The Gipper Posted March 24, 2016 Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 Brandt: Wentz had one of best pro days I've ever witnessed By Chase Goodbread College Football 24/7 writer Published: March 24, 2016 at 12:43 p.m. Updated: March 24, 2016 at 01:28 p.m. 1 Likes | 16 Comments Email Print Read Discuss A quarterback can only look so good to NFL scouts in a pro-day setting, where the environment is sterilized from pads, defenses and pressure situations, but Carson Wentz made as strong an impression as possible Thursday. And the early reviews glowed. NFL Media senior analyst Gil Brandt, with more than a half century of NFL scouting experience, called it one of the best pro days he's ever witnessed and said Wentz reminds him of former Super Bowl MVP Joe Flacco of the Baltimore Ravens. According to Brandt, Wentz completed 63 passes in a 65-throw script, with one overthrow and one drop. Brandt noted the best pro day by a quarterback he's seen came from thePhiladelphia Eagles' Sam Bradford, who was the No. 1 overall selection of the St. Louis Rams in the 2010 NFL Draft. Boy, that is damning him with faint praise. NFL Media analyst Daniel Jeremiah was impressed with the workout as well, saying "That's an A if not an A-plus." As he did last week with Cal quarterback Jared Goff, Cleveland Browns assistant coach Pep Hamilton followed Wentz's script by asking him to throw some extra passes with a ball doused with water. The first of those throws from Wentz fluttered and was badly underthrown. "The first one obviously went right into the dirt," Wentz said with a laugh onNFL Network. "... It was pretty doused; that would've been a torrential downpour." OK, is that a bad sign? Wentz's session was witnessed by only 18 NFL clubs because of weather problems. The narrative that Wentz and Goff are running even as the top two quarterbacks available in the 2016 NFL Draft is beginning to give way to a perceived edge for Wentz, the former North Dakota State quarterback who conducted his pro-day workout Thursday for NFL coaches and scouts. First, there was NFL Media analyst Charley Casserly, who polled 15 NFL executives about the two quarterbacks and found a majority of them favored Wentz. And Mayock is seeing things much the same. "I've watched every game that he was in this year, and I'm more convinced than ever that he's the top quarterback in this draft," Mayock said on NFL HQ. " ... This kid controls the line of scrimmage. He's under center, he's in (shotgun), he controls all the pass protections, and he can make every throw." Follow Chase Goodbread on Twitter @ChaseGoodbread. I guess we could take a Flacco or a BR....if that is what people think this kid could be. What's This? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted March 24, 2016 Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 Nice link Mike- Showed what I needed to see. Kid doubtless has an NFL arm. Hue is gonna have to ask is he accurate enough. I remember way back in '99 our UCF alum said he saw Duante Culpepper throw it 90 yards once. Heck, there's HS quarterbacks that can throw it 50 yards, but Wentz does it effortlessly. If this guy becomes as good as Daunte Culpepper, that would probably be alright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taco918 Posted March 24, 2016 Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 If this guy becomes as good as Daunte Culpepper, that would probably be alright. Preferably the Minnesota version, not the Miami debacle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Dawg Posted March 24, 2016 Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 Can you guess the QB's name? "He showed us he can make all the throws," NFL Network analyst Kurt Warner said. "That deep ball was impeccable. Great touch, good enough velocity and was able to set it out there." "I think he loves competition," NFL Media draft analyst Mike Mayock said. "He lights up like a Christmas tree with all these GMs here." He completed 61 of 64 passes, and had one blemish with a throw that was too low, but was otherwise on target with just about every throw. One throw was caught out of bounds and the other incompletion was a drop. Johnny Manziel's Pro Day. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000337482/article/johnny-manziel-shines-at-circuslike-pro-day-workout Moral of the story, Pro Day's mean nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted March 24, 2016 Report Share Posted March 24, 2016 Can you guess the QB's name? "He showed us he can make all the throws," NFL Network analyst Kurt Warner said. "That deep ball was impeccable. Great touch, good enough velocity and was able to set it out there." "I think he loves competition," NFL Media draft analyst Mike Mayock said. "He lights up like a Christmas tree with all these GMs here." He completed 61 of 64 passes, and had one blemish with a throw that was too low, but was otherwise on target with just about every throw. One throw was caught out of bounds and the other incompletion was a drop. Johnny Manziel's Pro Day. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000337482/article/johnny-manziel-shines-at-circuslike-pro-day-workout Moral of the story, Pro Day's mean nothing. Actually, the moral of the story is that nothing can be taken in a bubble. But I fail to see where Wentz was thought to be undersized, or have off the field concerns, or a lack of experience exec thing pro concepts, or undisciplined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 Wentz is the anti-jm. There, I just annoyed my own self mentioning jm again. dammit. After Wentz's pro day, I thought a few thoughts, I think. 1. Goff isn't able to zing the ball way down field with accuracy like Wentz can. Those long throws were effortless, and it gets there very, very fast. Really beautiful touch on the ball. 2. Both Goff and Wentz throw a great catchable ball. Goff did fine throwing shorter? passes after the ball was doused. Wentz had his first throw slip out and go into the ground. He laughed about it. However, if you go back and watch again, Goff shook the water off before he threw it. Wentz tended to not shake it off. Who cares, but it is what it is. 3. Goff has great presence, so does Wentz. But Wentz has the much quicker, agile feet. I mean, for being 6'5", he can shift and be elusive in the pocket - has great balance for that. 4. Seems to me, that his teammates admire and are friends with Wentz. They have fun. Maybe, Goff's teammates don't have that close friendship....maybe I'm wrong. But Wentz is completely approachable. Goff seems a good bit aloof. It's just something I think when I watch both being interviewed. Goff doesn't smile much. Wentz is a good bit a smiler, laughs and is funny, humble. Goff never ? jokes much. Seems that it could be all about ...him. 5. Goff can really throw accurately, sees the field excellently, seems to me, from highlights of him. He's tough, tough minded, and loves the game. Seems to be generally an introvert.. or something. Or, maybe he just seems very tense and serious in interviews. Goff is very able to roll out, but isn't shifty and elusive like Wentz in the pocket. 6. Wentz missed two throws out of 65. The pace was faster than Goff's prod day workout... humorously, by design. The rest of the time, I marveled at how he can have touch on the ball, and still there was power behind the throw, and they were right on the money. In the interview after his workout, they were talking about Wentz and how in one game, (he calls all his own protections, per his coach), he read the defense, picked up on a blitz key, and called the qb power run. He went for 27 yards, and actually juked a safety to miss him during that play. Wentz LOVES the game, ... 7. Wentz, in high school, played both ways. He played lb and safety. He loved the contact of playing defense. You gottal love this kid. Goff was always a qb. Don't know how he is about contact. He's been hit a lot. Has fumbled a lot. 8. I just think it's Wentz. I can't imagine picking Goff with a choice of either qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 after the sam Bradford comment y'all should have caught on that pro days don't mean shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 You are stupidly missing the point. Pro days are a small indicator. Nobody said pro days were the only factor. If a guy runs a 4.6, and a 4.5 at the combine, and then runs a 4.38 at his pro day... do you think the 4.38 means nothing? Go look at the faster time Braxton Miller ran at his pro day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 You are stupidly missing the point. Pro days are a small indicator. Nobody said pro days were the only factor. If a guy runs a 4.6, and a 4.5 at the combine, and then runs a 4.38 at his pro day... do you think the 4.38 means nothing? Go look at the faster time Braxton Miller ran at his pro day. Just make your point. What did Miller run? At combine and at pro day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 2) Joe Haden Haden went into the 2010 combine graded as the draft’s top cornerback and a sure first-round pick out of Florida. He disappointed with a 4.57 40 and 35-inch vertical jump, leading to some speculation that he might drop towards the end of the first round. He didn’t. The Browns took him with the seventh overall pick and Haden has now made two Pro Bowls. With that preamble out of the way, multiple NFL reporters at Tebowfest Florida’s Pro Day write that cornerback Joe Haden ran in the high 4.3’s/low 4.4’s. That is a huge improvement on Haden’s sssslow time he ran at the combine. Whether it erases the perception Haden lacks speed is another matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 Just make your point. What did Miller run? At combine and at pro day. http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/ohio-state-pro-day-braxton-miller-40-yard-dash-031116 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 pro days CAN mean a lot. But not everything, by any stretch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 Really good showing, but... ... the gap I see that still leads me to Goff cannot be closed in a Pro Day... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted March 25, 2016 Report Share Posted March 25, 2016 True, it's all factors. I guess I really am impressed with Wentz's intangibles, as much as I think he has that as well, over Goff. Just seems that way to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted March 29, 2016 Report Share Posted March 29, 2016 I could have written much of this, but even I am not cruel enough to have written it all. It made me wince a few times and a couple of the play critiques do not ring true. Nonetheless it captures many of the summary elements that in total represent the gap I see between Wentz and Goff. The Warts of Carson Wentz March 27, 2016 Cian Fahey http://presnapreads.com/2016/03/27/the-warts-of-carson-wentz/ There are gifs a plenty illustrating the various points the writer makes. Here are a few of the writer's conclusion that I also saw from the beginning: Throwing receivers open isn’t something Wentz does. He didn’t need to do it against the defenses he faced in college. Wentz would try to fit the ball over defenders, but was still rifling the ball rather than throwing with controlled elevation. He repeatedly throws the ball to where he sees the receiver rather than where the receiver is going. It’s not just that Wentz runs out of clean pockets either, he doesn’t feel pressure around him unless it arrives in his line of sight. Wentz primarily gets rid of the ball to his first read. He’s not exceptionally efficient doing this but he is better the quicker he gets rid of the ball. When he holds onto the ball and moves his eyes from one side of the field to the other, his play becomes looser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted March 29, 2016 Report Share Posted March 29, 2016 Sure, Wentz isn't perfect. Neither was rapistbooger. I do believe that Wentz is excellently coachable, excellent athletic, and excellently very, very smart. Ya can't coach intangibles... and I wonder about Goff having them. Yes, these were the negatives about rapistbooger. Wentz is the superior qb, especially when compared to what rapistbooger was when he was nearing the draft. ************************************************************ http://bigben7.com/bens-path-to-the-draft-part-i/ Negatives –A pocket passer with marginal mobility and cannot escape the rush. Must improve his downfield accuracy as well as the placement of the outs. Majority of snaps are taken out of the shotgun. “In 2004, Big Ben entered the draft as a junior and did not have the benefit of postseason All Star Games. His draft grade was heavily reliant on the combine and he did not perform well. He was inaccurate with his passes throughout his workout and as a result became the third quarterback chosen in the ’04 draft.” — Sports Illustrated, “Classic NFL Combine Stories” posted February 20, 2009. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted March 29, 2016 Report Share Posted March 29, 2016 I could have written much of this, but even I am not cruel enough to have written it all. It made me wince a few times and a couple of the play critiques do not ring true. Nonetheless it captures many of the summary elements that in total represent the gap I see between Wentz and Goff. The Warts of Carson Wentz March 27, 2016 Cian Fahey http://presnapreads.com/2016/03/27/the-warts-of-carson-wentz/ There are gifs a plenty illustrating the various points the writer makes. Here are a few of the writer's conclusion that I also saw from the beginning: Throwing receivers open isn’t something Wentz does. He didn’t need to do it against the defenses he faced in college. Wentz would try to fit the ball over defenders, but was still rifling the ball rather than throwing with controlled elevation. He repeatedly throws the ball to where he sees the receiver rather than where the receiver is going. It’s not just that Wentz runs out of clean pockets either, he doesn’t feel pressure around him unless it arrives in his line of sight. Wentz primarily gets rid of the ball to his first read. He’s not exceptionally efficient doing this but he is better the quicker he gets rid of the ball. When he holds onto the ball and moves his eyes from one side of the field to the other, his play becomes looser. Went through all of the link Tour. It does give you plenty of food for thought. Carson was largely operating from a clean pocket against D II secondaries. NFL CBs will be a lot more attentive, and you to have to have anticipation where your receiver will be when he breaks open. I noticed in some other tape, Wentz rarely had to go through a full progression to find someone wide open. Might be enough to tilt me over to the Goff side of the fence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted March 29, 2016 Report Share Posted March 29, 2016 Only a fool would pick Wentz over Goff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted March 29, 2016 Report Share Posted March 29, 2016 Only a fool would pick Goff, if he doesn't have the intangibles like Wentz has, and with arm strength that won't make it in the wind and rain. Just not sold on Goff, except for he's very polished, and a lot more ready to play immediately. The Browns don't have to worry about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted March 29, 2016 Report Share Posted March 29, 2016 Only a fool would pick Goff, if he doesn't have the intangibles like Wentz has, and with arm strength that won't make it in the wind and rain. Just not sold on Goff, except for he's very polished, and a lot more ready to play immediately. The Browns don't have to worry about that. If I have no idea what either players' "intangibles" are, then does that make them equal? Their arm strength is not very different. I thought Wentz had the stronger arm as well, but then Goff won the fast ball competition at the Combine. Wentz's lack of readiness to play may not concern you in 2016 ... but by 2018 you will be very concerned. I take the guy I know can play now because he has already shown he has taken that last QB step. That in a word is the gap... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Dawg Posted April 3, 2016 Report Share Posted April 3, 2016 @PFF_College Carson Wentz adjusted completion percentage: 11-20 yard range: 70.7% (2nd in draft class 21-30 yard range: 43.5% (23rd in draft class) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike H Posted April 12, 2016 Report Share Posted April 12, 2016 Great read: http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/15158945/does-north-dakota-state-qb-carson-wentz-really-add-20m Maybe it means nothing. Maybe they'll draft someone else instead. But as he's walking toward Jackson, both of them already eager to catch a plane, Hamilton can't resist catching Jackson's eye and offering his silent, one-word review: Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted April 12, 2016 Report Share Posted April 12, 2016 I was watching Detone Jones, DE, of the Packers talk about Aaron Rodgers. He said Rodgers was so great because he was really, really smart....that he got his wr's to learn the defenses, won the celebrity trivia game whatever it was..... Wentz is a whole lot like Rodgers. Doesn't matter that much that Goff is the best pure passer in the draft. There's a hell of a lot more to qb'ing that just being the best passer. Wentz has it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Yeah.... who wants the "best passer"? Yuck... That was a good read... very well written article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Yeah.... who wants the "best passer"? Yuck... That was a good read... very well written article. Well, I understand what he means. Brandon Weeden was probably the best "pure passer" his year.....but obviously there is a lot more to being a QB than having a good arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Bryce Petty was called the "best pure passer"... http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/04/30/report-saints-see-bryce-petty-as-drafts-best-pure-passer/ Interesting article, but I disagree with Parcell's "requirements" for a qb... http://espn.go.com/nfl/draft2016/insider/story/_/id/15096745/connor-cook-rates-best-nfl-draft-qbs-parcells-rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Fine... then let's just take the best pure passer this year who also happens to be the best QB prospect... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Fine... then let's just take the best pure passer this year who also happens to be the best QB prospect... Or we could take the guy who actually ran his offense... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Let's put it this way: for a face of the franchise... we know - Wentz won championships, has strong arm, plenty tough enough to run and engage blockers if necessary.... has a pretty girlfriend, same one since hs, loves the outdoors, hunts and fishes and hikes, is loved by his teammates and fans... got a wrist injury and the first game back was a championship game... they won. He came for his guys on the team. has an older brother that he is very close to, is extremely competitive, has a great sense of humor, is funny, used to chide his teammates to play country music instead of rap, so they had a contest where they held a basketball hoop over somebody's head and had a competition of hoop shots (laughed, a lot, probably a freshman player they were teasing?), played basketball at the request of the coach, is outgoing to fans anywhere he goes, says sometimes he wears a hat and sunglasses so he is more incognito, laughs about it.... at his favorite restaurant... at Gruden's workout, they were whapping him with foam pool floaties while he ran plays, and he quipped "is my turn with those soon?".... he's going to be a great community guy, a winner... there's photos of him all over the place with all sorts of people, his family, his girlfriend.... he'd be outstanding off the field and a huge community kid......he's brilliant, called his own plays and protections, straight "A" student, very popular with his teammates and friends... and fans... and what do we know about Goff? He won more games his Senior year... is a fan of Taylor Swift, played basketball, is the best pure passer in college, is serious, dour, doesn't smile much in interviews.........seems very introverted with no sense of humor and....and likes to hide in his room and play video games and.................uh.....eh......he.....................? they are both terrific college qb's. Wentz is the real deal for the face of the franchise. If they trade down, I predict it will be with Dallas, their third round pick this year, and a good player, maybe a second round pick next year... Camp Wentz rocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted April 13, 2016 Report Share Posted April 13, 2016 Interesting read on why #2 overall is the most important spot in this draft. http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/nfl-draft-cleveland-browns-dallas-cowboys-carson-wentz-jared-goff-jalen-ramsey-pick-041316 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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