No Love for Quinn

[Drunkandstoopid]

You always play the guys that give the team the best chance to win. That's not the argument here.

 

The whole point of this never-ending conversation is that RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION by paying/playing DA, and that decision cost us not only the whole 2008 season but both of them their jobs and the organization millions of dollars.

 

You can make whatever excuses you want to make for DA but the facts that matter are clear: DA failed to win games and failed to lead the team in a positive direction. While he was the starting QB, the Browns looked awful more than they looked good. Period.

 

If he was a quality NFL QB, he would have been part of the solution. He clearly and consistently was part of the problem. And that's what it boils down to now.

 

DA had his chance. He got paid to be the starting QB. He failed. Those that made the decision to make him the starting QB were fired. DA should be fired as well.

 

Which brings us back to: we spent a first-round pick on a top QB. Normally, getting a guy like Quinn is cause for excitement for a franchise and the fan base was rightly excited about the possibilities of a highly-touted QB playing in Cleveland.

 

Many of us would like to see if that excitement based on potential has a basis in reality.

 

You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.

 

In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.

 

I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.

 

[NebBrownsFan]

You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.

 

In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.

 

I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.

 

Of course DA looked the part better than Quinn last year in practice. He had NO pressure of a competition on him, he had already been named starter and the whole world was told there was NO competition. That's when DA performs best, when there are no expectations and no pressure. You noticed he didn't carry that level of play into the season, right?

[lobstrocity]

Of course DA looked the part better than Quinn last year in practice. He had NO pressure of a competition on him, he had already been named starter and the whole world was told there was NO competition. That's when DA performs best, when there are no expectations and no pressure. You noticed he didn't carry that level of play into the season, right?

 

Give me a break! I think the coach is in a MUCH BETTER position to determine who the better QB is, not some armchair coach who is in love with BQ. The better QB won, DA. This Quinn love in here is getting nauseating. I'm not saying DA is a great QB, just better then BQ, as judged by the coach. Not the fans who have no clue as to whom is better.

[lemosley01]

Give me a break! I think the coach is in a MUCH BETTER position to determine who the better QB is, not some armchair coach who is in love with BQ. The better QB won, DA. This Quinn love in here is getting nauseating. I'm not saying DA is a great QB, just better then BQ, as judged by the coach. Not the fans who have no clue as to whom is better.

 

WHAT COMPETITION?

 

I missed where Savage or Crennel EVER said there was a competition. Stop revising history.

[cmac12]

And if he doesn't choke slam DA? What then?

[FRIZBIZ]

Quinn needs to start, christ, I'm so sick of waiting for him to play because the Brown's FO is so utterly incompetent. It's so frustrating, I feel like monkeys might as well be running the team.

 

[lemosley01]

If Quinn gets traded, I'm hoping we either keep Anderson or get someone else.

 

I don't want us drafting Sanchez, because I think he's a bust of epic proportions at #5, especially considering the other players that may be available that we can actually use and do need.

 

I'd much rather ride the year out with DA and see if the new staff can do something with him, then draft a QB next year if they can't.

 

JMO.

[Guest AdaM]

If Quinn gets traded, I'm hoping we either keep Anderson or get someone else.

 

I don't want us drafting Sanchez, because I think he's a bust of epic proportions at #5, especially considering the other players that may be available that we can actually use and do need.

 

I'd much rather ride the year out with DA and see if the new staff can do something with him, then draft a QB next year if they can't.

 

JMO.

 

 

We need farm teams for the nfl.... Quinn could have been playing in the D league or whatever and already be ready to step in.

[YtownBrownsBacker]

Even though Kokinis didn't say much at his press conference, I did pick up something very telling.

 

Kokinis said there will be a QB competition and as of now, both are still on the team. Then he said Quinn is upstairs working with Dabol and they have been working on the playbook every day. He wouldn't confirm that DA had minor surgery during the off season but said DA is working out and when minicamp get here he expects him to be 100% and competing with Quinn.

 

I might be reading too much into it, but why would Quinn be working with dabol everyday on the playbook if they were going to trade him? Also, where is Anderson? He was playing golf on the west coast most of the off season. Didn't sound like he was even in Berea.

 

Why didn't Kokinis say that Anderson and Quinn are working with Dabol on the new offense and playbook?

[lemosley01]

Hey Lemosely, is that Vingh Rames in your sig?

 

Kind of looks like him or Karl Weathers (sp?), but it's not. Just a pic from Gears of War or Halo.

[damajuki]

You say "RAC/Savage MADE THE WRONG DECISION" but you don't know.

 

In the leadup to fall last year, nearly all reports coming out were saying that DA was clearly moving the team better than BQ in practice and looked the part of the starter. What they didn't say was that the Browns were gonna suck bad for the year, no matter who was at QB between the two guys vying for the spot.

 

I say let there be an open competition between the two under the new management... then we'll see if RAC/Savage made the wrong decision or not. Anyone who doesn't want to see that is chickenspit. If BQ is the guy many of you say he is, it'll be his position come the first game.

Um, we do know, D&S. The Browns finished 4-12. DA was the starter for the crucial first half of the season. How'd we start out again? 1-5, I believe?

 

Oh, and are RAC and Savage still employed by the Browns? No.

 

Finally, do you think they would have been fired had Quinn been playing, regardless of the Browns' finish?

 

No, again.

 

So what were you saying about their decision to play DA again? Still confused?

[damajuki]

No to mention the additional 1st and 3rd round picks that could have been on the team had we let DA go. Who knows how those picks would have impacted our 2008 draft and thus our 2009 draft.

 

But one thing is for sure: two potential high-impact players would have made a big difference, either to the offense or defense.

 

But keeping DA obviously was the right choice...

[NebBrownsFan]

Give me a break! I think the coach is in a MUCH BETTER position to determine who the better QB is, not some armchair coach who is in love with BQ. The better QB won, DA. This Quinn love in here is getting nauseating. I'm not saying DA is a great QB, just better then BQ, as judged by the coach. Not the fans who have no clue as to whom is better.

 

You mean the coach that got fired? Yeah, pretty darn good judge of talent he was. Of course leave it to a DA lover to accuse anyone who doesn't think of DA as a good QB of being a BQ lover. You've never seen me say anything about BQ one way or the other. Just that DA sucks and this team is going nowhere if he is the starter.

[Drunkandstoopid]

Um, we do know, D&S. The Browns finished 4-12. DA was the starter for the crucial first half of the season. How'd we start out again? 1-5, I believe?

 

Oh, and are RAC and Savage still employed by the Browns? No.

 

Finally, do you think they would have been fired had Quinn been playing, regardless of the Browns' finish?

 

No, again.

 

So what were you saying about their decision to play DA again? Still confused?

Actually, coming off a preseason concussion, a preseason that he only played all of 15 plays or so, they started DA over the guy who played all preseason. They started 0 and 3, then won 3 of the next 5 'til Lerner yanked him... 1 and 6 after he was yanked, and that against what you say was a less crucial schedule.

 

RAC and Savage are gone, and people here are scared spitless that DA would have a chance to compete against BQ. It'll be curious what the new regime does.

[NebBrownsFan]

Actually, coming off a preseason concussion, a preseason that he only played all of 15 plays or so, they started DA over the guy who played all preseason. They started 0 and 3, then won 3 of the next 5 'til Lerner yanked him... 1 and 6 after he was yanked, and that against what you say was a less crucial schedule.

 

RAC and Savage are gone, and people here are scared spitless that DA would have a chance to compete against BQ. It'll be curious what the new regime does.

 

Considering there was no competition, it amazes me you still try to claim there was. So Savage's and RAC's word is gospel except for that statement, eh? Oh, and the excuse that LERNER had DA pulled? That's hilarious. You DA lovers sure do grasp for every straw possible....LOL

[Drunkandstoopid]

I might be reading too much into it, but why would Quinn be working with dabol everyday on the playbook if they were going to trade him? Also, where is Anderson? He was playing golf on the west coast most of the off season. Didn't sound like he was even in Berea.

 

Why didn't Kokinis say that Anderson and Quinn are working with Dabol on the new offense and playbook?

 

According to Doerschuk DA's been a regular at Berea: http://blogs.cantonrep.com/2009/04/freshbr...n-in-the-house/

 

Is curious about the playbook question though.

[Timugen]

Is curious about the playbook question though.

 

 

Quinn's probably "working on" the playbook with Dabol because he's not nearly as cerebral as Derek-Bear and needs all the tutoring he can get.

 

 

Either that or they just figure that Anderception will play equally poorly whether he actually knows the offense or not, so why waste the time.

 

 

 

I'm guessing it's the latter.

[cmac12]

Started 2 and 3 not 1 and 5. and ended up at 3 and 5. .375 win percentage. For sure not great but there were some big drops that were momentum changers against Dallas and Baltimore. But, the defense also played well enough to win 2 other games if the offense and DA would have been able to produce. So 5 - 3 was well within reason or at worst 4 -4.

[YtownBrownsBacker]

According to Doerschuk DA's been a regular at Berea: http://blogs.cantonrep.com/2009/04/freshbr...n-in-the-house/

 

Is curious about the playbook question though.

 

Funny, The Golf Channel showed him playing in AZ in a celebrity Pro-Am just a few weeks ago and before that I saw him playing in Palm Springs. He may have been in and out to say hello and maybe work out for awhile, but he has been out west playing golf most of the winter and also in March.

 

I just thought the comment was a little funny that he stated "Quinn and Dabol are upstairs working on the playbook. They have been working everyday". He never mentioned Anderson and was very vague when questioned about his off season surgery. His only comment was,"He's working out". He didn't say where.

 

But, we will know what's going to happen in a week.

[Drunkandstoopid]

Ok tough guy, wanna take the bet I offered Lumnuts?

 

If there is a head to head camp battle I bet Quinn beats the snot out of the Oaf, if the Oaf wins I will leave this board forever, if Quinn wins you have to leave.

 

The caveat to this bet is if there is an injury that prevents one from playing.

Here's the deal. I've always held open the possibility that DA gets traded, loses out to Quinn in a fair battle, or Quinn the same. You've got people here saying DA's worth little and this is Quinn's team, and refusing to even hear of an open competition. I'm not gonna make false offer like you are, frankly I think it lowers you to make offers that you wouldn't honor or expect nobody to take.

[Timugen]

frankly I think it lowers you to make offers that you wouldn't honor or expect nobody to take.

 

 

What a cop-out. I can vouch for Inspecta personally....he'll hold up his end of the deal, even if he's pounding his head in the wall while biting his tongue as he's doing it.

 

If Quinn is unproven and such a sure-fire fcuk-up while DA is the golden god of QB's, then just take his bet. But don't sit there and pull this "...but...but...but...if I win, then you're not gonna keep up your end of the deal, so I just won't do it" BULLSHIT.

 

I'll join Inspecta in this little proposition. If Dexter wins then I will never post on this board again. If Quinn wins, you won't.

 

So, you game?

 

You could kill 2 birds with 1 stone if you're right.

[Timugen]

irrelevant post here.....just needed to get 666 out of my post count.

 

 

[Drunkandstoopid]

What a cop-out. I can vouch for Inspecta personally....he'll hold up his end of the deal, even if he's pounding his head in the wall while biting his tongue as he's doing it.

 

If Quinn is unproven and such a sure-fire fcuk-up while DA is the golden god of QB's, then just take his bet. But don't sit there and pull this "...but...but...but...if I win, then you're not gonna keep up your end of the deal, so I just won't do it" BULLSHIT.

 

I'll join Inspecta in this little proposition. If Dexter wins then I will never post on this board again. If Quinn wins, you won't.

 

So, you game?

 

You could kill 2 birds with 1 stone if you're right.

It's real easy to make "bets" you know nobody's gonna take and them call them chicken.

 

I've never said Quinn's a sure-fire fcuk-up or that DA's the golden god of QB's. Heck, I'm leaving the door wide open for BQ to take the spot. I just think he should take it rather than have it handed to him. That's all. If he's so good, he should be able to.

 

Aloha,

 

Steve

[Timugen]

It's real easy to make "bets" you know nobody's gonna take and them call them chicken.

 

 

Bets that "you know nobody's gonna take?"

 

Luvbergh pops up here regularly verbally fellating DA and bashing BQ.....seems like a guy that would be more than willing to take the bet in question - yet he hasn't.

 

Judging by most of your posts, you're nothing but yet another on the Oralgon Trail Manwagon.

 

You say that Inspecta's bet is one that "nobody's gonna take.".....hmmmmmmmmm....a neutral observer (also known as a BROWNS fan, not a Manwagonner) would just HAVE TO ask the question "Why would NOBODY (according to YOU) take that wager?"

 

Perhaps Dexter isn't quite the stud that you thought he was and you're just hanging on to the slightest sliver of a hope that he will suddenly and miraculously improve areas of his game that he hasn't been able to improve since high school? After all, Quinn's just an unproven, over-hyped QB that had a draft slide.

 

 

And, for some reason excuse, the Manwagon on TheBrownsBoard.com (best website ever), won't put anything on it.

[Earl34]

Mangini and the staff have watched every tape there is of both Quinn and Anderson. They've watched both in minicamp and Daboll is working with both daily in learning the offense. I think they're better suited to figuring out if either guy can win in this league than anyone here. I also think that Kokinis would be a fool not to listen to trade offers since the draft pick cupboard is bare. You people are far too harsh on Anderson which is equally as disconcerting as your love for Quinn. The guy throws 29 (29!) TDs one year and in the span of the next few games becomes a bum? If only life were as simply as these people would make it out to be.

 

I don't care what you have on your team in terms of vets and free agents, if you don't draft well you will either wind up a team full of aging question marks or in salary cap hell. You can't draft right without draft picks.

 

Lastly, I'd caution those of you Quinn lovers who are simply on the "homer bandwagon". I am guilty of this too with some of my hometown guys but at this level of football you MUST look at the roster dispassionately to make decisions. You can't cloud your judgment by giving guys "extra" shots or support them a little more than you normally would because he's from the area. Screw that. I think it's very unusual for a hometown kid to lead his hometown team to victory these days. Leave that for class reunions and fantasy leagues.

[NebBrownsFan]

Mangini and the staff have watched every tape there is of both Quinn and Anderson. They've watched both in minicamp and Daboll is working with both daily in learning the offense. I think they're better suited to figuring out if either guy can win in this league than anyone here. I also think that Kokinis would be a fool not to listen to trade offers since the draft pick cupboard is bare. You people are far too harsh on Anderson which is equally as disconcerting as your love for Quinn. The guy throws 29 (29!) TDs one year and in the span of the next few games becomes a bum? If only life were as simply as these people would make it out to be.

 

I don't care what you have on your team in terms of vets and free agents, if you don't draft well you will either wind up a team full of aging question marks or in salary cap hell. You can't draft right without draft picks.

 

Lastly, I'd caution those of you Quinn lovers who are simply on the "homer bandwagon". I am guilty of this too with some of my hometown guys but at this level of football you MUST look at the roster dispassionately to make decisions. You can't cloud your judgment by giving guys "extra" shots or support them a little more than you normally would because he's from the area. Screw that. I think it's very unusual for a hometown kid to lead his hometown team to victory these days. Leave that for class reunions and fantasy leagues.

 

Its all fine and dandy that he had 29 tds. But he also got darn near half of those in 3 or 4 games against the worst competition. Stop judging DA's 2007 season on TDs alone. Also take into account that he was 2nd in the league in INTs at 19, yet only sacked like 14 times? That's a lotta picks for so little pressure. Also watch the games. He had a few great games, and a few very bad games, and most of them very average games. Everyone keeps talking about how good his first half of 2007 was, but go back and look at the numbers. His inconsistency showed from the very beginning. Not too good against Pitt coming off the bench, but that's excusable, great Cincy game, bad Oak game, good Balt game, bad NE game.

 

The point is, DA cannot be defined by stats alone, nor can any QB. You have actually see how the guy is playing as a whole.

[Flugel]

You forget.

 

 

Geee, more Loverboy reflecting on "The Way We Were" with DA. There's a surprise.

 

I see we're gonna play more keep away from how DA closed his 2006 starts with 4 INTs vrs Tampa. Did he get betetr with each start? Not there.

 

How about 2008? We always play keep away from the 2nd Cincy Game, which was 365 days after the 06 debacle in Tampa. Anyway, DA threw 4 INTs again showing me the same guy I saw exactly 1 year before. Again, was that improvement as he got more starts under his belt?

- Tom F.

[cmac12]

I went to Oregon State and I think DA is better than most give him credit for. But, I do not think he is the long term answer in Cleveland. I am not sure BQ is either but I don't know. But, with that said I will take the Bet. If both QBs are on the roster and niether is traded before the first game I think DA will win the battle (not really but I want to take the bet) for starting QB. If BQ is the starter on game one you can pick a avatar for me, if he is not then you get a avatar that has something to do with DA owning BQ at every level that they have played in. Was higher rated coming out of High School, beat him in head to head competition in College and beat him out as starter of the Browns. Somethign along those lines, that will be fun.

 

Of course if either QB is traded then the bet is null and void.

[Drunkandstoopid]

The point is, DA cannot be defined by stats alone, nor can any QB. You have actually see how the guy is playing as a whole.

Exactly, and I'm sure the coaches and team management are making their decisions base on the whole picture, not just a partial picture like many here.

[Drunkandstoopid]

I think the manwagoners are scared to take the bet due to the finality of it all.

 

How about we change the parameters of the bet to make it more palatable for them when DA gets his ass handed to him.

 

IF DA wins I will put in my sig a pic of DA stating he's the greatest QB of all time. or better yet, I'll let them pick my sig for me and I'll proudly wear that sig for the entire 2009 season. IF BQ wins the bet then I get to pick a sig for them to wear for the entire 2009 season.

 

There, is that easier for you guys to handle or are you still too chicken shit?

 

I'm gonna go ahead and guess the latter...

 

 

Which "manwagoners" have been afraid of an open competition? I've seen many BQ fans here not even wanting that to happen.

 

Now you're talking... A simple "I'm a dumbass when it comes to Quarterbacks, don't listen to me" signature or something along those lines would be fine. No need for total emasculation for either loser. Sadly the tone of this entire argument has been getting more and more hostile, never my intent.