helps, substitute in Islam instead. Why don't you believe that Mohammed was God's prophet, and that the holiest book is the Quran, not the Bible? There are one billion Muslims who do. What I'm getting at is that you and I probably agree here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Instead of calling you out on your religious beliefs he's just breaking you down systematically. But you did dodge his question pretty hard.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Meanwhile: The Washington Post and ABC News offer the latest look into Americans' attitude on same-sex marriage: The big takeaway from their new poll is that more than half say same-sex should be legal, and that for the first time ever gay marriage advocates are winning the battle among those who have the strongest feelings about the issue. The top-line numbers: 53 percent of respondents said they think same-sex marriage should be legal, compared to 39 percent who think it should be illegal, a new low in the survey. A slight 3-point plurality (49-46) said they think that states should be in charge of making their own laws on the issue as opposed to relying on one single federal law. And 39 percent of Americans strongly support same-sex marriage, compared to 32 percent who strongly oppose it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 As I've said before I'd be curious to see the results if civil union were an option, but.... At any rate this poll should ease some of the bitterness among the guys in favor, right? Because clearly next time it comes up for a vote it will be passed by a wide margin. Remember that gay marriage has failed and all 30 states that have had the ballot issue red or blue. also in the states in which it has been sanctioned it has been by court decree. Do any of the proponents here want it to be a state issue? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Here is a bonus strategy question: Do you want the same sex marriage question on the 2012 ballot? Why or why not? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 sick freaks! Simmer down, it's all in the name of scientific progress! WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaporTrail Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Heck, I don't believe your not-so-cleverly veiled ridicule of Mitt Romney is fooling anybody. The Bible - at least the New Testament - was primarily written by those who lived with and, actually, knew the living Christ. If you believe people of faith - all faiths - are ignorant, stupid or - otherwise - uninformed, just say it and move on. I think that most people of faith are uninformed, yourself included. You said the New Testament was written by those who lived with and actually knew Jesus H. Christ, but all of them were written decades after Jesus allegedly got crucified. They're all stories that were handed down orally for years, except the Epistles that are actually attributed to Paul (who never actually met Jesus, even though he's known as an Apostle). If you compare what Paul said to what's written in the Gospels, they disagree on quite a bit, and in my opinion, Christianity should really be called Paulianity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaporTrail Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 did you know that 80% of all peddi's never go to prison.[citation needed] did the peddi's learn not to prey upon kids? this must be the new sexual revolution the queers are asking for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 ^Hahaha Bravo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 23, 2012 Report Share Posted May 23, 2012 did you know that 80% of all peddi's never go to prison. did the peddi's learn not to prey upon kids? this must be the new sexual revolution the queers are asking for? Aside from the number of cases falsely reported during a bitter divorce fight I'd say 80 percent is probably pretty low. Given the nature of and the usual suspects involved in pedophilia 1 might guess that at least 80 percent goes completely un reported. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaporTrail Posted May 24, 2012 Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 what they are saying in the video is that 80% of peddi's who are indicted will take a plea bargain and never see prison. its somewhere in the video, i only got thru about 2/3's of it before i got sick and turned it off, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVwbVRNwm6s So he links a 3 hour long video without telling us where in the video it is... C'mon man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 24, 2012 Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 Jesus. Brilliant. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 You're right, Steve. I should have more thoroughly engaged Bunker in an adult discussion about how "the queers" want to make pedophilia legal. Out of the posts on this board, you've correctly identified the one worth your snark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 24, 2012 Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 You're right, Steve. I should have more thoroughly engaged Bunker in an adult discussion about how "the queers" want to make pedophilia legal. Out of the posts on this board, you've correctly identified the one worth your snark. No no no... I just asked simply since you think he polls are strong would you, wearing your campaign advisor hat, want same sex marriage on the 2012 ballot or not? I thought you were snapping at me... WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 24, 2012 Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 How do you even function Bunker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 No no no... I just asked simply since you think he polls are strong would you, wearing your campaign advisor hat, want same sex marriage on the 2012 ballot or not? I thought you were snapping at me... WSS Oh, no. I was shaking my head in pity because of that poor, miserable sap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 I'm not sure what you mean. On every state ballot? Sure, I wouldn't mind. It'd win some places and lose others. I don't think it'd have much affect on the presidential race. The idea that it really helped Bush in 2004 seems to be a myth. It doesn't seem to have made a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 Take Maryland, for instance: 57% of Maryland voters say they’re likely to vote for the new marriage law this fall, compared to only 37% who are opposed. That 20 point margin of passage represents a 12 point shift from an identical PPP survey in early March, which found it ahead by a closer 52/44 margin. The movement over the last two months can be explained almost entirely by a major shift in opinion about same-sex marriage among black voters. Previously 56% said they would vote against the new law with only 39% planning to uphold it. Those numbers have now almost completely flipped, with 55% of African Americans planning to vote for the law and only 36% now opposed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 24, 2012 Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 I'm not sure what you mean. On every state ballot? Sure, I wouldn't mind. It'd win some places and lose others. I don't think it'd have much affect on the presidential race. The idea that it really helped Bush in 2004 seems to be a myth. It doesn't seem to have made a difference. Yes every ballot. I just wonder who's base would be energized.. Correct there doesn't seem to be a big difference in 04 but I'm wondering if a general poll and an actual vote would produce similar results. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted May 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 Yes every ballot. I just wonder who's base would be energized.. Correct there doesn't seem to be a big difference in 04 but I'm wondering if a general poll and an actual vote would produce similar results. WSS Yeah, they don't seem to. People seem to want to appear more open to it when speaking with pollsters than they do when behind the curtain in a voting booth. The polls have almost always over-estimated support. But it's all changing so fast. Soon even that won't matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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