We are still going to take....

[The Gipper]

Also:   Here is the list of Heisman Trophy Winning Quarterbacks who have made the Pro Football Hall of Fame:

Roger Staubach

and....

.....that's IT!!

(Paul Hornung played some QB in college, but made the HOF primarily as a all purpose back)

But, you never know....maybe Mayfield will become the next Roger Staubach.

[The Gipper]

13 hours ago, PoeticG said:

Make no mistake, he's no Kevin Hogan. Crazy Kev is the mafaqin man. You'll see.

"Mafaqin" ?  Is that an anagram? An acronym?  Somewhere in there those letters must stand for  "Fuyuck.  My. Queer. Arse.

[stillmotion]

1 minute ago, tiamat63 said:

Actually that would be you.  I've asked for your assessment beyond "HEISMAN, STATS, WINNER, LEADER"... still has yet to happen.

 

Also PFF grades aren't indicative of translatable NFL skill.   Those geeks are cool but some things can't be quantified by numbers. 

How are stats not part of assessment? the heck else you accessing?

Oh yeah thats right, the video of him getting in trouble. And the fact that he's 6'1. Let's write him off and ride Rosen in on a golden chair because of that video.

[stillmotion]

4 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

Also:   Here is the list of Heisman Trophy Winning Quarterbacks who have made the Pro Football Hall of Fame:

Roger Staubach

and....

.....that's IT!!

(Paul Hornung played some QB in college, but made the HOF primarily as a all purpose back)

But, you never know....maybe Mayfield will become the next Roger Staubach.

Or he could suck, but i'm just sick of everyone writing him off without giving him a chance. Rosen is just as likely to be Manziel 2.0 as Mayfield is.

[stillmotion]

11 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Actually that would be you.  I've asked for your assessment beyond "HEISMAN, STATS, WINNER, LEADER"... still has yet to happen.

 

Also PFF grades aren't indicative of translatable NFL skill.   Those geeks are cool but some things can't be quantified by numbers. 

And I like him because he has one of the highest completion percentages in college football. He's accurate but can still make the big throws. He makes the players around him better. He finds a way to win, something that the browns lack. He has tough drive, and he's more of a pocket passer then people give him credit for. 

Of course if stats, accuracy, and winning don't matter to you, I guess you must've rated Kizer incredibly high last year for having big size, and hardly winning and all.

I'd rather have a QB with guts who can ball out then a dude with a big arm without any accuracy.

[The Gipper]

12 minutes ago, stillmotion said:

Or he could suck, but i'm just sick of everyone writing him off without giving him a chance. Rosen is just as likely to be Manziel 2.0 as Mayfield is.

I am not on any of these guys bandwagons...not really.   Some people think that this draft may be like 1983 again.....with 5 outstanding qBs taken.

Or, it could be like the year that the likes of Blaine Gabbert, Christian Ponder, Jake Locker, etc. got drafted.  Or they could be 1999  with Couch, Akili Smith, Cade McNown.   Maybe there is a Daunte Culpepper or Donovan McNabb in there.  Or 2007....Russell and Quinn.

Or...it could be 2004.....Eli, Rivers, BR.

God only knows.....and I don't think she actually cares.

[Tour2ma]

14 hours ago, Tacosman said:

a qb at the top of the first round likely this year.  Whether we pick up a guy like AJ or not.

And we should.  it's the right move.  Darnold or Rosen.

Agree... nothing has changed.

[Mark O]

Just now, Tour2ma said:

Agree... nothing has changed.

Just hoping that Dorsey is as good at spotting talent as the reports say he is. 

[Tour2ma]

I love it when "hope" is the plan.... yippee!

[Mark O]

1 minute ago, Tour2ma said:

I love it when "hope" is the plan.... yippee!

Basically the same plan in my mind as with Sushi making the decisions.  I hoped he made the right choices too.    Ultimately, I don't care who's calling the shots or calling the plays, I just want the team to win games.

[Nero]

Just now, Mark O said:

Basically the same plan in my mind as with Sushi making the decisions.  I hoped he made the right choices too.    Ultimately, I don't care who's calling the shots or calling the plays, I just want the team to win games.

Same feeling here. Yesterday I was a bit angry with Jimmy for keeping Hue and firing Sashi, I was intrigued to know what would this process develop into and wanted Sashi to keep his job, but if this change works out for the better, I don't care who's in charge. 

[tiamat63]

1 hour ago, stillmotion said:

And I like him because he has one of the highest completion percentages in college football. He's accurate but can still make the big throws. He makes the players around him better. He finds a way to win, something that the browns lack. He has tough drive, and he's more of a pocket passer then people give him credit for. 

Of course if stats, accuracy, and winning don't matter to you, I guess you must've rated Kizer incredibly high last year for having big size, and hardly winning and all.

I'd rather have a QB with guts who can ball out then a dude with a big arm without any accuracy.

Like I said, you got nothing.   You base his accuracy off of completion percentage alone.      And right on queue "LEADER, WINNER".        

I'm telling you what you're going to say and you do it.   It's like you're a puppet and my hand is right up your butt.  

[stillmotion]

27 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Like I said, you got nothing.   You base his accuracy off of completion percentage alone.      And right on queue "LEADER, WINNER".        

I'm telling you what you're going to say and you do it.   It's like you're a puppet and my hand is right up your butt.  

you listed five things that are done in almost every evaluation. how do you not take into account any stats in an evaluation? that's just stupid. i never said leader ever. how do you not take in account a quarterbacks accuracy?

basically you have your argument set up that if Baker is X, it doesn't matter. So anything positive I try to argue for in Baker, you deem it X because you won't acknowledge X. You can't correctly analyze a player if you don't take into account his situation, his team, his accuracy, his size, and all of the variables. I based his accuracy off the fact that he's been one of the most accurate college QB's. Way more accurate then Rosen. Let's flip it, and you tell me why Mayfield isn't good. I've told you my argument. You don't have ANY STATS to back anything up. Just a gut feeling, which is hardly an evaluation.

[crstphr2]

Baker Mayfield.

He walked on to Texas Tech and TOOK the starting job.

He transferred to Oklahoma and TOOK the starting job away from a QB that had just lit up Alabama.

He has had to earn everything.

His teammates carried his jersey onto the field for the coin flip the game he was suspended from being captain.

Everyone wants to follow him.

He is toying with most teams

He has played in college for four full years.

He is the type who will come into camp and TAKE the starting job for himself.

Where it goes from there is anyone's guess

 

[LogicIsForSquares]

9 minutes ago, crstphr2 said:

Baker Mayfield.

He walked on to Texas Tech and TOOK the starting job.

He transferred to Oklahoma and TOOK the starting job away from a QB that had just lit up Alabama.

He has had to earn everything.

His teammates carried his jersey onto the field for the coin flip the game he was suspended from being captain.

Everyone wants to follow him.

He is toying with most teams

He has played in college for four full years.

He is the type who will come into camp and TAKE the starting job for himself.

Where it goes from there is anyone's guess

 

Thank you, Baker's future agent. Your first post was riveting.

[Hempman]

Rosen will be the pick and Hue will get his way. I doubt Dorsey will agree, but after his personal disaster in KC, he has to play the long game. Rosen can still run a Holmgren/Reid WCO system down the road imo, if he need be.

Jimmy really is a dumb sheet.

[The Gipper]

10 minutes ago, crstphr2 said:

Baker Mayfield.

He walked on to Texas Tech and TOOK the starting job.

He transferred to Oklahoma and TOOK the starting job away from a QB that had just lit up Alabama.

He has had to earn everything.

His teammates carried his jersey onto the field for the coin flip the game he was suspended from being captain.

Everyone wants to follow him.

He is toying with most teams

He has played in college for four full years.

He is the type who will come into camp and TAKE the starting job for himself.

Where it goes from there is anyone's guess

 

Sounds like John P. Manziel Jr.

[tiamat63]

56 minutes ago, stillmotion said:

you listed five things that are done in almost every evaluation. how do you not take into account any stats in an evaluation? that's just stupid. i never said leader ever. how do you not take in account a quarterbacks accuracy?

basically you have your argument set up that if Baker is X, it doesn't matter. So anything positive I try to argue for in Baker, you deem it X because you won't acknowledge X. You can't correctly analyze a player if you don't take into account his situation, his team, his accuracy, his size, and all of the variables. I based his accuracy off the fact that he's been one of the most accurate college QB's. Way more accurate then Rosen. Let's flip it, and you tell me why Mayfield isn't good. I've told you my argument. You don't have ANY STATS to back anything up. Just a gut feeling, which is hardly an evaluation.

I've already watched 10 full games of his.   I was polite enough to give a play by play breakdown of the entire 1st half on the Bedlam game just to convey an insight on what I see.  

Go on...tell me about "gut feeling" again.

 

Also, I'm always up for sig bets.  DBone declined that once, and a couple others decline ones based on Manziel.      Care to break the cycle?

[jcam222]

20 hours ago, Tacosman said:

mayfield doesnt have the type of arm talent you look for as a high first round draft pick

I vaguely remember hearing about this Watson kid that didn't have an arm too...........then he threw like 20 TD's in 5 games or so

[PoeticG]

It's not about arm strength as much as what you don't see with Quarterbacks. 

[Dutch Oven]

15 hours ago, stillmotion said:

Baker will win the Heisman and national championship and it still won’t change anyone’s view on the board. They’ll still hate him then. I see the “it” factor will him. He’s something special. Haters gonna hate though.

Now you got me curious how many QBs have won the Heisman and a National Title the same year...

[BaconHound]

I hope Dorsey is his own man.  If the organization from top to bottom think there is a QB worth drafting, then do it.  If they believe that there isn't add depth and talent, no knee-jerk decisions.  

[Dutch Oven]

3 minutes ago, BaconHound said:

I hope Dorsey is his own man.  If the organization from top to bottom think there is a QB worth drafting, then do it.  If they believe that there isn't add depth and talent, no knee-jerk decisions.  

I honestly can't think of a non-QB that would be worthy of the #1 pick... It's 4+ months from the Draft, though.

[BaconHound]

Just now, Dutch Oven said:

I honestly can't think of a non-QB that would be worthy of the #1 pick... It's 4+ months from the Draft, though.

I haven't looked at it yet but I'm not anti-trade down.  I would like a GM who sees NFL talent.

[RoyceRolls]

11 hours ago, crstphr2 said:

Baker Mayfield.

He walked on to Texas Tech and TOOK the starting job.

He transferred to Oklahoma and TOOK the starting job away from a QB that had just lit up Alabama.

He has had to earn everything.

His teammates carried his jersey onto the field for the coin flip the game he was suspended from being captain.

Everyone wants to follow him.

He is toying with most teams

He has played in college for four full years.

He is the type who will come into camp and TAKE the starting job for himself.

Where it goes from there is anyone's guess

 

Welcome to the board!

 To how many other message boards have you copy/pasted this canned endorsement? 

[RoyceRolls]

It’s starting already. Last time there was a scrappy-doo college ball superstar with questionable character entering the draft, we had an influx of fanboys.

Remember Retard? 

Edit: (StocktonS)

[jiggins7919]

The trade down would be hysterical, but it could also work in our favor IF we still secure free qb we target AND we don't trade down THAT far. So if we take Rosen at #1, and then another team is dying to trade up to 8 to get THEIR QB, it might be worth it but only if we stay near the middle area of the round. I don't want to fall down to #27 or so. 

It also depends on who is available. If the #1 CB/S Minkah Fitzpatrick is there, then I think we have to take him. I seriously doubt he'll be there, but we're still in December and a lot can happen. As much as we need offense, I don't think we can go QB at 1 and then go WR at 8 (or wherever Houston pick is). We need defense too, we need defensive IMPACT players. We are desperate for a stud corner or a stud safety, and this just isn't the draft for that. Unfortunately, that was last year, and it's another example of Sashi failing to get us what we need. The Peppers pick is truly shaping up to be something awful, and while I try to remember he's a young player in a new role, it's shocking to me that he literally has ZERO impact plays for the year. He's basically done nothing on defense, special teams, and hasn't played offense. Again, he's young, but you don't expect your first rounder to basically give you NOTHING. 

I don't know who is slated to be available next year for safeties, but hopefully we're able to grab one. We tried hard for Jefferson and he took less money to go elsewhere. That's going to happen. Let's get the next one and draft somebody to learn behind him. It's a passing league and we absolutely failed this year at stopping qb's, as evidenced by the opposition's qb rating average of 102. That's not a typo. I haven't done research on the matter, but I don't remember ever seeing a stat like that. We don't get to the qb enough, we blitz too much as a result, and this leaves us vulnerable in the secondary. This is something we have to shore up if we're ever going to be competitive. Too many games it looks like the other team is just playing pitch and catch all the way down the field, and the last two games our opponents didn't even punt until the SECOND HALF. That's disgusting. We don't catch interceptions, we don't recover fumbles, and nobody knows why. These are the type of game-changing plays we haven't been making for years, and it's a big reason why we don't win. Just look at the Chargers game. That fumble before half would've changed the entire game. We just scored a TD on a beautiful play. The Chargers got the ball after half and had plenty of time for a FG attempt before the quarter ended. That fumble hit our guy in the hands, and while he had a OL draped all over him, he still HAD to make that play. We get that ball back at around their 10 yard line and find a way to punch it in....that's HUGE. Alas, the Bolts have a 3rd and 16 and easily convert to Benji. Same old Browns. I believe the Bolts went down and kicked a FG this drive. That's a 10 point swing. 

 

[The Gipper]

16 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

Now you got me curious how many QBs have won the Heisman and a National Title the same year...

Its what Google is for.   I think...in recent vintage, didn't  both Winston and Newton do that?

In checking...yes, those two...plus:  Danny Wuerffel,  Matt Leinert, Charlie Ward, Johnny Lujack, Angelo Bertelli, and Davey O'Brien.

Plus there were some RBs and other positions:

http://heisman.com/news/2015/1/12/heisman_and_national_champion.aspx?path=football

[Tour2ma]

16 hours ago, PoeticG said:

It's not about arm strength as much as what you don't see with Quarterbacks. 

???

 

[jcam222]

4 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

???

 

 

4 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

???

 

I think PG's comment is relevant to the importance of intangibles,  eye speed,  leadership qualities, ability to prepare and just general intelligence.