Head-to-Head Hits & New Rule Discussion

[hoorta]

Thank you for the reply, but you failed to understand the point.

 

Football is a dangerous sport. So is driving the car or taking a walk in the park.

 

Football players know that the game is violent and dangerous and they know the risks taken.

 

That is the real issue.

 

Regards...

 

... an'at

 

.

 

Look, this isn't just ragging about Harrison. Didn't see the Falcons hit- but I hate the Ravens, and that shot on Todd Heap was BS.

 

Maybe too late, but the League is trying to avoid hits on players that will eventually get someone else paralyzed or killed. Memo to Mr Harrison- leading with your helmet in the future is going to get you suspended.

 

The physics is Force=Mass X Acceleration and players are way bigger and faster than they were 30-40 years ago. Dick Modelewski played defensive end for the Browns back in the 60s and weighed 230 pounds- that's a small saftey in today's NFL.

 

Ghoolie's 100% correct- peoples spinal columns aren't any stronger than back then, and they're getting hit with way more force. I posted it in another thread- Cribbs is lucky he didn't get his neck broken from that shot the way he was hit.

 

[FearTheRoo]

Yes football is a violent sport. Why don't the players just carry guns with them too?

 

Oh Harrison shot cribbs? oh there's no rule against that in the NFL, he just can't tackle so what else could he do

[Steeler SChick]

Look, this isn't just ragging about Harrison. Didn't see the Falcons hit- but I hate the Ravens, and that shot on Todd Heap was BS.

 

Maybe too late, but the League is trying to avoid hits on players that will eventually get someone else paralyzed or killed. Memo to Mr Harrison- leading with your helmet in the future is going to get you suspended.

 

The physics is Force=Mass X Acceleration and players are way bigger and faster than they were 30-40 years ago. Dick Modelewski played defensive end for the Browns back in the 60s and weighed 230 pounds- that's a small saftey in today's NFL.

 

Ghoolie's 100% correct- peoples spinal columns aren't any stronger than back then, and they're getting hit with way more force. I posted it in another thread- Cribbs is lucky he didn't get his neck broken from that shot the way he was hit.

 

I don't have a problem with the defenseless receiver helmet to helmet rule. That's fine, but when you start calling helmet to helmet on RB's, at what point is a fine/penalty defined?

 

Just the ugly plays?

 

Against the better team?

 

What's next - no helmet to helmet on O and D linemen?

 

This is clearly a knee-jerk reaction to what needs to be a thought out issue.

 

That's my point.

 

Regards...

 

 

 

 

 

... an'at

 

 

 

 

 

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[hoorta]

Yep, what goes around comes around, you play hard you hit hard and you win hard, on the other hand you whine hard you whine more and lose more

 

Stopt the whining and start the hitting

 

Rich, I have no problems with a guy hitting people as hard as they can- legally. Harrison- from his comments- isn't just about hitting opposing players hard- the trolls can defend him- but the goon is clearly out to not just hit people, but injure them.

 

Considering he already got fined once this year for the hit on Vince Young, I'll put the over\under on his fine at $25,000 and I'll take the over. Maybe when someone else rings Harrison's bell and makes him take an involuntary "nap" on the field, he'll see things a little differently.

 

[The Fan Of STEEL]

Yeah, how many Steelers had live altering experiences after all their head injuries? Merril Hoge still comes out swinging when the pizza delivery boy rigs the doorbell. MIke Webster met a tragic end supposedly because of head injury induced depression.

 

Harrison purposely lead with his head, and he didn't have to. That is what makes this guy even more despicable.

 

Steroids, lighter equipment, better training, more competition and better fields all contribute to faster, more violent impacts. WHile guys have much more lean muscle today, their spines are no different than the guys playing in the 60's. There's your problem.

 

It's fun to be Jack Lambert and put dresses on the sissies who don't want to get hit, isn't it? Especially when it's your rivals getting hurt. Well, sooner or later Steeler Vermin, it's going to happen to one of your own, hell, with HArrison leading with his head so much, he's a prime suspect for taking one not quite right.

 

Or wait, maybe he has a special kind of spinal chord that doens't crack, eh? Wow, he's superman.............

 

As far as Steve Young goes, he is a prime example of why the Commissioner needs to change things. Football players know nothing else but playing ball, They will play well beyond teh voice of reason when further hits could ruin their lives. Young was getting a concussion every time someone yelled "COLD BEER HERE" and still, he insisted that he was fine.

 

My problem with this Commissioner is that he is only half committed. Letting Vick back in was sickening. Reducing PeePeeburgers suspension because he promised to be good was also BS. THe NFL has done a lot of things that piss fans off, like curtailing celebrations and not showing bad behavior................... BUT........... the NFL continues to grow. So don't worry about nobody showing up.

 

Steeler fans? Yeah, you guys are Johnny come lately and don't even know your own history, let alone appreciating the fraternity of the NFL. Left up to you the NFL would be an unrooly, violent shithole. That is of course, until it was YOUR guys who started getting hurt, THEN, you scum would be the first ones to cry foul.

 

 

If a STEELERS player gets hurt because of the game... so be it. Nobody is immune to injury. But the game is supposed to be violent. It's what made this game and why we play the game and watch the game. You take away the hard hits, you take away football. The NFL should get rid of Goodell, he is xxxxing the game up.

[hoorta]

Wow. Someone actually being honest and understands the game is quick and violent. The way it is supposed to be.

 

It's violent alright- and the Commish's office just laid down the law against it getting TOO violent. There was plenty of thuggery on Sunday- and Harrison wasn't the only perpetrator.

 

There's ways to effectively separate a receiver from the ball without trying to take his head off.

 

[Taz1129]

Well the crying has finally paid off. Football is ruined. No more hard hits are allowed, anyone tagging a receiver going across the middle is going to get suspended. Thank You very much for destroying the second professional sport in this country. Baseball was first, now it's football's turn.

 

The NFL will announce by Wednesday that, effective this weekend, even first-time offenders face suspension for "devastating hits" and "head shots," according to Ray Anderson, the league's executive vice president of football operations.

 

I guess the players should just take off the uniforms and sit down to a nice game of tiddly winks. Football was a contact sport, but contact is no longer allowed. A truly sad, sad day.

 

 

[Taz1129]

Maybe UFC will take away head shots soon.

 

 

Oh it is not just head shots, its any devastating hit. There are no distinctions.

 

New Rule for NFL

[Vagitron]

let's see when the Steelers best players get knocked out because of a cheap shots and costs them the game

 

Cost you the game? You were still losing that game, what did either player do up to that point? How about absolutely nothing. I also can't believe the league took this step. Its a joke and will change the game forever. It really is a sad day.

 

Cost them the game he says, lmao.

[ballpeen]

The only thing I dislike about this rule is the subjective manner in which it will have to be enforced.

 

Overall I agree...somewhere along the line players seem to forget it's about tackling a player, not hitting a player.

 

I still maintain the players would be safer if you reduced the amount of padding they wore and made them feel a little exposed.

[ballpeen]

As I said in another thread, I just don't like how they are going to enforce this "rule"..

 

I still think if you reduced the players padding and stuck them in 1960's helmets and facemasks, the head hunting and use of heads in the tackling process would stop.

[Spunkonmyback DPOY]

let's see when the Steelers best players get knocked out because of a cheap shots and costs them the game

McGinest's hit on Ben had helmet-to-helmet contact.......

 

 

All of Goodell's actions he has taken so far as Commish all have been done to help set up his plan to increase revenue by forcing players to play 18 games. The NFL is currently too rough to have players playing 18+ meaningful games. Goodell knows the 18 games schedule he is cramming down everyone's throught harder than Obama and his bailouts will only week if the game is softened.

[Captain Cheesedick]

How are they going to enforce this? Too many judgement calls by the refs now.

 

so, if a running back puts his head down and runs into the line, and hits defensive player, that can now be a penalty?

 

Wow, this board has been whining a LOT about hard hitting football action. I remember when being a Browns fan meant loving "smash mouth, hard hitting, football"

 

Those days seem to be over.

 

 

[brnfan16]

Well the crying has finally paid off. Football is ruined. No more hard hits are allowed, anyone tagging a receiver going across the middle is going to get suspended. Thank You very much for destroying the second professional sport in this country. Baseball was first, now it's football's turn.

 

The NFL will announce by Wednesday that, effective this weekend, even first-time offenders face suspension for "devastating hits" and "head shots," according to Ray Anderson, the league's executive vice president of football operations.

 

I guess the players should just take off the uniforms and sit down to a nice game of tiddly winks. Football was a contact sport, but contact is no longer allowed. A truly sad, sad day.

I think the new rule can be a good thing. You stay from shooting for the head and that's about it (of course for late hits after the whistle). I really don't care to see someone in a wheel chair for the rest of their lives. If everyone can rip the head off, pretty soon you'll be seeing nothing but 4th stringers out there, because all the good players are in rehab.

[USFBrown]

How are they going to enforce this? Too many judgement calls by the refs now.

 

so, if a running back puts his head down and runs into the line, and hits defensive player, that can now be a penalty?

 

Wow, this board has been whining a LOT about hard hitting football action. I remember when being a Browns fan meant loving "smash mouth, hard hitting, football"

 

Those days seem to be over.

 

There has been a lot of whining. It's a contact game that's played at a very high speed. I don't mind the big hits, but they refs need to get better about being consistent. Problem is, this will never happen. Most are pissed that our player gets flagged and fined (rightfully so) while others get away with it.

 

But enough is enough, as Arnold would say, "STOP WHINING... HHEEAAAYYARRRGGGG."

[The Fan Of STEEL]

The only thing I dislike about this rule is the subjective manner in which it will have to be enforced.

 

Overall I agree...somewhere along the line players seem to forget it's about tackling a player, not hitting a player.

 

I still maintain the players would be safer if you reduced the amount of padding they wore and made them feel a little exposed.

 

 

I totally agree with you on reducing the amount of padding. But I don't like this rule at all and think it will ruin the game completely. There is a reason that they show the hardest hits as in.... he got "jacked up." It's because the fans and the players want this. This game is the most popular game in America because of how it is played, not because it is a safe and friendly game. I'm totally disgusted with much of the new rules put in place by Goodell.

[The Fan Of STEEL]

At least the browns players have some balls and admit that it was not a dirty hit and is a part of the game. You people who want a pussified version of this game should watch flag football.

[Gips]

While i am for very hard hitting bone jarring football i am not for intentional headhunting, but i fear now that even accidental/unintentional helmet to helmets may result in being over penalized due to the sheer worthless and inconsistent crap that is todays nfl officiating, Personally i believe refs who make bad/no calls need to be evaluated and fined or suspended as well...the officiating in the nfl was once something we as fans were proud of when compared to other sports, but now even with replays being overlooked and wrongfully overturned or not on the field, and we have refs that are more interested in getting home than properly officiating the game , and there is no reason the league should tolorate any of these things...the officiating system needs some discipline before pro football becomes like soccer...

 

If refs had been doing their jobs and calling the obvious violent intentional hits and throwing players out of the game it may not of had to come to this..

The sport evolves and players are bigger, stronger and smarter than ever and some will always take a weak little fine for a dirty and or cheap shot, and the officiating has to evolve to deal with the ever emerging exploits that both coaches and players will utilize to get ahead...after all the game is about winning by any means you can get by with unless you are the cleveland browns with the best fans in the sport who demand nothing but below mediocrity as a standard...

 

Geared Browns fan at a Pittsburgh McDonalds: Sir i ordered and was charged for a big mac but you guys accidentally gave me a double cheeseburger instead...

McDonalds Manager: Nah thats a big mac..

Browns fan: Are you sure? Its on a regular hamburger bun with ketchup and mustard instead of sauce and lettuce with no middle bun..

McDonalds Manager: It is a big mac sir you have to believe me...

Browns fan: Ok, If you say its a big mac it must be a big mac...

[ATENEARS]

Blame Harrison. It was hits like his on Momass where he took an upward cut the forearms weilding upward toward his head that drew this decision. Why not allow a shot on the ball and a downward hit driving through the ball and into the hips and legs? Remember to "stay low"?

 

Blame Harrison for making two kill shots leading head first and at the head on both plays. He's plenty big enough to make the same tackle hitting at the chest, trunk, or legs.

 

Don't blame the messenger, blame the asshole who violates the early warning rules, then runs to the media and gives the league poster-boy quotes such as "I WANT TO HURT OTHERS".

 

Blame Harrison the dumb bastard on Roids.

[ballpeen]

It won't ruin the game, and it will still be popular.

 

I think back to guys like Butkus and Willie Lanier.....big hitters who wouldn't have a problem in todays game because they didn't spear people and use the top of their hat to hit people. Ray Lewis is a big hitter and isn't one with a rep as a guy who plays dirty....he just hits hard.

 

 

I am by no means a great ex-football player. I do remember we were taught to stick our facemask in to a players numbers, hit, lift, and drive.

 

Too many head hunters in todays game.

 

 

I have an idea. Give players helmets similar to what wrestlers or boxers wear..leave the crown exposed.....just outfit them with a mask....I'll bet that would keep players from lowering their head when making a tackle.

[Taz1129]

Blatant head to head shots, ok I can see that, but would someone please tell me what the hell a devastating hit is?

[Captain Cheesedick]

Harrison should have been stopped by Browns players protecting their own. They should have surrounded him and made it clear that they were not going to allow him to take their guys out.

 

I remember seeing Polumalu getting tackled by the hair (which is legal) and the the rest of the defense ran over started some pushing and shoving.

 

A Brown should have got in his face and made the point.

 

THAT is how you stop it, but don't change this into a flag/touch league.

 

And lets not be fans that complain about the refs and how hard the other teams hit.

[ATENEARS]

At least the browns players have some balls and admit that it was not a dirty hit and is a part of the game. You people who want a pussified version of this game should watch flag football.

 

 

We want the same rules to apply to our opponents as apply to our players. When our player made a similar play, he was flagged immediately and heavily fined. Your player has yet to receiver either.

 

With the penalty now increasing, who do you think has a better chance of falling prey to this new punishment? Your team which seems to ALWAYS get away with this type of shit, or ours who get flagged for every push, love tap, and close call?

 

In that regard, the sport was already ruined ... welcome to YOUR aftermath.

[ballpeen]

Blatant head to head shots, ok I can see that, but would someone please tell me what the hell a devastating hit is?

 

 

No idea...

 

maybe a unnecessary hit...maybe like the one Sapp did on that GB player a few years ago. A clean play but one that in the scheme of things was unnecessary??

 

Does one need to devastate a player to do his job or does one need do simply enough to prevent the player from making a play?? I don't see the real need to hit people as if you don't like them...and I am not talking about making the game softer, so don't go there.....there is a line and times where a player doesn't have to totally cream somebody....a simple push, or getting in the way would work just as well.

 

[The Fan Of STEEL]

Blame Harrison. It was hits like his on Momass where he took an upward cut the forearms weilding upward toward his head that drew this decision. Why not allow a shot on the ball and a downward hit driving through the ball and into the hips and legs? Remember to "stay low"?

 

Blame Harrison for making two kill shots leading head first and at the head on both plays. He's plenty big enough to make the same tackle hitting at the chest, trunk, or legs.

 

Don't blame the messenger, blame the asshole who violates the early warning rules, then runs to the media and gives the league poster-boy quotes such as "I WANT TO HURT OTHERS".

 

Blame Harrison the dumb bastard on Roids.

 

 

Bullshit. Even your own players disagree with you. Maybe bowling is more your speed.

[ATENEARS]

Bullshit. Even your own players disagree with you. Maybe bowling is more your speed.

 

Ask the players if they think that if one hit on a defensless receiver is flagged and fined, should the same play be flagged and fine if inflicted on us?

 

Ask them that dumbshit, thats been our stance all along.

 

Better yet, ask them in week 17. We have other games to play on our schedule and would like to get back to discussing our team and upcoming opponents. Your stupidass team is the one making headlines with dumbass quotes in the press and being the poster-child of new rules after violating previous warnings, skirting the penalty for it, then bragging about it in the press.

 

You made your own bed, don't blame us.

[kshutchins]

This has been going on for yrs... I agree its Tuff to watch at the HS Level... no $$$ in these kids Pockets. I was at WGH Vs MAssillon Friday Night and the Harding DBs laid about 3 or 4 punishing Hits on Recievers... a couple were like ??? So You have a Point there.

 

It may have been going on for years but players are now bigger and faster. Basic physics will tell you that when you get a larger mass going at a higher speed the force of the resulting collisions is greater. Once a certain point is passed, there is no amount of padding that will protect a player from serious injury. That is why decisive steps need to be taken to adjust the game now.

 

The comment that retired players sit around drooling on themselves and mistake their mailboxes for their children or grandchildren is not entirely hyperbole. It IS tragically true in some cases.

 

This does not even address the question of the enormous amounts of money that organizations have invested in their players only to see them lost for weeks as a result of shocking disregard for the health and well-being of opposing players. It's only a matter of time before both the person delivering the blow and the one receiving it are both lost.

 

If my son or grandson were the injured player, I would be enraged at the callous comments of the person inflicting injury with apparent intent and zero remorse.

 

How bad does it have to get before suspensions are handed out? Do we have to see multiple players permanently paralyzed? Several deaths on one weekend? There IS a line and as a viewer and a fan, I'd prefer not to see it crossed. In my opinion, the time to temper the violence is now rather than later.

 

Maybe we need one official above the field just to hand out penalties for excessive violence. It's possible that teams will need to selectively recruit SMALLER players within certain parameters that will reduce the likelihood of injury. It's a serious problem and not a joking matter.

 

[Earl34]

To the originial post..

 

Wrong. Move along.

[kshutchins]

I think the new rule can be a good thing. You stay from shooting for the head and that's about it (of course for late hits after the whistle). I really don't care to see someone in a wheel chair for the rest of their lives. If everyone can rip the head off, pretty soon you'll be seeing nothing but 4th stringers out there, because all the good players are in rehab.

 

When I was in Boston last year I noticed a huge sign visible from the highway. It declared one of the hospitals 'the official rehab hospital of the New England Patriots." Any job that requires an "official rehab hospital" SHOULD seriously reconsider how it functions. No amount of money is worth the pain and suffering some individuals and families will have to endure as a result of player injuries.

 

I don't understand why some people think football will suddenly become boring when devastating, life-threatening hits are eliminated. I may be naive but I like to think we've become more civilized than the ancient Romans who cheered death in the coliseum.

 

[1 more season]

Blatant head to head shots, ok I can see that, but would someone please tell me what the hell a devastating hit is?

 

Leaving your feet leading with the helmet as a weapon.