Osiris Posted November 2, 2016 Report Share Posted November 2, 2016 Im interested to see where he plays most in our defense. Ive been pinging for a 4-3 for years with a stud cover/blitzing olb'er. Howvwe should have used mingo imo. He will replace Schobert at OLB in our 3-4 and 4-3 sets, and pair up with Kirksey in nickle sets. Davis will be relegated to a two-down linebacker role. In other words, Collins is probably not coming off the field much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted November 2, 2016 Report Share Posted November 2, 2016 kind of sounds a bit like Justin Gilbert; lack of dedication to the game and relies on athleticism to get by. However, unlike Gilbert, Collins seems to make it work somehow. The Browns are 0-8 right now. I didn't think they could get worse than last year's 3-13 and O'Niel defense but the Browns are on track to prove me wrong. Hopefully, if nothing else, this move shows the team that the FO is not giving up on this season. Reads like Belichick's capsule summary of why he sent both Collins and Chandler packing... And if he doesn't work out, really not much lost. A low third round pick for a tryout. We may even get that compensatory pick back if we can't work out a deal, (or he sucks) and he bolts. Bill's got salary issues starting with Brady & Gronk's contracts. Sheard is getting paid too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted November 2, 2016 Report Share Posted November 2, 2016 Bill's got salary issues starting with Brady & Gronk's contracts. Sheard is getting paid too. Ummmm.... no. Brady is one of the cheaper starting QBs in the league cap-wise... let alone a star. He's restructured his deal a couple times to make it more cap friendly. And I believe Gronk has already done his extention. With ending contracts included the Pats will be $66mm under the 2017 cap. Scan their UFA list and see how many "must resigns" you see. I see maybe 4... http://overthecap.com/free-agency/new-england-patriots/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted November 2, 2016 Report Share Posted November 2, 2016 One of my favorite football lines comes from Jack dell Rio & it goes "We play a game called football. So lets not try to build a space machine to land on Mars" We got a Guy coming in here this Sunday named Zeke Elliott. Jamie Collins feel free to lance his ass all day. Where Zeke goes you go..Horton can't even mess this up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unsympathetic Posted November 2, 2016 Report Share Posted November 2, 2016 Collins confirms he never asked for anything close to Von Miller money Somebody was lying.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBrown Posted November 2, 2016 Report Share Posted November 2, 2016 Ummmm.... no. Brady is one of the cheaper starting QBs in the league cap-wise... let alone a star. He's restructured his deal a couple times to make it more cap friendly. And I believe Gronk has already done his extention. With ending contracts included the Pats will be $66mm under the 2017 cap. Scan their UFA list and see how many "must resigns" you see. I see maybe 4... http://overthecap.com/free-agency/new-england-patriots/ That is a form of cheating IMO, Brady can take lower money now to help the rest of the cap because he's earnt enough. In a league where the draft etc is designed to keep it fair and competitive that doesn't wash. Expect he'll be paid millions by Kraft after he retires in some bullshit capacity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted November 2, 2016 Report Share Posted November 2, 2016 One of my favorite football lines comes from Jack dell Rio & it goes "We play a game called football. So lets not try to build a space machine to land on Mars" We got a Guy coming in here this Sunday named Zeke Elliott. Jamie Collins feel free to lance his ass all day. Where Zeke goes you go..Horton can't even mess this up zeke was great at OSU even tho i disliked his gay mid-drift cutoff shirts and even the stoopid text to some douchebag asking for a date.... break him in half sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Franchise Pryor? That's crazy talk. $14.5 million? That's the current franchise tag for a WR. He's good, but AJ Green or Julio Jones good? Not yet by a long shot in my book. I agree. Pryor is playing great, but no way in hell we franchise tag him. Unless we really just can't find people to give money to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taco918 Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 That is a form of cheating IMO, Brady can take lower money now to help the rest of the cap because he's earnt enough. In a league where the draft etc is designed to keep it fair and competitive that doesn't wash. Expect he'll be paid millions by Kraft after he retires in some bullshit capacity He can take less because his wife is the bread winner of the family. As much as I'd like to call it cheating, and as much as I hate to give him credit, he played it right on this on. Don't hate the player..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 It is indeed bullshit, and the league is a little bit helpless to do anything about it unless they introduce salary caps for front office staff or whatever as well. But, if the browns are doing it in 15 years with Cody Kessler, I'm pretty sure nobody here would be complaining too much about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 "Browns coach Hue Jackson, in defense of Collins, even seemed to acknowledge that Collins doesn't stick to the game plan, saying, "The way he freelances is OK with me." ...and The Ghoul would point out that Hue does not instill discipline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 ...and The Ghoul would point out that Hue does not instill discipline. We were all just dying to know the words of wisdom of a sad washed up internet troll. Did you save any of his other sage advice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 Pryor's agent is Drew Rosenhaus, a notorious asshole. Pricing Pryor's contract is EXTREMELY difficult, as there really isn't someone to compare him to. The difficulty lies in assessing his "ceiling". If this is really his "first year" playing WR (I know he played last year, but was limited by injury and didn't have much playing time), and he's doing THIS well with random QB's, then what could the guy do with another year under his belt with a STABLE QB situation? It's fun to think about. He literally has EVERYTHING you look for in a star WR, and I really think he can reach that elite level. He obviously works HARD, he's committed to Hue Jackson, and his physical traits are mind numbing. So I disagree when I hear people say that there's no way we'll franchise him for $15 million for ONE season. Is that a shitload of money? Lord yes, but we have it, and we know we need Pryor. We CAN'T let him leave, so we'll do whatever we have to in order to keep his services. Another reason? We're the team that took the risk, that cultivated his talent, that went out on a limb when nobody else would. Pryor is OUR "find", and that's a feather in the cap of our talent gurus. 31 other teams dropped the ball on Pryor, and we ALMOST did. We let him walk last year, and the Patriots damn near scooped him up. Can you IMAGINE Tom Brady throwing the ball to Pryor this year? Yeesh. My guess? We sign Jamie Collins THIS year to a long deal, and we franchise Pryor. In a perfect world, we sign both of them, but I don't see that happening. Collins is on record saying that he was never offered $10 million a year by Patriots, and he NEVER said he wants "Von Miller money" because he's NOT Von Miller. Don't get me wrong, we're still going to make Collins a VERY rich man, but it made me happy to know he disputed those statements. We wouldn't have made the trade unless we felt confident in securing Collins long term. We didn't have a defensive centerpiece...something we needed....and now we do. The exciting thing to me (about Collins) is how his presence will make everyone else better. Kirksey is playing better and better, and with Collins to worry about, he'll have the opportunity to make even more plays. Shelton is playing better and CONSISTENT, so maybe he frees some stuff up for Collins? We've been gashed by several tight ends this year, and guess who is one of the best at covering TE's? Collins. We're getting better. We're getting higher levels of talent. Can we do it ALL in one year? No, no we can't. We're DYING for secondary help, and we need to find a way to get some damn turnovers. I said before the season started that if we FINISHED strong I'd be happy. We still have a chance to do that, no matter how unlikely. If Cody cements his status as our starting QB, Collins gets signed and he's the stud we think, we can go into next year with some real pieces to the puzzle intact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 We have the franchise tag if and when he decides to hold us up. Which I assume he will. A good quality player can't hurt. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 That is a form of cheating IMO, Brady can take lower money now to help the rest of the cap because he's earnt enough. In a league where the draft etc is designed to keep it fair and competitive that doesn't wash. Expect he'll be paid millions by Kraft after he retires in some bullshit capacity Possible route, but not how "restructuring" typically works... and nothing suggests it is happening here. When Brady's contract was renegotiated this year to extend it thru 2019, it included a $28mm "signing bonus". Most of this bonus was guaranteed money he was due over the 2016 and 2017 seasons which would have made his cap number huge now. Instead a big chunk of those first two years is now spread over the next four years leaving the back-end, 2018 and 2019 numbers bigger. This was not his first extension to do the above. If he is still playing come 2018, they'll simply negotiate another extension, if needed. The danger is the short-term, dead money impact of a player suddenly deciding to leave the game. Not exactly a big risk in Tom's case... http://overthecap.com/player/tom-brady/1250/ http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1665623-how-does-the-salary-cap-work-in-the-nfl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 So I disagree when I hear people say that there's no way we'll franchise him for $15 million for ONE season. Is that a shitload of money? Lord yes, but we have it, and we know we need Pryor. We CAN'T let him leave, so we'll do whatever we have to in order to keep his services. The Kirk Cousins' argument... good thought... As with Kirk, a deeper resume would certainly help define Pryor's value. Unfortunately the tag route has often carried the side affect of destroying good will between players and their FOs. A better route might actually be the Alex Mack approach. Let Pryor cut his best FA deal with us retaining the right of first refusal. Even if a team installed an opt-out clause in their offer as JAX did with Mack, in Pryor's case we'd have his good will to fall back upon. At least we'd have it as long as Hue is here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 ...and The Ghoul would point out that Hue does not instill discipline. We were all just dying to know the words of wisdom of a sad washed up internet troll. Did you save any of his other sage advice? So then, are you happy with that statement of Hue's? That Collins can freelance here if he wants? I don't think that sends out the proper message. Sounds kind of 'undisciplined'...wouldn't you say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted November 3, 2016 Report Share Posted November 3, 2016 So then, are you happy with that statement of Hue's? That Collins can freelance here if he wants? I don't think that sends out the proper message. Sounds kind of 'undisciplined'...wouldn't you say? Yes, I am happy with it. Thank you for asking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPPT1974 Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Bill B and the organization of the Pats are pretty frugal from what I hear. Except for Tom Brady! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Depends on what the assignments are around you. There are schemes that free up safeties with no assignment other than to simply read keys and go off what they see and anticipate. You can do that with linebackers although to a lesser extent because of their responsibility in the run game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 ...and The Ghoul would point out that Hue does not instill discipline. As I would say- takes one to know one. It's why he's not around anymore- didn't have the discipline to stick to his allocated (unmoderated) thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 I'm usually leery of paying big money 4 a player from a great organization. How much a part of their success is this guy or vice versa? I could pay millions of dollars to get Bill Wyman to play on a record but it won't make it the Rolling Stones. But again, it can't hurt. If in fact the players are at fault and not Ray Horton. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Jamie Collins is expected to play "a lot" this weekend, and may even start. That's pretty amazing considering he's been with us for a couple of days. I'm eager to see him matched up on Jason Whitten. The other thing I'm interested to see is if there is a "contagious effect" regarding Collins' presence. You ever play a game of pool against a more talented player and notice how you play better and vice versa? People tend to rise to the level of talent around them, and my hope (no matter how silly) is that our defensive players will get a shot in the arm with Collins along side. Don't get it twisted, Jamie Collins is a top 5 linebacker in the NFL. He is now on our team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Don't get it twisted, Jamie Collins is a top 5 linebacker in the NFL. He is now on our team. Which makes it all the more concerning that bill let him go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 I hear ya what you're saying, but Bill does this crap. They have another defender that they'll have to pay or franchise, and didn't think they could keep both. Collins refuted the claims that the Patriots offered him $10 mill a year or that he wanted "Von Miller Money". Basically, he insinuated that he was offered $10 mill a year, he'd still BE THERE, LOL. Bill probably has some walk-on from Topeka Technical College that nobody has heard of, but is completely amazing, stashed on the practice squad. Hahaha. The trick for our front office is keeping both Pryor and Collins. We can't tag both of them, and I'm not so sure either will be easy to sign. If we're going to start building something, we can't lose high caliber players like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Pryor wants to stay (with Hue). That deal should be done soon after the season end I would imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Which makes it all the more concerning that bill let him go It's the old Trojan Horse Theory then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 It's the old Trojan Horse Theory then? The old "they hated me in cleveland, so I'll fuck em over any chance I get" theory, possibly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 Which makes it all the more concerning that bill let him go True enough. Bill has rarely made mistakes on players he's let go. Look no further than the QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted November 4, 2016 Report Share Posted November 4, 2016 The old "they hated me in cleveland, so I'll fuck em over any chance I get" theory, possibly. So it's the old Trojan Condom theory! :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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