gftChris Posted May 13, 2016 Report Share Posted May 13, 2016 Totally alien, andromeda galaxy? Bro, do you even breathe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted May 13, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2016 Bro, do you even breathe? Pffttt, silly human Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted May 13, 2016 Report Share Posted May 13, 2016 I don't know where you stand on the issue but most people here purposely misconstrue the subject. Young people (or anybody really) who have children out of wedlock do not, in my opinion, carry them to term because abortion is unavailable or illegal. In most cases it's simply biological human and animal nature to reproduce. No matter what kind of high-minded and lofty excuses anybody wants to make. I would wager if there were mobile abortion units that would come to your home and do them for free the number of illegitimate births wouldn't be reduced significantly. Those that have abortions performed just don't want to go through the bother of raising a child or the 9 months gestation period, the expense or the delivery. WSS My stance is that I've seen the ugly side of things and there are people that should not have kids. Possibly ever. Not for the sake of inconvienence but of the fact they'll be awful parents - who will in turn (statistically) raise awful kids. Not so much because of poverty, Lord knows my folks didnt have much when I was a kid. Although the middle class is shrinking daily and poverty is becoming a solid reason. I'm mostly focused on the underaged, the junkies, mentally insane, and lately, yes, those in great poverty. I won't disagree its human nature to reproduce, but human nature shares common traits with animalistic nature and last I checked we're a bit more developed. It's certainly no lofty excuse, I excuse nothing, I don't even attempt to morally justify it. I don't like the idea of abortion, I don't believe anyone does. That's something hard line anti-abortionists should work to understand. Also, if there were (discreet) mobile abortion clinics I think you would find use of them. Especially in under-developed and urban areas. I've seen two teenage pregnancies among close friends of family members, girls who were only 15-16 at the time and perhaps should not have a child because of complications that can arise at that age. I'm both situations the parents were staunch anti abortion (though the one girls father rants excessively about "niggers" needed welfare -he's not popular at family BBQ's) so they're teenage moms now. Unlikely to make contributions to society, get an education, finish high school only to land in the dregs of low scale employment. The days of being able to raise a family in your high school diploma working in a union shop or in manufacturing died when I was a preteen. Oh, One child experienced problems during pregnancy and now cares for a severely disabled infant at 17 years old. She tried committing suicide just over a month ago. You have a point, Steve. People tend to think of sex without the consequences of not using birth control (though we both know nothing is 100% effective) but I've worn thin on the moral high ground of people feeling they're protecting unborn children after things I've been witness to. Sometimes the ugly choice might be the necessary one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted May 13, 2016 Report Share Posted May 13, 2016 That's understandable Tiam. I agree with you... it's more the "murder children just because we feel like it" that makes it so "black and white". It's sad though, that sexual freedom at earlier ages is becoming aggressively accepted by the left... I guess, just to slap the face of all those moral people who want kids to be responsible til they are married. Trouble is, there have been suicides because a young pregnant woman... DID have an abortion. There is emotional stress, years and years of it, all too often, on both sides. Kids, with all the media, see that they can "grow up" as be as wild as the adult celebrities they see on TV. Irresponsible, outlandish, extremely selfish and self-destructive behavior is glamorized, laughed at, and all too often - copied. I think if kids want to wild and crazy, and often they will, two teens - a couple of lovers in middle school..??? can go skinny dipping in a pool, heavy petting, that's wild and crazy. But having unprotected sex is just self destructive so young. Sure, some kids go all the way, and often end up paying a terrible price - abortion...or parenthood in hs. I don't get the left denouncing teaching responsible behavior. It's like the left says "hey, you are gonna do it anways, so here is us teaching you to go ahead with sex and drugs and have a good time, who cares, the gov will bail you out, and hey, grow up being a democrat liberal".. So many kids are not being taught about responsibility for their actions. and some out of control behavior is a result of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 14, 2016 Report Share Posted May 14, 2016 My stance is that I've seen the ugly side of things and there are people that should not have kids. Possibly ever. Not for the sake of inconvienence but of the fact they'll be awful parents - who will in turn (statistically) raise awful kids. Not so much because of poverty, Lord knows my folks didnt have much when I was a kid. Although the middle class is shrinking daily and poverty is becoming a solid reason. I'm mostly focused on the underaged, the junkies, mentally insane, and lately, yes, those in great poverty. I won't disagree its human nature to reproduce, but human nature shares common traits with animalistic nature and last I checked we're a bit more developed. It's certainly no lofty excuse, I excuse nothing, I don't even attempt to morally justify it. I don't like the idea of abortion, I don't believe anyone does. That's something hard line anti-abortionists should work to understand. Also, if there were (discreet) mobile abortion clinics I think you would find use of them. Especially in under-developed and urban areas. I've seen two teenage pregnancies among close friends of family members, girls who were only 15-16 at the time and perhaps should not have a child because of complications that can arise at that age. I'm both situations the parents were staunch anti abortion (though the one girls father rants excessively about "niggers" needed welfare -he's not popular at family BBQ's) so they're teenage moms now. Unlikely to make contributions to society, get an education, finish high school only to land in the dregs of low scale employment. The days of being able to raise a family in your high school diploma working in a union shop or in manufacturing died when I was a preteen. Oh, One child experienced problems during pregnancy and now cares for a severely disabled infant at 17 years old. She tried committing suicide just over a month ago. You have a point, Steve. People tend to think of sex without the consequences of not using birth control (though we both know nothing is 100% effective) but I've worn thin on the moral high ground of people feeling they're protecting unborn children after things I've been witness to. Sometimes the ugly choice might be the necessary one. I agree with most of what you say and I'm not arguing against abortion. Just pointing out what I believe to be a simple fact. That is that of all the unqualified mothers who have children; I don't believe any of them are squirting them out because contraception and abortion aren't readily available. They are. The left just wants to pretend that they are so there is an issue.As far as birth control not being 100% effective, we've been through that a half-dozen times. They have to be used properly and many of the forms in combination, IUD or the pill along with a condom on the guy's part used properly and the chances should be one in thousands. We have all kinds of safety laws. Seat belts, helmets, car seats Etc none of which are 100% effective. Only an idiot would say they shouldn't be used because they are not 100%. As much as I would love to ban unqualified people from reproducing, imagine The firestorm that would start. I'm just saying that human life is not that important, we just pretend it is. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 I don't think anyone is saying we shouldn't use contraceptives because they aren't 100% effective. The point is that you can't paint every woman that gets an abortion as some lazy, incompetent, piece of trash that didn't bother to take any precaution. The point is, contraceptives don't work every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 Nobody is painting every woman. But the problem is, the failure to recognize a serious problem of irresponsible behavior resulting in unwanted pregnancies. http://www.numberofabortions.com/ In United States today 197.9US since 1973: Roe vs Wade 58,991,725.2By Planned Parenthood since 19707,081,850.7By Planned Parenthood this year120,497.7 United States this Year 405,470.2US this Year after 16 weeks gestation 19,462.6US this Year due to rapeor incest3,933.1Black babies since '73 in US17,697,517.6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 I don't think anyone is saying we shouldn't use contraceptives because they aren't 100% effective. The point is that you can't paint every woman that gets an abortion as some lazy, incompetent, piece of trash that didn't bother to take any precaution. The point is, contraceptives don't work every time. Women and or men. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 "seatbelts don't save your life every single time...why bother?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 "seatbelts don't save your life every single time...why bother?" Whatever you're attempting here, I am guessing you think you're being clever. Do you want to explain this witty retort a little more for me? Again, no one is saying we shouldn't use contraceptives because they don't work 100% of the time. Because that statement was never made, I don't see how your comment above has any relevance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 it's all this talk about contraceptives are not 100% dependable. I look at the objection by liberals to teaching abstinence in sex ed classes. They hate that. Why? I just posted the abortion numbers. Surely nobody thinks that all those are a result of contraceptives failing. So, the conclusion is, a lot of irresponsible people don't use them. Except abortion is their out for their irresponsible behavior. It's just one of the ways a devious, corrupt liberal gov, obaMao's regime - trolls for votes.... by emphasizing the right to murder unborn and born children. "life of the mother".... rape...incest..... a relatively very, very small percentage...and liberals just use that as a cover for all those numbers of children being murdered....just because it's more convenient to not have consequences of reckless and irresponsible behavior. Like the idea that illegal drugs should be legalized. "no victim crime"? Try telling that to the little children and wonderful ex-wife of a man who went from being an alcoholic, to meth and whatever else, and lost his job... I don't care what a trans boy "feels" - stay out of real girl's lockerrooms and bathrooms. But, the liberals sure lock in the gay vote, the trans vote, and the black entitlement large subculture vote. and so many liberals will knee jerk in support of anything, no matter how wrong, with all sorts of excuses and rationalizations and invalid analogies.... because they agree with more political power for their side. The "feeling" party. No morals, no religion, no belief system, no consequences for destructive/risky behavior, etc etc etc.. just feelings. If the nazis felt they weren't happy about something about somebody, they would just shoot, murder and laugh it off. because murdering whatever made them unhappy, made them feel happy. now go look at the abortion numbers. 6 million Jews were murdered in the death camps. More than 7 million murdered in planned parenthood death abortion offices. Sadly, both are sick, vile, heinous, frightening solutions out of convenience. pba - obamao supports it completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 Abstinence only sex ed doesn't work. We've posted the data before. Teenage pregnancy is higher in places where that is the sex ed method of choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted May 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 I have zero issue teaching abstinence but not by itself. 6th graders "should" be told not to fuck. But at the same time if they're giving esch other hand jobs than im not gonna cry sbout it cause the alternative is that they hsve outright sex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 Abstinence only sex ed doesn't work. We've posted the data before. Teenage pregnancy is higher in places where that is the sex ed method of choice. ******************************* nobody is talking about ONLY teaching abstinence. I'm all for sex ed - to the point of only teaching it to young adults who need to know, and that is with the parents' knowledge and consent. Just because a lot of kids decide to completely act out on their raging hormones, doesn't mean that they don't have consequences coming their way if they are not lucky. NOT to pre-schoolers. That is more in line with the left's desire to mold young childrens' minds, social engineering leftist style. "be the kids new parent authority" - the leftwing gov, nazi-style. Of course abstinence from going all the way works. It's just that so many kids want to experiment with that, etc etc etc, and they take their chances. Kids need to be taught about how many kids/young adults have had serious depression, ruined their lives, over how they murdered their child. The left makes it seem a simple solution to the receiving of consequences of their risky sexual behavior when pregnancies are not a good idea. Nope. They desperately need to teach this, also: http://www.word-of-hope.org/what-may-happen-after-an-abortion.html http://www.abortionfacts.com/literature/abortion-complications Suicide Rate for Women Having Abortions is Six...http://www.lifenews.com/2014/12/19/suicide-rate-for-women-ha... Dec 19, 2014 ... “Women with a recent induced abortion still have a two-fold suicide risk,” ... The potential for depression and other mental health issues at this ... Studies show risk of suicide elevated in women... http://liveactionnews.org/studies-show-risk-of-suicide-eleva... Jul 28, 2013 ... Women who aborted were three times more likely to commit suicide than ... One study found that teenage girls who had one or more abortions were 10 ... I fell into a deepdepression and I bearly [sic] made it to senior year. Suicide Risk - Abortion is The UnChoice http://www.theunchoice.com/suicide.htm “Parents are faced with a shell of a person ... and have no idea where they lost their child. ...Suicide is 6 times higher among women with a history of abortion compared .... Teens are at risk of coercion and post-abortion depression and suicide ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted May 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 Heres the problem with religious abstinence based teaching cal.....it doesnt resonate. It sounds like grown ups telling kids not to do yet another cool thing cause gandalf in the sky will be unpleased. Especially inner city kids that live lives that basically tell them theres no god its complete bullshit. So we as a society need to come up with a way to expound on children why early sexual activity is a recipe to repeat the mistakes of their parents. And it has to be matter of fact statements that i csn already see will be challenged by the right for being secular progressive. You just cant win with these people. They will insist jezus be thrown in somewhere and they will insist thst the message make no mention of the way thrir parents screwed up by having more children than they had the means for. I can hear em now, the abstinence message will have to have a dadh of jesus sprinkled here and there or it won't be legit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted May 15, 2016 Report Share Posted May 15, 2016 you are manufacturing a scenario that isn't likely. Parents can take their kids to church and teach them about God, there, and at home, Bible studies, church youth groups,... it's the leftists in schools that are fighting against the existence and belief in God, arrogantly, and adamantly. A free time reading period, and a student is reprimanded for reading their Bible? https://answersingenesis.org/public-school/religion-in-schools/christian-law-association-rights-in-public-schools/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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