Betsy DeVos

[tiamat63]

So he isn't allowed to do what past administration's have done because a new precedent is set?

 

Trump is free to do (almost) as he damn near pleases. Doesn't make him exempt from appropriate criticism.

 

However he and his ilk are the ones that ran on a platform of being the outsiders of Washington and would make sensible, everyman kind of decisions correcting the course of what HAS been the norm. This is not that.

 

 

No?

 

edit: Unless you would hire a plumber whose main background is IT work?

[DieHardBrownsFan]

 

This mofo is a basement dwelling kid trolling the obscure parts of the Internet claiming to be an old man. You know any 60 year olds that troll the web? I sure as fuck don't. It's creepy as shit.

You're creepy as shit. Some punk. I bet you shave your legs.

[Westside Steve]

Did you read that Snopes article? Or did you pull a Cal?

 

What did I say that was wrong?

Yes I read it that's why I posted it. Many of the pros and cons of her nomination are listed and excused or debunked.

I'm not picking a fight with you here just wondering as I assume you are.

 

WSS

[Erie Dawg]

How do you know that she can't do the job? Has she already made a tragic mistake? If she does I won't back her.

How many here have ever interviewed someone for a job?

I have found just as many if not more qualified people without degrees. Sometimes the ones with degrees almost feel entitled to the position.

[calfoxwc]

yep. Because their pres - can have a communist as an advisor and they won't say a peep.

if you aren't in lockstep with liberalism garbage.... you are nevert "qualified".

 

"She currently chairs the American Federation for Children, an organization that promotes "school choice" in the form of education vouchers, scholarship tax credits, and the like. "

 

She is invested in children, has children, she is very successful, and it takes someone

who isn't career-wise "on the take" to see the problems objectively. Most of the time,

you worked in the school system, you either had to fight indoctrination or you get indoctrinated.

 

saying she isn't qualifed because she isn't on the NEA's side... is sad. Did you guys

complain about Clinton's choice? A lawyer?

 

I think not. You are just barking up the old "we change it because the president is a different party" nonsense.

[tiamat63]

You're creepy as shit. Some punk. I bet you shave your legs.

 

Oh, I think I hit a nerve.

 

How do you know that she can't do the job?

 

 

That is just.... THE worst logic I've ever heard. Maybe we should hire neurosurgeons that previously worked at daycares because, hey, how in the fuck do you know they CAN'T do the job. AMIRITE?!?

 

How many here have ever interviewed someone for a job?

 

I have. More times than I care to count. What's your point to this?

 

I have found just as many if not more qualified people without degrees. Sometimes the ones with degrees almost feel entitled to the position.

 

Have you ever interviewed someone in a panel committee for an appointment to the leader of a federal department?

[calfoxwc]

I think when you CHAIR the AMERICAN FEDERATION FOR CHILDREN,

you understand a hell of a lot about public education issues.

 

That's obviously why they didn't put their kids in public schools.

 

Did obamao have his kids in public schools? So, he was unqualified to nominate anybody

for Sec of Ed ?

 

What school does Obama's daughters attend?

Described as "the Harvard of Washington's private schools", the school has educated children of notable politicians, including those of several presidents. Both of United States President Barack Obama's daughters, Sasha and Malia, and Vice President Joe Biden's grandchildren attend the school.

[Westside Steve]

 

The 'attack' term was meant more for Cal, but you did criticize Clinton's pick from 20 years ago, which is fine, but irrelevant. It's basically arguing that the precedent makes it okay to appoint someone with no experience. I thought Trump was supposed to be the outsider who was going to do things differently in Washington? So how is appointing someone with zero qualifications different than doing something you claim has been happening in Washington for decades?

The demand for qualifications seems to be a little bit hazy and shifts one way or the other depending on whose candidate we are discussing.

Frankly I'm not sure that a CEO of a computer company wouldn't be a good choice for CEO of an agricultural firm or an automotive company.

I remember talking to a sales guy who believed that if he could sell guitars you could sell refrigerators or cars or men's clothing.

So I don't know exactly what qualifications would make her better. I'm not just blindly defending her but I would think that growing up business-wise in the teachers union would not be a positive thing.

A different example would Joe Thomas necessarily be a better head coach than Bill Belichick.

 

WSS

[DieHardBrownsFan]

 

Oh, I think I hit a nerve.

 

Yes indeed. I'm so mad I could melt a snowflake.

[calfoxwc]

I'm sure that obamao's sec of ed were longtime progressive wonks in the public schools.

 

guess what. they didn't fix anything. That is why you get someone invested longterm

in FIXING the problem.

[Clevfan4life]

Like the housing secretary has experience in public housing you mean?

?

[Osiris]

The demand for qualifications seems to be a little bit hazy and shifts one way or the other depending on whose candidate we are discussing.

Frankly I'm not sure that a CEO of a computer company wouldn't be a good choice for CEO of an agricultural firm or an automotive company.

I remember talking to a sales guy who believed that if he could sell guitars you could sell refrigerators or cars or men's clothing.

So I don't know exactly what qualifications would make her better. I'm not just blindly defending her but I would think that growing up business-wise in the teachers union would not be a positive thing.

A different example would Joe Thomas necessarily be a better head coach than Bill Belichick.

 

WSS

 

Sure, there is no denying that the demand for qualifications is going to come from the opposing party. That doesn't mean a demand for qualifications shouldn't come. The Education Secretary's job, however, is not retail, and that's what you are comparing it to. The qualifications that would make her better would be the management of both public and private school systems so that she could see the flaws and strengths of each and try to address them.

[calfoxwc]

oh, baloney. the reps confirmed all sorts of appts by obamao, that did NOT

suscribe to their stances.

 

but NOW, of course, that table is turned. "devos bad, not on our side, boo hoo, dammit"

[Osiris]

So he isn't allowed to do what past administration's have done because a new precedent is set?

 

He can do what he is legally allowed to do, but don't complain when he is criticized for it. Many of the Republicans here criticized plenty of Obama's appointments. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If it was wrong when Clinton did it, then it is wrong when Trump does it, too.

[Clevfan4life]

Just read about this grizzly thing. What a completely unintelligible and frankly stocky shortsy rationale for guns in schools, which btw im not against. I dontbthink its a bad idea at all anymore for a teacher or two to be well trained and carrying. But i can sit infront of a bunch of pasty old white men and make my case without resorting to referencing the ursidae genus. I thought trump was all about smart people, but with a few exceptions the people he's putting in his cabinet seem to be legitimized idiots

[calfoxwc]

I don't think so. I was here. you weren't. name one. I'm curious.

[Westside Steve]

 

Sure, there is no denying that the demand for qualifications is going to come from the opposing party. That doesn't mean a demand for qualifications shouldn't come. The Education Secretary's job, however, is not retail, and that's what you are comparing it to. The qualifications that would make her better would be the management of both public and private school systems so that she could see the flaws and strengths of each and try to address them.

I guess education is closer to retail then you might want to believe.

Still I think she would be attacked if she spent her entire life as a teacher and believed charter schools should receive public financing. I think it's ideology not experience.

 

WSS

[calfoxwc]

Just read about this grizzly thing. What a completely unintelligible and frankly stocky shortsy rationale for guns in schools, which btw im not against. I dontbthink its a bad idea at all anymore for a teacher or two to be well trained and carrying. But i can sit infront of a bunch of pasty old white men and make my case without resorting to referencing the ursidae genus. I thought trump was all about smart people, but with a few exceptions the people he's putting in his cabinet seem to be legitimized idiots

 

"...and now...for the REST of the story.."

 

http://q13fox.com/2017/01/18/wyoming-school-district-cited-by-education-nominee-betsy-devos-grizzlies-yes-guns-no/

[Osiris]

oh, baloney. the reps confirmed all sorts of appts by obamao, that did NOT

suscribe to their stances.

 

but NOW, of course, that table is turned. "devos bad, not on our side, boo hoo, dammit"

 

And when Trump did select a good, qualified candidate, he was confirmed. General Mattis, Defense Secretary. Confirmed by a vote of 98-1. An excellent, perfectly qualified candidate. It's not about partisan politics, though that's the only lens you are able to see things through.

 

Devos is not qualified. The only person being partisan here is you, blindly supporting her because she is Trump's pick and not based on qualifications. If Trump puts forward someone as qualified as Mattis was for Defense Secretary, I would be all for it.

[Erie Dawg]

 

He can do what he is legally allowed to do, but don't complain when he is criticized for it. Many of the Republicans here criticized plenty of Obama's appointments. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If it was wrong when Clinton did it, then it is wrong when Trump does it, too.

Very true but don't come off as shocked when someone didnt attend public school or university but got the job anyway. I don't have to even go back to the Clinton administration to find a career politician receiveing a position the he or she wasn't qualified for and I feel you know that. I encouraged posters to look it up if you feel it hasn't happened. We know that it happens at every level of government. It happens even where some of usay work.

[Clevfan4life]

 

"...and now...for the REST of the story.."

 

http://q13fox.com/2017/01/18/wyoming-school-district-cited-by-education-nominee-betsy-devos-grizzlies-yes-guns-no/

So she's not arguing for ccw's in schools? So why talk about bears infront of a confirmation hearing?

[Osiris]

I guess education is closer to retail then you might want to believe.

Still I think she would be attacked if she spent her entire life as a teacher and believed charter schools should receive public financing. I think it's ideology not experience.

 

WSS

 

We run a family daycare so, limited as that might be, so I have some idea of how much of it is 'retail' and how much of it is not. You may be right, she might be criticized for her ideology, but if she arrived at that ideology after having experienced the gamut of schooling options, I personally would be convinced as to her qualifications.

[Osiris]

Very true but don't come off as shocked when someone didnt attend public school or university but got the job anyway. I don't have to even go back to the Clinton administration to find a career politician receiveing a position the he or she wasn't qualified for and I feel you know that. I encouraged posters to look it up if you feel it hasn't happened. We know that it happens at every level of government. It happens even where some of usay work.

 

The fact that she went through private schooling her whole life is a non-issue to me, as is her advocacy for charter schools, which I'm not against either. The issue is what she's done since then does not qualify her to be Secretary of Education. She's never run a loan program, never run a bank, never administered a school. Surely Trump can come up with a better candidate who also is open to Charter Schools.

[tiamat63]

Yes indeed. I'm so mad I could melt a snowflake.

...can't tell if that's an attempt at a joke or you're making a pass at me?

 

Feels like the latter. No, thanks.

[Westside Steve]

 

We run a family daycare so, limited as that might be, so I have some idea of how much of it is 'retail' and how much of it is not. You may be right, she might be criticized for her ideology, but if she arrived at that ideology after having experienced the gamut of schooling options, I personally would be convinced as to her qualifications.

I'm sure it's possible that you would. Of course I think you may be in a small minority of Democrat voters. If in fact you voted for Hillary or oppose Trump.

 

Just an aside i minored in secondary education. And Cal's wife is a lifelong school teacher I believe right?

 

Case in point the biggest story from her nomination has been the grizzly bears.

 

WSS

[The Cysko Kid]

 

The 'attack' term was meant more for Cal, but you did criticize Clinton's pick from 20 years ago, which is fine, but irrelevant. It's basically arguing that the precedent makes it okay to appoint someone with no experience. I thought Trump was supposed to be the outsider who was going to do things differently in Washington? So how is appointing someone with zero qualifications different than doing something you claim has been happening in Washington for decades?

You claim it hasn't been happening. Which is it? Apparently Obama's nominees were eminently qualified and yet what did we get? Common core and sliding American academic performance that should be a national shame.

[Osiris]

You claim it hasn't been happening. Which is it? Apparently Obama's nominees were eminently qualified and yet what did we get? Common core and sliding American academic performance that should be a national shame.

 

You're kind of jumping into a convo with Erie mid-stream. I didn't claim it wasn't happening. I am claiming that the fact that it happened in the past doesn't mean it is the right thing to continue doing.

[calfoxwc]

And Cal's wife is a lifelong school teacher I believe right? Steve

**************************************

Yes. She is retired, too, now. We are having a blast. She was always very

conservative, obviously kept her politics to herself. The one time the union

rep smarted off to her because she couldn't get her to commit to voting for

obamao.... all her friends teachers went to the union rep and told her to STFU,

and never pull that again. My Wife simply smiled and told her to mind her own business,

and walked away. Her fellow teachers got involved, and made sure I knew they did. lol

I would have made a visit to the school....

 

You know, a lawyer who goes to a friend's church, led the way to building a wheelchair ramp

for someone in their church who is now disabled. He didn't have to be a professional ramp builder.

My Wife and I built a ramp for a friend, we never did it before. But it turned out outstanding.

Of course, she's so brilliant she designed it in her head, and I cut up the cutouts, and she drilled the

holes... no blueprint. We built one before. It was excellent, per the friend's Mom and her brother,

who is disabled. Were we "qualified" ? sure. We could do it. Should a sunday school teacher not

be one because she never taught before? come on.

 

It's pretty apparent that one who is ingrained in the status quo, doesn't fix it. That is why previous politicians

didn't fix it. That is why it's outstanding that Trump worked in private sector - he won't be ingrained

in the status quo. That is how you get things looked at objectively, with no bias.

 

Obamao's two sec of ed nominees were very heavily ingrained in the public education status quo.

They went along for the ride, didn't fix diddley squat, and their bragging rights common core was

as much a political bragging/reality sucking bunch of crap as was obamaocare.

Made things worse, but it was part of their "legacy".

 

That's why they refused to allow reps to have any part in the solution.

[MLD Woody]

Yes I read it that's why I posted it. Many of the pros and cons of her nomination are listed and excused or debunked.

I'm not picking a fight with you here just wondering as I assume you are.

 

WSS

You posted in a clearly condescending tone that I was getting my information from memes. You then provided a link to Snopes, as if to debunk something. You've yet to tell me what I've said that was incorrect

 

 

Are you gonna try to moonwalk all of the way out of this?

[MLD Woody]

So.... Has anyone actually said why she's a good pick yet?

 

I'm just reading a bunch of "Well Clinton picked unqualified people too!"