Head-to-Head Hits & New Rule Discussion

[Steelhammer92]

Spunkonmyback DPOY, it's become apparent to me that you and I are just wasting our time. Nobody is going to change their tune around here because they have no desire to. That's not unexpected as team loyalty will always reign supreme, but some of the shit being posted on here just defies logic. Whatever... It's on to Miami for the Steelers in the quest for their 7th Super Bowl title and on to New Orleans for the Browns in their quest for the #1 draft pick. Normally by this time of the year Cleveland fans are getting hyped for the Cavs and already writing off the Browns... With no more Lebron, there isn't anything to look forward to for Cleveland sports fans.. Not even the Buckeyes any more. Have fun rooting against the Steelers for the rest of the season Browns fans, because I know that's really all you have to do this winter.

[hoorta]

Spunkonmyback DPOY, it's become apparent to me that you and I are just wasting our time. Nobody is going to change their tune around here because they have no desire to. That's not unexpected as team loyalty will always reign supreme, but some of the shit being posted on here just defies logic. Whatever... It's on to Miami for the Steelers in the quest for their 7th Super Bowl title and on to New Orleans for the Browns in their quest for the #1 draft pick. Normally by this time of the year Cleveland fans are getting hyped for the Cavs and already writing off the Browns... With no more Lebron, there isn't anything to look forward to for Cleveland sports fans.. Not even the Buckeyes any more. Have fun rooting against the Steelers for the rest of the season Browns fans, because I know that's really all you have to do this winter.

 

And the feeling is mutual- seeing you guys try to defend your 'Roided up goon that just got fined $75,000.

 

I'd suggest Tomlin have Harrison read Rule 12 a few dozen times- assuming he's literate and has a higher than third grade reading comprehension- which I have my doubts about after hearing him talk.

[Xanthros]

So WE are the ones getting slammed and called whiners and cryers?.......?

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81b7...le=HP_headlines

 

Dude is absolutely pathetic...even admits that he is not capable of tackling properly....

 

Full article:

 

James Harrison believes the NFL's crackdown on dangerous hits is cramping his style. And, unless Pittsburgh Steelers coach Mike Tomlin can convince him otherwise, the 32-year-old linebacker claimed Tuesday night that he might consider retirement.

 

Hours after the league fined him $75,000 for his concussion-causing hit on Cleveland Browns wide receiver Mohamed Massaquoi, Harrison appeared on Fox Sports Radio's "Into The Night with Tony Bruno" and told guest host Jody McDonald that his first stop Wednesday morning will be in Tomlin's office.

 

"I'm going to sit down and have a serious conversation with my coach tomorrow and see if I can actually play by NFL rules and still be effective," Harrison said. "If not, I may have to give up playing football."

 

Harrison was one of three players punished Tuesday by the NFL for helmet-to-helmet hits. Hee was fined $25,000 more than New England Patriots safety Brandon Meriweather and Atlanta Falcons cornerback Dunta Robinson were because the league considered Harrison a repeat offender. He was fined $5,000 for slamming Tennessee Titans quarterback Vince Young to the turf during the Steelers' Sept. 19 victory.

 

Harrison, the 2008 Associated Press NFL Defensive Player of the Year and a three-time Pro Bowl pick, rammed headfirst into Massaquoi as the receiver tried to complete a catch during the second quarter. Massaquoi briefly crumpled to the turf but was soon on his feet, although he didn't return to the game.

 

Earlier in the game, Harrison sidelined Browns wide receiver Joshua Cribbs with a helmet-first hit that caused a concussion. The NFL said Monday that tackle was permissible because Cribbs was a runner on the WildDawg play, and that hit didn't factor into Harrison's fine. He wasn't penalized on either play.

 

Tomlin publicly backed Harrison on Tuesday morning before the fine was announced, saying the linebacker made "legal hits, not fineable hits." The coach also downplayed Harrison's postgame comments that he tries to hurt, not injure, opponents because it increases the Steelers' chances of winning.

 

"I didn't see those comments, but I know James," Tomlin said. "James says a lot of things he doesn't necessarily mean. He's a tough talker, like a lot of guys that play the game at this level. If you want to get to know James, catch him on a Tuesday when he's walking through the building with his son. He's a big softie."

 

Now Tomlin must talk down Harrison, who sounded frustrated by a punishment that his agent, Bill Parise, called "staggering." Parise said Harrison would appeal the fine.

 

"I really truly hope it's something that can be done," Harrison told Fox Sports Radio. "But the way that things were being explained to me today and the reasoning for it, I don't feel I can continue to play and be effective and, like I say, not have to worry about injuring someone else or risking injury to myself."

 

Harrison later added that if a solution can't be reached, "I'm going to have to try and find a way that I may possibly get out of whatever agreement I agreed to with the Steelers."

 

That agreement is a six-year, $51.175 million contract that he signed last year and contains low base salaries in the early portion. Harrison is making $44,411.76 in base salary per game this season, so the $75,000 fine equates to nearly two checks.

 

Massaquoi's agent, Brian Ayrault, doesn't believe even that's enough.

 

"Harrison has made $20 million over the past three years, and they only fined him $75,000?" Ayrault said. "To me, that's not going to be a deterrent. The Browns are probably going to be without a starter this week. I don't think that fine is a deterrent or fair to competitive balance.

[TheClevelandSound]

HAHAHAHAHA. This made my night hands down.

 

Browns 1, Steelers 0.

 

Don't try to argue back because there is no point now.

[hoorta]

So WE are the ones getting slammed and called whiners and cryers?.......?

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81b7...le=HP_headlines

 

Dude is absolutely pathetic...even admits that he is not capable of tackling properly....

 

What???? WHAAAAAAHHHHH........ They won't let me spear players anymore????? WHAAAAAAHHHHH!!!!!!

 

[Cowsrus]

HAHAHAHAHA. This made my night hands down.

 

Browns 1, Steelers 0.

 

Don't try to argue back because there is no point now.

 

If you know anything about Steeler fans, they'll find a way to argue this matter no matter how wrong they are.

[blowe]

HAHAHAHAHA. This made my night hands down.

 

Browns 1, Steelers 0.

 

Don't try to argue back because there is no point now.

 

We lost the game................which is more important?

[manbearpig]

I am glad that I was at work and couldn't watch this game as I may have thrown a bottle. Keep it clean Squeeelers... Low class... need I say more?

[Cowsrus]

Is he serious??? He actually thinks he doesn't have to play by the rules?? The penalties for helmet to helmet hits are in place for a reason and they're certainly not new, they're just not inforced strongly enough.

 

Was watching an ESPN story today on this subject because of how bad these hits were throughout Sunday's games. This is not just some silly rule. These are professional players who have been taught to launch and hit like this. There is no exuse for it and they cannot say they can't help themselves and it isn't true that a player can't change his way of playing. Instaed of launching and hitting helmet to helmet, he is quite capable of turning his head and launching into the sternum instaed of the head and neck area and being just as effective in his hitting. He CAN make that decision instantly and make the right choice instead of risking paralyzing the guy on the recieveing end or himself.

 

Players like Harrison are not going to take the NFL seriously UNTIL there is an example set. Fineing alone isn't gonna cut it. Someone needs to be fined and suspended or removed from the team or the NFL if need be. Harrison is a repeat offender and now the players will get one free pass then the crap needs to hit the fan. The offending player needs to and is capable of making the choice before he makes his hit and needs to keep in mind, if I do this, I'm gonna be fined, suspended or worse. And IMO, if Harrison doesn't think the rules apply to him, then let him quit or get rid of him before he kills someone. These guys get paid the big bucks to play a game and put their life on the line and there is no room for people who intentionally injure other players although I heard him say he wasnt to hurt the other guys but not injure them. Bull.

 

Just my amature opinion.

[Cowsrus]

I am glad that I was at work and couldn't watch this game as I may have thrown a bottle. Keep it clean Squeeelers... Low class... need I say more?

 

 

Unfortunately it's not just the Steelers. This is a growing and dangerous parctice throughout football. And it needs to change before it goes to far.

[manbearpig]

Have you ever had aConcussion? Now mine was extreme and non football or any sports related... but it really messed me up. (skull fracture and 4 internal brain bleeds didn't help much either.) so I can't really talk about just concussions.... I do know that mine left me dead ass on the street and I got picked up by my brother and carried home. I woke up if that's what you call it, an hour or so later.

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

Have you ever had aConcussion? Now mine was extreme and non football or any sports related... but it really messed me up. (skull fracture and 4 internal brain bleeds didn't help much either.) so I can't really talk about just concussions.... I do know that mine left me dead ass on the street and I got picked up by my brother and carried home. I woke up if that's what you call it, an hour or so later.

 

I've had 8. Each one has sucked.

[miktoxic]

We lost the game................which is more important?

 

i think the health of any player is more important than a win. just my opinion though.

 

[hoorta]

WHAAAAHHH!!!! You mean I ain't allowed to do this anymore? Man I QUIT!!!!! Don't worry, Mr Harrison, UFC wants to hear from you.

 

At least the Refs threw a flag on that one.

 

 

 

[manbearpig]

I've had 8. Each one has sucked.

 

Did they nearly kill you? Are you half deaf as a result of any of them? Did you lose your memory for nine months from any of them? Just because you had (what might have been a light concussion)) doesn't mean that they are all that way.

[SuperSteelers]

The NFL is going to die if they keep making the game "safe". Why do you think they put on all that gear? So they won't get hurt when someone makes a shoe-string tackle. I know you guys hate the Steelers, but look at the bigger picture.....TJ Ward will be in this same boat very soon and yeah, I know you hope its a Steeler he does it to, but when he gets suspended for 4 games you'll be the ones "crying".

[hoorta]

The NFL is going to die if they keep making the game "safe". Why do you think they put on all that gear? So they won't get hurt when someone makes a shoe-string tackle. I know you guys hate the Steelers, but look at the bigger picture.....TJ Ward will be in this same boat very soon and yeah, I know you hope its a Steeler he does it to, but when he gets suspended for 4 games you'll be the ones "crying".

 

The game will never be "safe" but having a guy running a 4.4 and launching himself into another guys head really isn't a good idea, is it? I've said elsewhere the NFL illegalized chop blocks because too many guys were getting their knees blown out. They'll survive just fine if headhunting is banned.

 

PS, we wish Harrison many, many happy suspensions if he can't figure out how to clean up his act. And no, I'm not into revenge. As to our Ward, I didn't condone that shot on Shipley, and he's on probation.

[miktoxic]

The NFL is going to die if they keep making the game "safe". Why do you think they put on all that gear? So they won't get hurt when someone makes a shoe-string tackle. I know you guys hate the Steelers, but look at the bigger picture.....TJ Ward will be in this same boat very soon and yeah, I know you hope its a Steeler he does it to, but when he gets suspended for 4 games you'll be the ones "crying".

 

maybe you can figure out the difference between the terminology: TACKLE and HIT, no? yeah well neither can harrison hence the fine and in due time, suspensions.

[blowe]

i think the health of any player is more important than a win. just my opinion though.

 

Right, but to say Cleveland 1 Steelers 0 just sounds dumb. Of course the health of any player on any team is more important than the score.

[Vagitron]

HAHAHAHAHA. This made my night hands down.

 

Browns 1, Steelers 0.

 

Don't try to argue back because there is no point now.

 

Harrison is obviously kidding. Bunch of mouth breathing Retards on this message board. He hardly talks but when he's does it's usually tongue and cheek. You'd know this if you paid attention to his interviews.

[hoorta]

Harrison is obviously kidding. Bunch of mouth breathing Retards on this message board. He hardly talks but when he's does it's usually tongue and cheek. You'd know this if you paid attention to his interviews.

 

I did pay attention to his interview after the Browns game- yup Harrison sounds like a mouth breathing Retard paid assassin alright.

 

[Vagitron]

I did pay attention to his interview after the Browns game- yup Harrison sounds like a mouth breathing Retard paid assassin alright.

 

Seriously he's almost never serious, very rarely says much of anything when interviewed and when he does it's tongue and cheek. Tomlin even goes as far as saying that he's not serious in interviews most of the time. Mo-mass dropped his helmet before impact as well. If he doesn't drop his head it's not helmet to helmet and even then it wasn't helmet to helmet.

[Taz1129]

1. Spare me the separate the receiver from the ball argument. Been there. Done that. See TJ Ward. I agree it's his job.

2. Don't give me the "crouching Massaquoi" crap. James Harrison left his feet and launched with the crown of his helmet into his neck area. He wasn't aiming for his gut.

3. McCoy and any other QB makes that throw. It wasn't behind the receiver at all. Massaquoi gets paid to go over the middle like Hines Ward does.

 

You're blindly defending your player for no other reason than he's a Steeler. If he was on some other team you wouldn't go to these lengths to defend him when the video evidence and the league feels that he's hit someone illegally.

 

 

Quite obvious that you did not watch the game at all, you are just running your mouth.

 

 

 

 

 

now there are the two pics both show Harrison with his feet firmly on the ground, in fact he has his legs bent, they also show Massaquoi going low to hot Harrison. BTW Massaquoi is 6'1" and Harrison is 6'0"

 

 

Also notice the ref looking directly at the hit. If Harrison would have launched, he would have gotten the flag.

 

 

Now before you run your mouth try watching the game.

 

[Taz1129]

Teh real issue is the fact that the NFL is talking out of both sides of their mouths. Just like Fujita said, they want to fine players for big hits, yet they show the same big hits on every channel in every top play countdown.

 

Big hits are part of the game, and let's face it....we all love them. Helmet to helmet hits are pretty black and white. There's always going to be a fine on them, and there always should be. But this new rule is basically including intent, and that's not as cut and dry to determine.

 

Did Harrison look like he intended to take off both Cribbs and MoMass' heads? Yeah. And that's the reason the NFL is fining him.

 

Did Harrison actually intend to knock these guys (near) unconscious? Yes and no. Hell, he's a defender. That's what they're out there to do. They're taught to put the fear of God in whoever they're playing. But I don't think he was intending to cause them any lasting physical damage.

 

Intent is hard to determine. This is a contact game, and these hits are commonplace. They're exciting, and they make for good entertainment. Defensive coaches encourage big hits, and any coach loves when his runningback takes it to a would-be tackler. These big hits make the NFL, so it's kind of bullshit for the NFL to take them away.

 

Yes, Harrison launched himself. Yes, Harrison led with his head. No, Harrison did not arch his neck back and bring his arms on the hit. He basically torpedoed each guy and, to the NFL, that adds up to intent. And for Harrison, intent costs him about $75,000 out of his pocket. I don't necessarily agree with it, but that's how the cookie crumbles.

 

 

What the NFL really needs to do is provide better healthcare for the players once they retire. That's the reason they're putting skirts on the players now, so they don't have to pay later.

 

 

1. Harrison did not launch himself.

2. Harrison was actually trying to go low.

3. The receiver went low

4. The ref was standing right there with a clear view of the hit, obviously if Harrison launched himself, he would have drawn the flag.

 

Want proof? Here you go.

 

 

 

[Spunkonmyback DPOY]

Is he serious??? He actually thinks he doesn't have to play by the rules?? The penalties for helmet to helmet hits are in place for a reason and they're certainly not new, they're just not inforced strongly enough.

 

Was watching an ESPN story today on this subject because of how bad these hits were throughout Sunday's games. This is not just some silly rule. These are professional players who have been taught to launch and hit like this. There is no exuse for it and they cannot say they can't help themselves and it isn't true that a player can't change his way of playing. Instaed of launching and hitting helmet to helmet, he is quite capable of turning his head and launching into the sternum instaed of the head and neck area and being just as effective in his hitting. He CAN make that decision instantly and make the right choice instead of risking paralyzing the guy on the recieveing end or himself.

 

Players like Harrison are not going to take the NFL seriously UNTIL there is an example set. Fineing alone isn't gonna cut it. Someone needs to be fined and suspended or removed from the team or the NFL if need be. Harrison is a repeat offender and now the players will get one free pass then the crap needs to hit the fan. The offending player needs to and is capable of making the choice before he makes his hit and needs to keep in mind, if I do this, I'm gonna be fined, suspended or worse. And IMO, if Harrison doesn't think the rules apply to him, then let him quit or get rid of him before he kills someone. These guys get paid the big bucks to play a game and put their life on the line and there is no room for people who intentionally injure other players although I heard him say he wasnt to hurt the other guys but not injure them. Bull.

 

Just my amature opinion.

You act like two of your better players aren't in full support of Harrison.....

[Spunkonmyback DPOY]

Yeah, but leading with your helmet full bore into a guy that's already being tackled - and almost taking his head off sure will dislodge the ball. And don't give me the BS that Harrison didn't have the time to get his head up, or tackle with his hands- he had the opportunity and went for a deliberate kill shot on Cribbs. BTW, the Commish's office laid it out- rule 12 you can't spear a defenseless player- and that will go for not just wrs. Since Cribbs was already wrapped up and going down, I'd say he was not exactly in a position to protect himself.

 

Here's the exact quote of the rule- trolls. NFL Rule 12

 

"Note: Defenseless players in (f) and (g) shall include (i) a player in the act of or just after throwing a pass; (ii) a receiver catching or attempting to catch a pass; (iii) a runner already in the grasp of a tackler and whose forward progress has been stopped; (iv) a kickoff or punt returner attempting to field a kick in the air; and (v) a player on the ground at the end of a play.

 

If Harrison wants to keep getting game checks, he had damn better unlearn his headhunting ways. Goodell hath spoken- And to our Steeler trolls- if you think it's such an injustice to your goon, why not help pay his fine.

True or False. Cribbs lowered his head as he ran through the hole.

 

True or False. The league said this hit was 100% clean from the start. It was his hit on MoMass that was in question

[Captain Cheesedick]

Can we stop complaining about hard hits! We have been an embarassement because of losing for years, and now because our fan base is crying about hard hits in professional football.

 

I want Ward to keep hitting in the secondary. We have a hitter now, lets let him keep this opportunity.

 

This new rule is going to be referred to as the "Browns Rule" that removed the ability of defensive player to play with intensity and intimidation.

 

STOP THIS DAMN COMPLAINING!

 

 

[Rocky20]

We lost the game................which is more important?

 

Wow - a smart Browns fan - I cant believe it.

 

Regarding the fines - James Harrison and Dunta Robinson hits were clean hits. They were playing agressive and against a moving player with the ball - unacceptable politically correct Cleveland bed wetting politics happening with both of those fines.

 

The Merriweather hit was a terrible head hunting type of hit - he purposely led with his helmet in order to hit Heap in the head - that should have been the only fineable.

 

Now back to this smart Browns fan - he is correct - YOU LOSERS are laughing and you dont even realize that you are butt of the jokes - as I have said before - YOU ARE F. U. C. K. ING LOSERS! LOL!

[Rocky20]

I did pay attention to his interview after the Browns game- yup Harrison sounds like a mouth breathing Retard paid assassin alright.

 

Yes - and you would sell your sister for him to be on your team. PS - tell her I said hello.

[Rocky20]

LOOK MOM, NO HANDS!

 

Hey there CUMINEARS - do you know what I see here? I see a Jack Lambert type of football player (You remember Jack Lambert - dont you DICKINEARS? He was the guy in your back yard who grew up a Browns fan but was not drafted by the Browns - just like Big Bad Ben! LOL!) - anyways I see a Jack Lambert type of player who just beat the total S. H. I. T. out of your team and left two piles of steaming S. H. I. T. on the field for your trainers to scrape off the field - thats worth 75 Grand anyday! I LOVE IT!