The 'Who you watching?' 2020 thread.

[Tour2ma]

53 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

What I see here is that these services more or less placed  Tristan Wirf at the top of the rankings..... and that given the choice of whom to take, Wirfs would seem to be the guy....yet when I chose him for the Browns, you more or less disparaged that choice.   Curioser and curioser Alice. 

Not at all, Madhatter... just shows what we already know differentiates my prospect opinions from your CBS list... I mean your "opinions". But I'll tell you what's curious...

Ever noticed that there's essentially no support around here for Wirfs?

I doubt it...

You did not even notice that DraftScout put Wirfs thru Thomas all in the same Tier and same pick range... and that's after I explained it to you. That means they are essentially all the same in their eyes...

Ditto for a DraftNet range of 7,8 - 10,11 says the prospects are indistinguishable in their evaluators eyes.

 

That's alright tho... you need the strict adherence of them as listed to validate what your eyes haven't "seen".

I don't cause I cheat... I look at the prospects.

And yeah it is fun... even when I'm wrong.

 

As for you not "feigning expertise"... do want to put that to a poll? lol...

As for looking to others work... yes, we both do. The difference is that is the end of your curiosity... while it's the beginning of mine.

[The Gipper]

9 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

Not at all, Madhatter... just shows what we already know differentiates my prospect opinions from your CBS list... I mean your "opinions". But I'll tell you what's curious...

Ever noticed that there's essentially no support around here for Wirfs?

I doubt it...

You did not even notice that DraftScout put Wirfs thru Thomas all in the same Tier and same pick range... and that's after I explained it to you. That means they are essentially all the same in their eyes...

What I noticed is that when they ranked them, the had Wirfs on top

Ditto for a DraftNet range of 7,8 - 10,11 says the prospects are indistinguishable in their evaluators eyes.

But, again, they had Wirfs on Top.  

 

That's alright tho... you need the strict adherence of them as listed to validate what your eyes haven't "seen".

I don't need anything really.  I was only playing the  Browns Board Mock Draft game.  I took the guy that was ranked highest. But maybe I would have taken the guy you like...but the fact was....someone else grabbed him and he was not there.  I am only explaining my selection of Wirfs, not defending it...other than to say he was the top ranked guy available.

I don't cause I cheat... I look at the prospects.

And yeah it is fun... even when I'm wrong.

If it supposed to be fun...then why do you take it so seriously?  And express righteous indignation when some opinion runs counter to yours?

I mean, I don't care that much.  All I really care about is that the Browns actually get the pick right.

 

As for you not "feigning expertise"... do want to put that to a poll? lol...

Sure....because I have never, ever, ever, never pretended or declared that I was some kind of scouting afficianado. ever. 

As for looking to others work... yes, we both do. The difference is that is the end of your curiosity... while it's the beginning of mine.

Yes it is the end of mine.  Like I said  all that shit you waste your time with....scouting players, scouring scouting servies,  bores the fucking life out of me. As for their  being no support for Wirfs  here, which of the other people on here are professional football scouts?  And when you had the opportunity to put whatever efforts you have made doing all that boring shite....by participating in the Board draft....you weaseled out.  Took your ball and went home.  Why?  Because you didn't get to pick for the Browns?   Well, the rule around here was that whoever stepped up to the plate to run the game as commish got to take the Browns.   I would have turned it over to you if you wanted that badly.   If that was it, well then, next year...step up!

[Tour2ma]

"Step up" ... lol...

As for your boredom... fine... not your thing... but in that case...

... why is it you are posting in a thread entitled, "Who are you watching?"

lol..

It's abundantly clear that your only post should have been, "No one."

 

That would have cut this thread's page count by about a third...

[The Gipper]

44 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

"Step up" ... lol...

As for your boredom... fine... not your thing... but in that case...

... why is it you are posting in a thread entitled, "Who are you watching?"

lol..

It's abundantly clear that your only post should have been, "No one."

 

That would have cut this thread's page count by about a third...

Actually....I did not start that (this)  thread with that title .....I think it was one that got merged with another thread that I did start....so my name got attributed to beginning this, but this was combined.  Have to ask Z or Larry how/why that happened.  Here is my original post....it may have been entitled like "Draft Talk or Draft needs" ? or something: 

 

I  believe, with this loss, the Browns are mathematically eliminated.    Even with their loss, the Titans worst record can be 8-8.  The best the Browns can be is 8-8.  The Tits hold the  head to head tie breaker.   Maybe, if, somehow, there were a 3 way tie or something they could still have a chance....but who can count on that.

Ergo....time for draft talk. Right?   Too early?

As things stand now, the Browns would draft basically right in the middle:   #14. 

Besides better coaching...better coaching...and better coaching   what are the Browns most pressing personnel needs to go after in FA or the Draft?  

[tiamat63]

2 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

Actually....I did not start that (this)  thread.....I think it was one that got merged with another thread that I did start....so my name got attributed to begining this, but this was combined.  Have to ask Z or Larry how/why that happened. 

It was my thread at first.

Couldn't even begin to tell why all that happened.

[SdBacker80]

Day 3 guys like... 
Terence Steele RT Texas Tech may take a flyer on him Day 3.  One of those depth developmental guys.   4 year starter 2 year Captain.

Anthony McFarland RB Maryland the high ankle sprain this past year derailed his probable Top 50-75 prospect status.  Someone may look past it and draft him in that area.  But he’s Speed and a great #2 possibility for us post Hunt.

Austin Mack WR OSU.  caught the ball his senior year.  nice size body control good route runner.  Was a big time recruit that just developed later and got lost in crowd at OSU. 

[Dutch Oven]

2 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

Why are you are posting in a thread entitled, "Who are you watching?"

That would have cut this thread's page count by about a third...

Why does a drug addict continue to do drugs? 

Because they just can't help themselves. THEY HAVE TO DO IT. 

[The Gipper]

34 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

Why does a drug addict continue to do drugs? 

Because they just can't help themselves. THEY HAVE TO DO IT. 

Is that self introspection?

[tiamat63]

In preparation for the possibility of Andrew Thomas being gone before 10, I really wanted to take a (much) longer look at Josh Jones.   And my 2nd viewing ended up being way more favorable than the initial one.    Who said 1st impressions are the most important...?

The So Good

- Good pad level and knee bend while not being overly slumped at the waist.

- Back flat and head up at the snap

- Hand placement and control when hitting a chip or combo block then moving to the 2nd level.   Much like Peart from UConn, he pretty routinely hit his mark when he got to LB's.

- Good eyes picking up delayed pressures on slide protects

- Quick pivot off lead foot and hip flexibility coming out of pulls.  Lateral movement doesn't appear to be much of an issue.

- Solid lock out on arms once he gets his hands on would-be rushers

- Lateral movement passing off and picking up rushers on stunts looks clean

- Heavy hands and strikes in run blocking, tends to "lean into" the hit at times.  But on the flip side, he doesn't lower his eyes.  There's a lot to be said about seeing what you're hitting.

 

The Not So Great.

- 2pt stance is a bit narrow at times.  Not dangerously narrow at the college level, but it will really be necessary to have coaches work that out of him.  Narrow base made him a bit more susceptible to a bull rush but he recovered from good lower strength more often than not.  But he has some "pigeon toed" work to his stance that needs corrected. 

- Kick step is... not ideal.  Sometimes he drops his lead foot back and ends up taking a few back steps before an actual "kick" technique can be seen.  

- A few times he seemed to be confused by his assignment when he didn't have chip help.  Film room and position coach will have a baseline on where to start his mental development as well. 

- First punch against edge in pass pro isn't devastating but seems to work decent enough.  He can see it with his eyes up, I would just like to see a heavier contact until the footwork can be cleaned up.

 - Not sure about his wingspan, haven't double checked the numbers.  Doesn't look ridiculous, despite the fact he redirects edge rushers outside and far enough up field away from QB. So arm length might be an issue at some point?    Though that is just more of a gut feeling than anything.

- Some pretty nasty wiffs on cut blocks

 

I came away not feeling overwhelmed and I still  prefer Andrew Thomas.  But I do see a viable prospect with upside who won't be experiencing an even steeper learning curve by being drafted as a RT only to have to flip to the opposite side while getting adjusted to NFL speed.    I don't suppose I would hate the pick at 10, but if there's a trade down paired with him not being off the board at the next pick - I would feel more comfortable with that.

 

edit:  Just consulted with @Tour2ma's  OL combine measurement thread...  my eyes are still pretty sharp.    JJ checks in on the smaller side of arm length and total wingspan.

 

[tiamat63]

Unpopular opinion after a little late night comparison session.

- I would take Okie's Gallimore to be a nose in the defense I would build before I would take South Carolina's Kinlaw.

Especially unpopular with certain grading sites.

[The Gipper]

20 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Unpopular opinion after a little late night comparison session.

- I would take Okie's Gallimore to be a nose in the defense I would build before I would take South Carolina's Kinlaw.

Especially unpopular with certain grading sites.

Some have him rated as 2d round.    Could be value pick if he were to drop to #41.

[tiamat63]

3 hours ago, The Gipper said:

Some have him rated as 2d round.    Could be value pick if he were to drop to #41.

That's still high to take a position we have currently played by Jobi and Billings (to an extent)

The kid is good and I'd love to have him, but we have bigger needs elsewhere.

 

Oh, and, we might have to start talking about Geno Stone.

 

 

edit:  @calfoxwc    Might want to watch the above clip when you get a chance.  You're one of the more vocal people on this board about finding "football players" first and foremost.    Stone might be the embodiment of  that phrase.

[SdBacker80]

I’m not trying to be an OSU homer but I’m running the pick up if Davon Hamilton is available to us in the 3rd round.  I watched the Senior Bowl yesterday.  He was getting great penetration.  By expert accounts he had a great week there too.  I’m not basing it all on the Sr. Bowl he anchored the interior very well for OSU and did well in the few opportunities he had.

 I think he was very solid last year but invisible at times with Chase Young.  I had him as a good run stuffer, but I think he’s got some potential getting some interior pass rush as well.

we are talking about guys in the 1st and 2nd this is one of those sleeper 3rd rounders 

[tiamat63]

10 minutes ago, SdBacker80 said:

I’m not trying to be an OSU homer but I’m running the pick up if Davon Hamilton is available to us in the 3rd round.  I watched the Senior Bowl yesterday.  He was getting great penetration.  By expert accounts he had a great week there too.  I’m not basing it all on the Sr. Bowl he anchored the interior very well for OSU and did well in the few opportunities he had.

 I think he was very solid last year but invisible at times with Chase Young.  I had him as a good run stuffer, but I think he’s got some potential getting some interior pass rush as well.

we are talking about guys in the 1st and 2nd this is one of those sleeper 3rd rounders 

That's the nice thing about hammy, he might fall to late 3rd and beyond. Probably 4th.

[Icecube]

Sports show to sports show are now all saying (with tongue in cheek) "Browns are not trying to trade OBJ" but then are offering the caveat that they probably were but since they can't get that 1st round pick, they are changing the dialog in case OBJ remains on the team. OBJ is doing the same. Really, what other choice do they have? 

[SdBacker80]

22 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

That's the nice thing about hammy, he might fall to late 3rd and beyond. Probably 4th.

I’m not seeing 4th round.  He put together a nice Combine and all star game.  And He Had some good tape in 18 and 19.

ill be shocked if he’s Day 3. 

 

 

[tiamat63]

1 minute ago, SdBacker80 said:

I’m not seeing 4th round.  He put together a nice Combine and all star game.  And He Had some good tape in 18 and 19.

ill be shocked if he’s Day 3. 

 

 

That's the beauty of dline.  It's an unsexy pick, so the workman like of the group go unnoticed.  Especially if there are position runs that start in the 3rd round like RB and TE.

15 minutes ago, Icecube said:

Sports show to sports show are now all saying (with tongue in cheek) "Browns are not trying to trade OBJ" but then are offering the caveat that they probably were but since they can't get that 1st round pick, they are changing the dialog in case OBJ remains on the team. OBJ is doing the same. Really, what other choice do they have? 

Stay the fuck out of my thread with your bullshit.  Even if it is an accidental post.

[Tour2ma]

How far do I have to get into the Geno Stone vid before I see a highlight?

Kid's too slow for the pros, tia...

 

[The Gipper]

2 hours ago, Icecube said:

Sports show to sports show are now all saying (with tongue in cheek) "Browns are not trying to trade OBJ" but then are offering the caveat that they probably were but since they can't get that 1st round pick, they are changing the dialog in case OBJ remains on the team. OBJ is doing the same. Really, what other choice do they have? 

Don't pollute this thread with all your  effluvia. 

[tiamat63]

1 hour ago, Tour2ma said:

How far do I have to get into the Geno Stone vid before I see a highlight?

Kid's too slow for the pros, tia...

 

It isn't so much the "highlight plays".  He's athletically limited but mentally you see split safety tools.  Late (late) round may be udfa type tools, but the kid might earn a spot somewhere. 

I just appreciate the blue collar player every so often.

[calfoxwc]

About Devon Hamilton (oops, fixed) - I think I drafted him in the sixth round in my stupid mock. He isn't overlooked anymore, he'll go earlier.

About Geno Stone - the kid seems like he's very, very football smart. If it were me, I could draft this kid in the seventh, or sign him as a UDFA, and he might turn out to be a big player on special teams. He's a rough tough safety - he actually has a higher grade as a safety as Joe Schobert did as a lb. He's smallish - 5'10", 207 lbs.

And Joe Schobert made All-pro on guts, smarts and a love for the game. Great instincts.

   I could guess special teams for Stone, because he is a football player, like Tiam mentioned. I suppose if I were deciding - this kid might surprise a lot of people in the end zone -

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/geno-stone?id=32195354-4f39-6630-4d73-2328fd2eb451

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/joe-schobert?id=2555166

I mean - Tyrann Mathieu (of "honey badger" fame), was only 5'9", 190 lbs....he ran a 4.5x, and was a cb. Now listed as a safety.

Stone ran a 4.62? Sure, slow for a safety.... but I think he might end up as a role player - and special teams ace - found toward the end of the draft, or afterwards. Me, I wouldn't overlook the kid entirely. Let's put it this way - there is all sorts of kids with a whole lot more going for them physically, and some don't care about the game and don't make it, even drafted high.

[gumby73]

Spoken like true Buckeyes fans 😎.... Ya get Malik or ya get Hammy!! now which one is it? 🤔... M A L I K for me! they are both ranked in the 60's 

[SdBacker80]

Tanner Muse kind of the same overachiever type as a guy like Stone- probably has more upside as a special teams player too with his speed and length.

Muse seems to have the skill set and measurables to cover TEs in the league too 

[The Gipper]

29 minutes ago, gumby73 said:

Spoken like true Buckeyes fans 😎.... Ya get Malik or ya get Hammy!! now which one is it? 🤔... M A L I K for me! they are both ranked in the 60's 

Malik for me....a greater position of need.  (I took him for the Browns in round 3 of our mock, if you recall).    But I have seen some ratings that put him higher. 

[Flugel]

13 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

Stay the fuck out of my thread with your bullshit.  Even if it is an accidental post.

That's Hall of Fame material... 

[Nero]

On 2/22/2020 at 4:15 PM, tiamat63 said:

Now I just need to find a game to play.

Anywho, they introduced me to discord - VOIP app.    It's what they use to talk while playing. 

Me and my friends are hooked up to Age of Empires II. Using Discord now (after using Hangouts and Teamspeak for some weeks). 

We play old Conquerors in HD (with no expansions) and I have Definitive Edition and I spend some time on it by myself. 

[tiamat63]

1 hour ago, Nero said:

Me and my friends are hooked up to Age of Empires II. Using Discord now (after using Hangouts and Teamspeak for some weeks). 

We play old Conquerors in HD (with no expansions) and I have Definitive Edition and I spend some time on it by myself. 

You've reached the limits of my neediness there, friend.

 

I've got Madden...?  Had Battlefield.   So there's that.

[Nero]

18 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

You've reached the limits of my neediness there, friend.

 

I've got Madden...?  Had Battlefield.   So there's that.

It was just a comment. I played a bit of Madden some years ago and it was maddening for me. I played Call of Duty too, though Battlefield sounds more strategy oriented and surely I'd like it. 

I've spent many years not playing videogames because I was really hooked up during childhood-teenage years, but now that is kind of a meeting point for friends... 

[tiamat63]

1 hour ago, Nero said:

It was just a comment. I played a bit of Madden some years ago and it was maddening for me. I played Call of Duty too, though Battlefield sounds more strategy oriented and surely I'd like it. 

I've spent many years not playing videogames because I was really hooked up during childhood-teenage years, but now that is kind of a meeting point for friends... 

That's real.  It is kind of nice having that virtual playground to meet up with my friends.  Good getting a chance to talk to them every so often.

If you come across any games you might recommend - holla.

[calfoxwc]

26 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

That's real.  It is kind of nice having that virtual playground to meet up with my friends.  Good getting a chance to talk to them every so often.

If you come across any games you might recommend - holla.

I love "Sniper Ghost Warrior 3". It's amazing - I haven't played for a while - been busy with other stuff - but it is impressive -