Osiris Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Next year, after injuries, you'd also have Desmond Bryant starting inside next to Danny Shelton, backed up by Meder and Cooper. Orchard backing up the ends, plus probably a relatively high draft pick. At LB, you have Schobert backing up, though then you're down to basically nobody - Dominique Alexander isn't going to strike fear in to too many OCs. Could see another draft pick (or FA) needed here in the mould of Davis (middle of the pack, capable if limited starter and/or quality backup). Then, that secondary... Lots of secondary free-agents 27 and under... http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/secondary/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 " Also, don't forget about getting Desmond Bryant back, if he's still under contract" - I didn't, and he is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Lots of secondary free-agents 27 and under... http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/secondary/ And an apparently deep draft class. Here's hoping we can pick up a better corner than the steelers or bengals managed with their first rounders this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Will just franchise him won't we? If they can't reach a deal. However, i think they traded for him with every intention of giving him a nice pay day. This way they don't have to bid with the rest of the NFL for his services. Really like this move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 If they can't reach a deal. However, i think they traded for him with every intention of giving him a nice pay day. This way they don't have to bid with the rest of the NFL for his services. Really like this move. You have to think he'll be playing in cleveland next year, whether he likes it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 You have to think he'll be playing in cleveland next year, whether he likes it or not. Indeed. Hoping this guarantees an Allen pick at 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Man, the state of our secondary really underscores the hurt of Gilbert's selection. The #8 pick of the draft could've really helped solidify the defense, instead he's an afterthought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBrown Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Man, the state of our secondary really underscores the hurt of Gilbert's selection. The #8 pick of the draft could've really helped solidify the defense, instead he's an afterthought. Especially when you see how Roby and Verrett have performed out of that class. Albeit he's injured now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Something I haven't seen mentioned: if we don't end up signing him to a long term deal, we will end up just getting our compensatory pick back, no? So literally no risk in this deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Something I haven't seen mentioned: if we don't end up signing him to a long term deal, we will end up just getting our compensatory pick back, no? So literally no risk in this deal? He will get franchised if it comes to that. I believe we would get a compensatory 3rd in return for him letting him walk but I don't know for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 He will get franchised if it comes to that. I believe we would get a compensatory 3rd in return for him letting him walk but I don't know for sure. I read somewhere it is a fourth, but it is obviously in 2018 and depends entirely on how this off-season pans out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Something I haven't seen mentioned: if we don't end up signing him to a long term deal, we will end up just getting our compensatory pick back, no? So literally no risk in this deal? He will get franchised if it comes to that. I believe we would get a compensatory 3rd in return for him letting him walk but I don't know for sure. It's really a no risk deal- if he plays up to his potential, he gets paid, if he walks, the compensatory pick just gets pushed one year down the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Pats seem so seldom sign their home-grown "stars"... especially on Defense. And so many of their traded "pieces" just don't fit other teams and produce the performance level sustained for the Pats.Color me skeptical... Something I haven't seen mentioned: if we don't end up signing him to a long term deal, we will end up just getting our compensatory pick back, no? So literally no risk in this deal? Depends on the team's overall, net UFA activity not case by case, but the possibility of compensation is there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 I'm wondering if we're looking to switch to a 4-3 more permanently? With Nassib-Meder-Shelton-Ogbah on the line, then Collins-Davis-Kirksey as the backers. Hell, that's not a terrible front seven, even if the secondary is essentially some remote controlled tackle dummies. 1) i agree on that front 7 analysis 2) im srsly laughing my balls off at assessment if the secondary....its so spot on its hilarious and sad all wrapped up in a delicious nom of helpless resignation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medicineman Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 I just know I saw so many missed tackles yesterday that the team should be ashamed to show their face again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 There's one issue with the franchise tag: Pryor is going to be a free agent. I'm not totally sure if it's restricted or unrestricted, but it could be a problem. Pryor's agent is freaking Rosenhaus, and he's notorious for being impossible to work with. Additionally, how do you figure out what Pryor's worth? It definitely APPEARS that he's worth a LOT, but how do you value a "first year" WR that used to play QB? Well, second year WR I guess. Anyways, I read somewhere that Jamie Collins was asking for "Von Miller money", and after that, the Patriots decided to show him the armpit of the football universe (AKA - Cleveland). The Cleveland Browns needed a "center piece" on defense, and now we have it. Collins could definitely be a guy that ACTUALLY makes plays, and he could jive quite well with Kirksey. I have to admit, I'm impressed. This is a low risk, HIGH reward type move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Just watched some videos on NFL Network, and Ian Rappaport stated that Browns are basically giving Collins an "8 game tryout", and Collins' agent actually said the linebacker is happy about going to Cleveland and going to a team that wants him. Rappaport further stated that Collins and his agent turned down a deal with Patriots that would've paid him over $10 million a year. Yikes! It's also been said by multiple analysts that Patriots were tired of Collins "doing whatever he wanted to" on defense, and he did that a few times against the Bills. One such play was a 28 yard gain by the Bills, and it infuriated the Pats. That, combined with his inability to stay healthy, make Collins disposable. Jamie Collins knows NOTHING about our defensive scheme, and I'm not even sure where the guy will play. Demario Davis has been playing well enough, Kirksey has been even better, and I'm not sure who will sit the bench in order for Collins to get time. Still, if Collins can stay healthy and make PLAYS, then I think we have a nice fixture on the defensive side of the ball. Rappaport also said that Browns will have to get a deal done because they will most likely franchise Pryor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Just watched some videos on NFL Network, and Ian Rappaport stated that Browns are basically giving Collins an "8 game tryout", and Collins' agent actually said the linebacker is happy about going to Cleveland and going to a team that wants him. Rappaport further stated that Collins and his agent turned down a deal with Patriots that would've paid him over $10 million a year. Yikes! It's also been said by multiple analysts that Patriots were tired of Collins "doing whatever he wanted to" on defense, and he did that a few times against the Bills. One such play was a 28 yard gain by the Bills, and it infuriated the Pats. That, combined with his inability to stay healthy, make Collins disposable. Jamie Collins knows NOTHING about our defensive scheme, and I'm not even sure where the guy will play. Demario Davis has been playing well enough, Kirksey has been even better, and I'm not sure who will sit the bench in order for Collins to get time. Still, if Collins can stay healthy and make PLAYS, then I think we have a nice fixture on the defensive side of the ball. Rappaport also said that Browns will have to get a deal done because they will most likely franchise Pryor. Franchise Pryor? That's crazy talk. $14.5 million? That's the current franchise tag for a WR. He's good, but AJ Green or Julio Jones good? Not yet by a long shot in my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runyon27 Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 I would think Pryor deal would get done. He has already expressed that he wants to stay here with Hue. No way to franchise tag Pryor when he is still learning the position. Just stock his contract with incentives based on performance. Collins is a different matter, they may have to franchise him for a yr, Will see how it goes, I wouldn't pay him more than 11/12 million on a contract now, rumor is he wants more than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Just watched some videos on NFL Network, and Ian Rappaport stated that Browns are basically giving Collins an "8 game tryout", and Collins' agent actually said the linebacker is happy about going to Cleveland and going to a team that wants him. Rappaport further stated that Collins and his agent turned down a deal with Patriots that would've paid him over $10 million a year. Yikes! It's also been said by multiple analysts that Patriots were tired of Collins "doing whatever he wanted to" on defense, and he did that a few times against the Bills. One such play was a 28 yard gain by the Bills, and it infuriated the Pats. That, combined with his inability to stay healthy, make Collins disposable. Jamie Collins knows NOTHING about our defensive scheme, and I'm not even sure where the guy will play. Demario Davis has been playing well enough, Kirksey has been even better, and I'm not sure who will sit the bench in order for Collins to get time. Still, if Collins can stay healthy and make PLAYS, then I think we have a nice fixture on the defensive side of the ball. Rappaport also said that Browns will have to get a deal done because they will most likely franchise Pryor. ROLB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Collins is a good football player but can you imagine how the dude feels? Hey man, you're getting traded from the best organization and team in football to pretty much the worst. Oh also you still get to play in shitty cold weather. As long as he has a good attitude though this is a great pick-up. Collins is one of those dudes who just does everything well but nothing incredible which I LOVE at the LB position. I can't see him staying beyond the 8 weeks that are left in the season.. Someone mentioned franchising him.. I can't see it.. the only guys worth franchising are probably Duke Johnson or TP.. If he stays.. It would mean that Hue survives the season.. And talked up some good shit to him. But , if we go 0-16.. I'm sure someones gonna have to go. I can see a situation. Say That Haslam , wants Horton out. I could see Hue coming back with.. "I need My guy".. "If he goes, I'm going with him sort of thing.. Ala Jim Mora Sr. with the Colts when Jim Irsay wanted to get rid of then Colts DC Vic Fangio... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Well, Im encouraged that the Browns have finally tried to add a quality linebacker.....it's about freakin time.... BUT....not sure if this is the right one, so well have to see.......there are some less than flattering comments coming out of New England on his coachability....and Ive heard rumors he's looking for a big(10 mil plus) pay day... So...lets hope he's good.....and lets REALLY hope he plays more than 8 games....cause IF they pay a 3rd to only rent this guy, then thats bad bad business.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBrown Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 An entire industry tries to get inside Bill Belichick's head after every surprising move he makes, and no one has successfully cracked the code yet. That leaves a lot of guesswork on days like Monday, when the Patriots traded star linebacker Jamie Collins to Cleveland for a mediocre third-round compensatory pick. Even for Belichick, this marks uncharted territory on the "What the ... ?" scale. Belichick has traded away great players before, from Richard Seymour to Randy Moss to Chandler Jones and Logan Mankins. Money is always part of the equation, as it likely was with Collins, who is in the final year of his rookie deal. The Moss trade is the closest precedent to the Collins swap, but Moss was on the downturn of his great career. That's not the case with Collins. Collins, 27, is coming off a second-team All-Pro season. While he may have given up a few big plays this year, he was making impact plays all season. ProFootball Focus had him ranked as the top 4-3 outside linebacker in football. Belichick clearly saw Collins' talent differently, but that's only part of this equation. The trade is the most shocking of the Belichick era because of the timing. The Patriots are 7-1 during yet another season where Tom Brady could make a run at the MVP award. Brady is 39 years old, and conventional wisdom would suggest the Patriots should do everything possible to win another ring while Brady is still at his peak. Belichick has no use for your conventional wisdom, and he probably enjoys thumbing his nose at it. The Collins trade is part of an overall organizational philosophy that limits the importance of any non-Brady player in the ultimate team sport. Many of New England's shocking moves over the years have worked out brilliantly, and many have not. But it's hard to argue with how the overall philosophy has shaped the team's success, especially during the current run of six consecutive playoff byes. It's almost like Belichick operates in a post-take society, where he is above immediate criticism but also shouldn't be handed reflective praise. He's going to do what he wants and trust his version of The Process. We're just the ones reacting in his wake. And with that in mind, here are a few quick winners and losers from the Collins deal: Winners Sashi Brown, Cleveland Browns executive vice president of football operations: The Browns have plenty of young players and draft picks. They need top-shelf core pieces to build around, and Collins qualifies. Giving up a third-round compensatory pick for the right to test-drive Collins, which includes an exclusive negotiating window with him until next March, is absolutely worth the possibility of "wasting" the pick. It's a low-risk, high-reward trade. It's crazy to think that the Browns got a fifth-round pick for linebacker Barkevious Mingo from New England, while Collins was only worth a late-third round pick. Browns coach Hue Jackson might have to sell Collins on the prospect of the 0-8 Browns long-term, but money ultimately talks in these scenarios. We suspect the Browns will be ready to make Collins one of football's highest-paid defensive players, and they have plenty of cap room to do so. Great NFL players rarely make it to free agency, and Collins is unlikely to be an exception. fr0m NFL.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Bone Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 Interesting trade for sure....... Good to see them trying to add quality in other ways besides 17 draft picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted October 31, 2016 Report Share Posted October 31, 2016 We need a good linebacker....soooooo bad it isnt even funny anymore.....cant wait to see what he brings! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unsympathetic Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Demario Davis has been playing well enough Not really. He was 69th out of 94 LB's on PFF last season, and will be even lower this season. He's below average. The question should be who is hurting us worse, ILB Davis or the OLB.. and I nominate Davis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Not really. He was 69th out of 94 LB's on PFF last season, and will be even lower this season. He's below average. Agreed.....our one true FA signing was just another step down(in salary and quality) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 So is collins an ILB'er or OLB'er? If he's gonna play OLB'er than it seems we're doubling down on the 3-4 which means Og or Nas could be on the bubble next year. Unless we're moving on from Orch? I dunno...Collins arrival probably means adioa to Holmes and that other olb'er who's name escapes me now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 He's an OLB, which (hopefully) confirms the Ogbah experiment is over......and also confirms that Schobert hitting the bench wasnt a mistake(been calling for that since the 2nd preseason game).....Id expect Ogs and Nassib to be your 2 ends and the 4-3 to be used more often....other olbs are lemonier or something like that?....& Cam Johnson..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 ROLB Agree... Another factor making Collins expendable mentioned on NFL Insiders today is the play of Rookie LB Elandon Roberts, a 6th rounder out of UH. At 5'11 and 235 he's the physical opposite of Collins, but has impressed Bill B & Co. Showed a play in their game vs. us where he met Joe T trying to run block him and planted Joe on his ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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