2023 Off-Season Free Agent moves/signings

[tiamat63]

 As good a place as any to discuss the Free Agent pool comings and goings in the greater scope of the NFL. 

 Any individual free agent signings for the Browns can go either here or they're own respective threads.   I'll kick this off. 

NFC South just got a whole hell of a lot more interesting. 

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35797963/sources-saints-front-runners-sign-qb-derek-carr

[TexasAg1969]

NFL Network will be running a program on free agents this coming Sunday @ 100pm EDT and it appears to repeat every hour through 700pm.

[ballpeen]

2 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

 As good a place as any to discuss the Free Agent pool comings and goings in the greater scope of the NFL. 

 Any individual free agent signings for the Browns can go either here or they're own respective threads.   I'll kick this off. 

NFC South just got a whole hell of a lot more interesting. 

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35797963/sources-saints-front-runners-sign-qb-derek-carr

Thanks.  No doubt this is the place to start.  Free agents are the name of the game for the next 6 weeks or so.

 

I will make a suggestion.  If/when we sign someone, lets have it in a new thread.  Some news needs to go in an existing thread.  If some remember a poster named Shep, he started new threads with every post.  He was a nice guy but it got maddening that he would rarely post in an existing thread other than his.  He'd start 25 a day.

 

That said, it also makes it hard if breaking news on players gets buried on page 9, or 30.

[tiamat63]

 Works for me.  Just tossing out a name here because I've seen the trend of Schwartz bringing a player or two with him from previous teams.  Given the Browns need at safety and Epps' salary demands not looking too much, seems like a natural mutual interest.  

[syd]

5 hours ago, ballpeen said:

Thanks.  No doubt this is the place to start.  Free agents are the name of the game for the next 6 weeks or so.

 

I will make a suggestion.  If/when we sign someone, lets have it in a new thread.  Some news needs to go in an existing thread.  If some remember a poster named Shep, he started new threads with every post.  He was a nice guy but it got maddening that he would rarely post in an existing thread other than his.  He'd start 25 a day.

 

That said, it also makes it hard if breaking news on players gets buried on page 9, or 30.

ya I remember shep from a different board and I think it's safe to say he didnt like me very much

[syd]

wasnt sure where to put this being that pro days will be coming up soon when do the Browns say who and where they will be going

[Orion]

6 hours ago, ballpeen said:

f some remember a poster named Shep

I remember him for another board.  Is he ok?

[Orion]

9 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35797963/sources-saints-front-runners-sign-qb-derek-carr

Carr will receive $60 fully guaranteed at signing 

....Oh how the mighty have fallen.    

[ballpeen]

10 hours ago, syd said:

ya I remember shep from a different board and I think it's safe to say he didnt like me very much

I don't think they were one and the same if it is the same Shep I knew on another board.

[Flugel]

16 hours ago, ballpeen said:

I will make a suggestion.  If/when we sign someone, lets have it in a new thread.  Some news needs to go in an existing thread.  If some remember a poster named Shep, he started new threads with every post.  He was a nice guy but it got maddening that he would rarely post in an existing thread other than his.  He'd start 25 a day.

That said, it also makes it hard if breaking news on players gets buried on page 9, or 30.

YES, thank you for that suggestion!  Many good conversations with a lot of participants gets cut off by that stuff.  Shep just never read the subject headings to realize stuff he thought he was adding was already written; and like many of us/me at times - he didn't always stick to the topic.  If we can do that, the breaking news stuff can be pretty efficient.  @mjp28 does a great job in here with his willingness to pin a good conversation/informational piece among other things.  This could be one of those topics as well as the Mock Drafts instead of seeing 50 different Mock Draft headings.  It can really clean up the information sharing and shopping this time of year.

[ballpeen]

It just makes it easier.  I don't follow twitter and don't get all the breaking news.  It's just easier to come here, see a thread talking about the new guy we just hired rather than find it buried in some existing, generic thread, but on the other hand we don't need 5 threads talking about the same thing.  We need to combine them and talk about Joe Blow in one thread.

[tiamat63]

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35800565/sources-geno-smith-finalizing-3-year-105m-deal-seahawks

 

52 mil in the 1st year.   Good God.  

 On the bright side, the talks among the Ravens and Lamar have stalled.  Expected to be franchise tagged.  So I'm sure that will create a ton of goodwill between him and the organization.

[mjp28]

19 hours ago, Orion said:

Carr will receive $60 fully guaranteed at signing 

....Oh how the mighty have fallen.    

I heard Carr would end up with  $100M fully guaranteed in his 4 year deal.

Being a QB in the NFL.com might be the best game in town ..... no doubt !     

[ballpeen]

46 minutes ago, mjp28 said:

I heard Carr would end up with  $100M fully guaranteed in his 4 year deal.

Being a QB in the NFL.com might be the best game in town ..... no doubt !     

We knew this was going to happen as the new deal took hold and the cap kept going up if we looked forward..  The Watson deal might have been the first, but in 2-3 years, the Watson deal will look normal.

 

The game is headed towards top players and rookies.  You won't see many 6 year vets who are more or less average players.  It will be the stars with guys on 1st contracts.

[syd]

6 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35800565/sources-geno-smith-finalizing-3-year-105m-deal-seahawks

 

52 mil in the 1st year.   Good God.  

 On the bright side, the talks among the Ravens and Lamar have stalled.  Expected to be franchise tagged.  So I'm sure that will create a ton of goodwill between him and the organization.

non exclusive for lamar 

[TexasAg1969]

I'm thinking we are forced to look at free agency for an IDL because this year's draft does not appear to have a starter where we are currently drafting. We'd have to trade up a lot higher in the draft to find one. And the price would be too high in terms of what we would pay in picks.

[tiamat63]

3 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

I'm thinking we are forced to look at free agency for an IDL because this year's draft does not appear to have a starter where we are currently drafting. We'd have to trade up a lot higher in the draft to find one. And the price would be too high in terms of what we would pay in picks.

 Drafting a couple rookies isn't going to fix things overnight.  Then again, short of (likely) overpaying a free agent, little else will.  Even when we took Phil Taylor then followed it up next year with Hughes and Winn, keep in mind Rubin was already on roster - then we saw some improvement from the prior 2 season (that 2011 defense was so soft against the run). 

 Also worth pointing out, your boy Christian Barmore was a 2nd round pick who you valued as a 1st round, day 1 starting talent.  And that draft was so-so at the top with IDL as well.  So finding value players 3rd round and beyond, who can be plus contributors, is absolutely possible even now. 

[nickers]

2 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

 Drafting a couple rookies isn't going to fix things overnight.  Then again, short of (likely) overpaying a free agent, little else will.  Even when we took Phil Taylor then followed it up next year with Hughes and Winn, keep in mind Rubin was already on roster - then we saw some improvement from the prior 2 season (that 2011 defense was so soft against the run). 

 Also worth pointing out, your boy Christian Barmore was a 2nd round pick who you valued as a 1st round, day 1 starting talent.  And that draft was so-so at the top with IDL as well.  So finding value players 3rd round and beyond, who can be plus contributors, is absolutely possible even now. 

I'm dying to see what Schwartz will do with Winfrey... Provided Winfrey gets his head on straight...

[Orion]

14 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

I'm thinking we are forced to look at free agency for an ID

There's just too much need on the DL to expect the draft to fix it...knowing that we've gotta do something at WR, LB,  S, also.  And throw in TE and OLinemen of the future.  We've absolutely gotta utilize (spend $$ at) FA.

[ballpeen]

11 hours ago, nickers said:

I'm dying to see what Schwartz will do with Winfrey... Provided Winfrey gets his head on straight...

Sometimes that is a big want.  NFL drafts and teams are littered with former players who were never able to do that.

 

I agree with Tia that you can find starters in the later rounds. The problem is there is just some plain luck involved with that.  Maybe right chemistry.  Right coach, right city, right teammate, right scheme.  If all of that isn't right from the get go, maybe that player never becomes a good starter?

As for trading up, it might not cost all that much to trade up from #42 to say 35.  In the end I would rather see the Browns come away from the draft with 2 players who are actually pretty good football players over selecting 7 "guys".  You can find "guys" all over the practice squads and waiver wire.

[nickers]

31 minutes ago, ballpeen said:

Sometimes that is a big want.  NFL drafts and teams are littered with former players who were never able to do that.

 

I agree with Tia that you can find starters in the later rounds. The problem is there is just some plain luck involved with that.  Maybe right chemistry.  Right coach, right city, right teammate, right scheme.  If all of that isn't right from the get go, maybe that player never becomes a good starter?

As for trading up, it might not cost all that much to trade up from #42 to say 35.  In the end I would rather see the Browns come away from the draft with 2 players who are actually pretty good football players over selecting 7 "guys".  You can find "guys" all over the practice squads and waiver wire.

Shittsburgh does it all the time... Lucky basturdz!

[gumby73]

On 3/8/2023 at 5:03 AM, TexasAg1969 said:

 And the price would be too high in terms of what we would pay in picks.

I keep seeing reads, of a good  15-18 starters from Round 1..

Teams want to try to get up within the Top 75.. That would include us to get out & move up from the #98 pick.. I'd agree..

 

Free Agents.. I've again read many that say with the Clowney release & redo contracts the Browns may see 30M to work with.. (who knows?)

The FA market is a bunch of "could Happens" at this time...

Yeah ! Examples?

1) I loved to put Marcus Davenport in a wide 9 with Garrett.. but at 12M? 

2.) Media hard'on's of Browns interest in DT Javon Hargrave? but at 18-20M per?

Berry might have got wiser by, paying 2 players divided by what Clowney got at 8M at Edge ?

quit dreaming media..

Now back to reality.. It takes a real cut/release list to begin a FA list.. Stay tuned (we ain't got one yet)

Silly season got a early start 

[Korsou Dawg]

8 hours ago, gumby73 said:

2.) Media hard'on's of Browns interest in DT Javon Hargrave? but at 18-20M per?

You got that right! Reading this craziness from Schefter and, Mary Kay 'FWIW' Cabot as well.

As much as the IDL needs fixin, spending a vast part of our potential cap space on an aging veteran seems like a Hail Mary at best. Surely not!

[SdBacker80]

6 hours ago, Korsou Dawg said:

You got that right! Reading this craziness from Schefter and, Mary Kay 'FWIW' Cabot as well.

As much as the IDL needs fixin, spending a vast part of our potential cap space on an aging veteran seems like a Hail Mary at best. Surely not!

Agree.  We need a Mike and a Safety just as much IMHO. 

[Orion]

27 minutes ago, SdBacker80 said:

Agree.  We need a Mike and a Safety just as much IMHO. 

Right, so let's list the priorities.

DT - we all know we need at least one.

Mike  -  we've got Anthony Walker and Deon Jones that did decent jobs, until they got hurt.  Certainly those two guys did a better job at their position than our DT's did at theirs.

S - Yup.  Letting your starter go means you need one.

WR - Supposedly we had one of the slowest WR groups in the league.  And our fast guy can't catch too well, and he gets hurt all the time.

TE - Behind Njoku we have Bryant, who does not represent John Mackie very well, and then just guys.

DE - Are we all set there without Clowney?

OL - This group was not outstanding this past season.  How 'bout center?  Pocic is said to want to test the FA waters?  Nick Harris?  Is he reliable enough?

 - FA is an expensive thing.  We know that.  But we've got a lot of needs to try and address with 2nd and 3rd day draft picks.  And everyone is expecting playoffs in 2023...or else!  Right?  Their jobs are on the line...and they only have so many tools in their bag for fixing things...and FA is one of those tools.  

[ballpeen]

6 hours ago, Orion said:

 

DE - Are we all set there without Clowney?

 

Contrary to what some people think, Clowney is going to create a massive void.

 

No doubt the guy needs to be gone, but he was a top player.  He was a A+ run defender and a pretty solid pass rusher.  He may have been the best edge run defender in the league.  He was one of those guys other teams had to build in to the gameplan.    It's going to hurt no having him.

 

As for Poicic, he is gone.  I hate it but I don't see another large contract on the O line.  Harris will have to be the guy.  I do see us looking to FA draft to get another center on board.  Froholdt of a pretty good guard, but he isn't a center.

 

The positive is rookie centers can usually step in and play well, assuming they are decent players, and we are going to need that once Harris gets crushed by game 4. 

When you watch Harris play, the guy has to exert every ounce of energy in pass pro.  If a player has to give every ounce and strain on every play, something is going to give way sooner than not.  I am not talking about giving 100%.  I am talking max effort.

 

When those guys push 225lbs, the max effort happens somewhere in the 20's for most players.  Harris is at max effort damn near every pass play. You just can't last if you have to play like that.

[gumby73]

7 hours ago, Orion said:

Right, so let's list the priorities.

Mike  -  we've got Anthony Walker and Deon Jones that did decent jobs, until they got hurt.  Certainly those two guys did a better job at their position than our DT's did at theirs.

Multi reports.. claimed Iowa LB Jack Campbell was a ace interviewee with the football smarts to call the Mike year one 🤔.. Jack may get to us at #48

FA's .. I'm a fan of Germaine Pratt as our Mike LB.. He stays healthy/upright.. Need the dollar difference/separation if keeping A.Walker..

Schwartz knows Titans LB David Long.. I'd keep Denzel Perryman & Bobby Okereke has both affordable options..

Browns should know Anthony Walker's injury update/ better than any team  

[ballpeen]

I agree Gun.

 

Discounting a few positions, I am good taking the best player available.

My personal feeling is we can discount QB, RB,CB, TE.and interior O line.  Somebody really good would have to drop to us to make our 1st selection at one of those positions.

 

At least as things stand today, we don't really need players at those positions and we can say we need a player at the other positions.  We might disagree on what positions we need more, but taking the best guy available is the prudent move.

 

Now, deciding on who is the best player is an entirely different issue...lol...and our opinions don't amount to much.  The only player list that counts is the list the Browns formulate.  All I know is some of us will like the pick, some won't.  We are all working off different lists.

[Flugel]

8 hours ago, Orion said:

 

DE - Are we all set there without Clowney?

OL - This group was not outstanding this past season.  How 'bout center?  Pocic is said to want to test the FA waters?  Nick Harris?  Is he reliable enough?

 - FA is an expensive thing.  We know that.   

I'm not so sure we were set WITH Clowney last year.  Just thinking about how many times he lined up offsides as a veteran was very unimpressive.  Plus, he didn't always feel like playing when he could have have because this wasn't the type of FA/player that puts his team in-front of the himself.  

Anyway, our first round in 2022 was round 3 and Berry drafted DE Alex Wright with our 3rd choice in that round.  Not sure how that will turn out - but he got some experience last year as one of Berry's bigger investments in that draft.  Isaiah Thomas, looked even better to me but he didn't get as many reps. 

We could go FA or draft with this position.  I'd rather bring in someone that isn't already too content with his rear view mirror like Clowney is.   

[Korsou Dawg]

7 hours ago, Orion said:

Right, so let's list the priorities.

You are right about all the positions you mentioned. They are area's for improvement at least, and needs depending on free agency. Further ramblings below.

DT - #1 priority. As much as I would love to see if pairing Javon Hargrave with Myles would be similar to Hayward and Watt, I don't see us spending that kind of money. Remember the combined pressure of those two had our O-line blocking in a posture reminiscent of the Neil Degrasse meme. They didn't want any part of them.

I've mentioned before that I think Dalvin Tomlinson is probably the best value FA. Doesn't get to the passer anywhere near as much as Hargrave, but at less than half the price and a year younger, he is just better value. Would probably still draft another development DT in a later round.

Mike  -  Although I cannot find anything about Deion Jones' current market value, his last contract was 14M a year. I don't think we can afford him. If healthy, I would love to keep Walker. If so, this position becomes a lower priority. If not, this comes close to a tie for #1 priority.

S - Will have to dismiss the rumors of our interest in Jessie Bates as well, I'm afraid. Again, I do not see us spending that kind of money on a single position. 5 to 10M a year is what we can afford. Early round draft would also be an option.

WR - Looking at this year, this isn't much of a priority. We have a clear WR1 in Coop, a decent WR2 in DPJ, and a talented guy for the slot in Bell. We also have Jakeem Grant coming back from injury, and Demetric Felton who can also catch the ball. So definitely not a 'need,' but apparently this year's WR class is very deep. That means BPA could very well be a WR, and with DPJ in the final year of his contract, I would be open to spending our 2nd rounder. Otherwise, maybe just a later round 'speed guy.'

TE - Would say an upgrade over Bryant would be very nice to have. 12 personnel is still on the rise in the league, and is a great fit for us on paper as well. A better blocker who can also catch could make quite an impact. Could we possibly snatch Hayden Hurst from the bungles?

DE - Would be open to BPA in 2nd round. Otherwise, I see us going the veteran FA route. We have swung and missed with too many development guys already. 

OL - We need a back-up for Harris at C in the very least, and a back-up G as well. Hopefully we can affordably re-sign Froholdt for the latter.

QB - I think it is fair to mention Jacoby Brissett. Would have loved to keep him on board as back-up for his personality, and would really be a weapon as a sub for the QB sneak. But believe it or not, he is probably one of the most desirable FA QBs after Jimmy G. Will command too much money and might even end up as a starter somewhere else. Does that mean we will be going into the season with just Mond as back-up?