Browns cut's

[Flugel]

33 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

I'm not one to revel in another man losing his job, but how in the hell Jordan Elliot survived the first and second round of cuts is just beyond me?

I hear ya!  I'll try to slap a positive on this subject - Jordan Elliott was the Most Invisibly Improved player on the team.  

[Neo]

1 hour ago, Coyote said:

Austin Watkins, Jaelon Darden, T.Togiai, Demetric Felton Jr., Isaiah Thomas, Michael Dunn among the #Browns not making the initial 53 - but many will be back on PS or roster; Mohamoud Diabate and Ronnie Hickman have played their way onto the 53.  Per Mary K.

I don't know how somebody could have had one of the best if not THE best pre-season at WR and not mmake the 53 man roster. Only in Cleveland I guess. Unbelievable.

[SdBacker80]

I had Tommy AND Hurst ahead of Elliot.  Aside from Garrett kicking inside I don’t believe we have enough positional flexibility to go with 4 DTs especially when one is named Jordan Elliot and the other is heavy legged rookie

If I’m being honest Watkins is better than Bell.

Was Mitchell kept for Special Teams?

I like Charlie Thomas a lot…I hope we can tuck him away on the PS

now that I said it…let’s roll this is a good roster 

[tiamat63]

1 hour ago, Neo said:

I don't know how somebody could have had one of the best if not THE best pre-season at WR and not mmake the 53 man roster. Only in Cleveland I guess. Unbelievable.

 

 Seemingly every season Browns fans, really most NFL fans for that matter, get obsessed with a player who has a good pre-season.   The overwhelming majority of the time that player ends up going on to do very little.    I liked the kid, it's entirely possible he clears waivers.  If so, I'd be content using a protected practice squad spot on him.

[alporcini]

1 hour ago, SdBacker80 said:

 

I like Charlie Thomas a lot…I hope we can tuck him away on the PS

now that I said it…let’s roll this is a good roster 

I’m with you in Charlie. He laid some crushing hits!

[SdBacker80]

13 minutes ago, alporcini said:

I’m with you in Charlie. He laid some crushing hits!

Yes! And his tape at GA Tech is equally impressive 

[Orion]

Finally, Felton is gone.  But I bet, like a bad penny, he'll be back.

Too bad for Watkins.  But disappearing in the final game didn't help him.  Perhaps he can get to the PS.

[Dutch Oven]

2 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

 

 Seemingly every season Browns fans, really most NFL fans for that matter, get obsessed with a player who has a good pre-season.   The overwhelming majority of the time that player ends up going on to do very little.    I liked the kid, it's entirely possible he clears waivers.  If so, I'd be content using a protected practice squad spot on him.

Who was that hippie TE people loved a few years ago that now sells healing crystals? 

He was a cool cat. 

[Unsympathetic]

1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

Who was that hippie TE

Baker Mayfield?

I don't understand the benefit of Wright and Kunaszyk both "making" the roster for 8 seconds.. Does their contract status change if they go on IR before vs after declaring the 53?

[Bob806]

1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

Who was that hippie TE people loved a few years ago that now sells healing crystals? 

He was a cool cat. 

Cajuste?

[SdBacker80]

Davion Davis last year too was a training camp hero if I recall. 
 

He had a nice catch this weekend but he was cut by the Cards today 
 

 

[tiamat63]

3 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

Who was that hippie TE people loved a few years ago that now sells healing crystals? 

He was a cool cat. 

Not sure, but if he's splitting those shrooms then he's alright by me. 

[gumby73]

4 hours ago, Orion said:

Too bad for Watkins.  But disappearing in the final game didn't help him.  Perhaps he can get to the PS.

  Most 11 on 11 camp video's, were not allowed during camp practices. But with all the injured WR personal at camp(Coop/Grant/Schwartz/Goodwin/Darden) You'd have to certainly hope the coaching staff saw Watkins against Ward/Newsome/Emerson at sometime... I can only recall preseason games where Watkins was covered by back-up corners. The Eagles, 2 day inter squad might have been Watkins toughest days? Don't recall him doing much. 

Watkins is not gifted with the best shake nor speed.. But damn, he gets open & caught everything that touched his hands all camp/pre-season 

Man! You just hope the staff got this call right!

[Unsympathetic]

1 hour ago, gumby73 said:

is not gifted with the best shake nor speed.. But damn, he gets open & caught everything that touched his hands

So he's a less athletic Bell?  I'm just happy the WR room is 6 deep this season, can't remember the last time

[ballpeen]

12 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

I'm not one to revel in another man losing his job, but how in the hell Jordan Elliot survived the first and second round of cuts is just beyond me?

I agree.  All I can figure is Schwartz sees something in him or Berry has had a team or two sniffing around and he thinks he can trade him for something.

[ballpeen]

3 hours ago, gumby73 said:

  Most 11 on 11 camp video's, were not allowed during camp practices. But with all the injured WR personal at camp(Coop/Grant/Schwartz/Goodwin/Darden) You'd have to certainly hope the coaching staff saw Watkins against Ward/Newsome/Emerson at sometime... I can only recall preseason games where Watkins was covered by back-up corners. The Eagles, 2 day inter squad might have been Watkins toughest days? Don't recall him doing much. 

Watkins is not gifted with the best shake nor speed.. But damn, he gets open & caught everything that touched his hands all camp/pre-season 

Man! You just hope the staff got this call right!

Tough calls have to be made.  Goodwin brings the speed a team likes to have to help stretch things on the vertical.  In the end I don't think it was Goodwin or any of the other receivers who bounced Watkins off the 53.  I think it was Diabate or Hickman.  Probably more Hickman.  Diabate got a pretty sizeable signing bonus to sign with us as a UDFA.  I think it was 5th round money.  In the end both of those guys will be able to make immediate contributions on special teams for sure and possibly the D as a whole.  Both of those areas needed more help than the WR room did.  At best Watkins was only going to see very limited action this season.  I also think the teams feels that Watkins has the best chance to clear waivers.  The guy is already 25 which is nearing that barrier age of 30 for wide receivers.

We have to remember, our philosophy, or roster strategy has changed.  Gone are the days where projecting guys 2-3 years down the road have taken a back seat to how can a player help todays team?  That's what happens when you establish a pretty solid roster and are looking at winning today more than developing players for the future.

 

 

[TexasAg1969]

22 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

 

 Seemingly every season Browns fans, really most NFL fans for that matter, get obsessed with a player who has a good pre-season.   The overwhelming majority of the time that player ends up going on to do very little.    I liked the kid, it's entirely possible he clears waivers.  If so, I'd be content using a protected practice squad spot on him.

Just out of curiosity (and laziness), how many "protected" PS spots are there?

[tiamat63]

1 hour ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Just out of curiosity (and laziness), how many "protected" PS spots are there?

4?!?! Uno moment. 

 

Yeah Google says 4.  

[Orion]

4 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

Yeah Google says 4. 

Ask Google how we know who's protected and who isn't.

[Flugel]

On 8/30/2023 at 1:08 AM, ballpeen said:

Tough calls have to be made.  Goodwin brings the speed a team likes to have to help stretch things on the vertical.  In the end I don't think it was Goodwin or any of the other receivers who bounced Watkins off the 53.  I think it was Diabate or Hickman.  Probably more Hickman.  Diabate got a pretty sizeable signing bonus to sign with us as a UDFA.  I think it was 5th round money.  In the end both of those guys will be able to make immediate contributions on special teams for sure and possibly the D as a whole.  Both of those areas needed more help than the WR room did.  At best Watkins was only going to see very limited action this season.  I also think the teams feels that Watkins has the best chance to clear waivers.  The guy is already 25 which is nearing that barrier age of 30 for wide receivers.

We have to remember, our philosophy, or roster strategy has changed.  Gone are the days where projecting guys 2-3 years down the road have taken a back seat to how can a player help todays team?  That's what happens when you establish a pretty solid roster and are looking at winning today more than developing players for the future.

 

 

Those are some good points you made. I still think the Browns probably had a pre-set volume of WRs they wanted to keep (but alter for the reasons you noted).  I like Goodwin's speed and all; but his usage the last 3 years he played seems a little limited to me per stats copied and pasted below.  2 of the last 3 years he only scored 1 TD and had a longest reception of 38 yards.  I don't know how fast Watkins is; but he impressed a lot of us every time we saw him play.  The job is to get open and catch the ball - or catch the ball when covered well. Watkins looked like he did all that extremely well when given the opportunities. Schwartz often ran himself into coverage when he was open or he dropped the ball when he remained open.  The Browns kept him around for 3 years while nothing about him jumped off the screen that said "THIS GUY IS A FOOTBALL PLAYER."  Please give me a WR like Brian Brennan over someone that can just run fast.  Maybe they're thinking David Bell can develop into something like that. We shall see...

Year Year	Team Team	REC Total receptions	YDS Receiving yards	AVG Receiving yards per reception	LNG Longest reception	TD Receiving touchdowns	YDS Rushing yards	AVG Average yards per carry
2022	Seahawks	27	387	14.3	38	4	5	2.5
2021	Bears	20	313	15.7	50	1	-1	-0.5
2019	49ers	12	186	15.5	38	1	15	15.0

[tiamat63]

13 hours ago, Orion said:

Ask Google how we know who's protected and who isn't.

Google says to look for the guys with a '!' above their heads.  

 

.... I think they might be giving me instructions on how to play Zelda? 

[ballpeen]

The practice squad rules below, as there seems to be some confusion.  How and when a team has to designate the 4 protected players in unknown, but it doesn't really matter as long as the team and league knows.

 

NFL practice squad salaries: Minimum salary, eligibility rules & more to know for 2023 (msn.com)

[ballpeen]

33 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Google says to look for the guys with a '!' above their heads.  

 

.... I think they might be giving me instructions on how to play Zelda? 

LOl....and  in the end, does it really matter if we know?  I've never had someone from the FO call to ask me if I agreed or approved.

 

Just saying...

[ballpeen]

48 minutes ago, Flugel said:

Those are some good points you made. I still think the Browns probably had a pre-set volume of WRs they wanted to keep (but alter for the reasons you noted).  I like Goodwin's speed and all; but his usage the last 3 years he played seems a little limited to me per stats copied and pasted below.  2 of the last 3 years he only scored 1 TD and had a longest reception of 38 yards.  I don't know how fast Watkins is; but he impressed a lot of us every time we saw him play.  The job is to get open and catch the ball - or catch the ball when covered well. Watkins looked like he did all that extremely well when given the opportunities. Schwartz often ran himself into coverage when he was open or he dropped the ball when he remained open.  The Browns kept him around for 3 years while nothing about him jumped off the screen that said "THIS GUY IS A FOOTBALL PLAYER."  Please give me a WR like Brian Brennan over someone that can just run fast.  Maybe they're thinking David Bell can develop into something like that. We shall see...

Year Year	Team Team	REC Total receptions	YDS Receiving yards	AVG Receiving yards per reception	LNG Longest reception	TD Receiving touchdowns	YDS Rushing yards	AVG Average yards per carry
2022	Seahawks	27	387	14.3	38	4	5	2.5
2021	Bears	20	313	15.7	50	1	-1	-0.5
2019	49ers	12	186	15.5	38	1	15	15.0

We really only kept Schwartz for 2 seasons.  I don't count camps as seasons.

[tiamat63]

24 minutes ago, ballpeen said:

LOl....and  in the end, does it really matter if we know? 

It doesn't, but it's interesting to speculate, though I'm sure it doesn't take much to discern who the 4 are.

 

24 minutes ago, ballpeen said:

 

 

I've never had someone from the FO call to ask me if I agreed or approved.

 

Just saying...

 

I can only speak for myself when I say, I would much prefer they get into contact with me about personnel decisions. 🤣

[ballpeen]

1 minute ago, tiamat63 said:

It doesn't, but it's interesting to speculate, though I'm sure it doesn't take much to discern who the 4 are.

 

 

I can only speak for myself when I say, I would much prefer they get into contact with me about personnel decisions. 🤣

I get it.  So would I.

 

You seem to be more in tune than I on such matters, but even if you were the man in charge, there would be multitudes of people thinking you know nothing..you remember Sgt Schultz don't you?  LOL

 

In the end I just have to trust that even if the decisions don't work out, they were thought out and talked through.  I like to think there is some sort of reasoning behind decisions and Berry isn't just throwing a dart at a list of names, picking the one he hits dead center.

[tiamat63]

41 minutes ago, ballpeen said:

I get it.  So would I.

 

You seem to be more in tune than I on such matters, but even if you were the man in charge, there would be multitudes of people thinking you know nothing..you remember Sgt Schultz don't you?  LOL

 

In the end I just have to trust that even if the decisions don't work out, they were thought out and talked through.  I like to think there is some sort of reasoning behind decisions and Berry isn't just throwing a dart at a list of names, picking the one he hits dead center.

 

 Oh no, there is a process to this machine. On its face, football is a simple game that boils down to,  as Lombardi once said - "blocking and tackling".  

But The subtle intricacies and complexity that also co-exist beyond the surface of that comments is what makes this game the greatest of all. 

Had to look up Sgt Shultz. I think you guys forget I'm half your age. 

 

Edit:  and yes, every front office have methods and chains to their decision making.  Doesn't always mean it's good or right, of course.  But at least there are gears turning. 

[ballpeen]

32 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

 

 Oh no, there is a process to this machine. On its face, football is a simple game that boils down to,  as Lombardi once said - "blocking and tackling".  

But The subtle intricacies and complexity that also co-exist beyond the surface of that comments is what makes this game the greatest of all. 

Had to look up Sgt Shultz. I think you guys forget I'm half your age. 

 

Edit:  and yes, every front office have methods and chains to their decision making.  Doesn't always mean it's good or right, of course.  But at least there are gears turning. 

I never knew your age, but I know mine and figured that I am at least 25 or more years older than the average poster in here.  I remember events, sports and otherwise from the 50's first hand, not just reading about it in some book or article.  I thought you possibly had seen some Hogans Heros reruns, if not first hand.

[nickers]

2 minutes ago, ballpeen said:

I never knew your age, but I know mine and figured that I am at least 25 or more years older than the average poster in here.  I remember events, sports and otherwise from the 50's first hand, not just reading about it in some book or article.  I thought you possibly had seen some Hogans Heros reruns, if not first hand.

You you can always tell a persons age when they act like a "Know it all".. Then proceed to rub it in your face like some clever smart ass... Wheres a Capt Obvious meme when ya need one

[tiamat63]

32 minutes ago, ballpeen said:

I never knew your age, but I know mine and figured that I am at least 25 or more years older than the average poster in here.  I remember events, sports and otherwise from the 50's first hand, not just reading about it in some book or article.  I thought you possibly had seen some Hogans Heros reruns, if not first hand.

 

Bonanza and Gun Smoke, my good man. Had you cited those we would have been on the exact same page 🤣