Baker Mayfield

[Westside Steve]

12 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

cal, and many of the other brilliant minds that circle jerk each other on the Poli Board are the people who inspired the old saying:

"Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and then beat you with experience." 

Hey Dutchman I was tempted to say something about sauce for geese versus sauce for gander's or pots and Kettles but I think the point is this:

 Baker Mayfield his my guy. To quote Alice Cooper "if that don't suit ya*, that's a drag."

WSS

 

* not you personally but anybody in general.

🤘😄

And just for the record probably the smartest thing to do would for him to get the surgery now to get a better start on next season. But my heart says I hope they hate the f****** s*** eating Squeelers bad enough to f****** Roethlisberger's last game at 3 sewers or the ketchup Bowl whatever it is.

WSS

[Dutch Oven]

4 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

Hey Dutchman I was tempted to say something about sauce for geese versus sauce for gander's or pots and Kettles but I think the point is this:

 Baker Mayfield his my guy. To quote Alice Cooper "if that don't suit ya*, that's a drag."

WSS

 

* not you personally but anybody in general.

🤘😄

Guess what, Baker Mayfield is most likely going to be your guy, my guy, EVERYONE'S guy next year. Get him his surgery, his rehab, and continue to improve the roster around him. 

After next season? We'll see. 

[Westside Steve]

Just now, Dutch Oven said:

Guess what, Baker Mayfield is most likely going to be your guy, my guy, EVERYONE'S guy next year. Get him his surgery, his rehab, and continue to improve the roster around him. 

After that? We'll see. 

PS I just edited that laughed response check back and see if you agree.

😄

[gumby73]

which games did baker lose?

Regular Season
WK	DATE	OPPONENT	RESULT	W-L	HI PASS	HI RUSH	HI REC
1	Sun, Sep 12	@Kansas City	L33-29	0-1	Mayfield 321	Chubb 83	Njoku 76     2 fumbles lead to kc points
2	Sun, Sep 19	vsHouston	W31-21	1-1	Mayfield 213	Chubb 95	Felton 51     Baker rips shoulder
3	Sun, Sep 26	vsChicago	W26-6	2-1	Mayfield 246	Chubb 84	Beckham Jr. 77
4	Sun, Oct 3	@Minnesota	W14-7	3-1	Mayfield 155	Chubb 100	Higgins 63
5	Sun, Oct 10	@Los Angeles	L47-42	3-2	Mayfield 305	Chubb 161	Njoku 149       refs sucked/ our PK was 6 of 6
6	Sun, Oct 17	vsArizona	L37-14	3-3	Mayfield 234	Hunt 66	Peoples-Jones 101  Baker hurt again/ Zona dominated
7	Thu, Oct 21	vsDenver	W17-14	4-3	Keenum 199	Johnson 146	Hooper 42
8	Sun, Oct 31	vsPittsburgh	L15-10	4-4	Mayfield 225	Chubb 61	Landry 65>>>>>huge fumble loss/Stef/ offense stale/ PK 2 of 2
9	Sun, Nov 7	@Cincinnati	W41-16	5-4	Mayfield 218	Chubb 137	Peoples-Jones 86
10	Sun, Nov 14	@New England	L45-7	5-5	Keenum 81	Johnson 99	Johnson 58  like zona.. dominated
11	Sun, Nov 21	vsDetroit	W13-10	6-5	Mayfield 176	Chubb 130	Hooper 53   ugly win
12	Sun, Nov 28	@Baltimore	L16-10	6-6	Mayfield 247	Hunt 20	Landry 111   Did nothing with 4 turnovers. we turn it over twice..Chubb/Hunt combine 36 rushing yrds./PK -3 points
13	BYE WEEK
14	Sun, Dec 12	vsBaltimore	W24-22	7-6	Mayfield 190	Chubb 59	Peoples-Jones 90
15	Mon, Dec 20	vsLas Vegas	L16-14	7-7	Mullens 147	Chubb 91	Peoples-Jones 48  No Baker/ 3 points missed PK/game needed to be won
16	Sat, Dec 25	@Green Bay	L24-22	7-8	Mayfield 222	Chubb 126	Higgins 58   Nagger 1 missed XP/ Baker 4 picks/ Stef? 8.8/rush on 25 attempts//we throw 36 times?

game points lost/by  ... -4.....-5....-5....-6....-2....-2.....(no Pats nor Cards)  8 L's

we had our share of Covid & injuries just as 31 others..  buttttt. MAN!!  We had our chances !

[Unsympathetic]

How Baker Hurt The Browns V Packers -- 34 minutes of agreement with tia.

JT O'Sullivan [QB School channel] is a pretty good analyst.

"This video is about to be a damn hour long because I can't get over throwing a pick to a post safety on a post route"

[tiamat63]

19 minutes ago, Unsympathetic said:

How Baker Hurt The Browns V Packers -- 34 minutes of agreement with tia.

JT O'Sullivan [QB School channel] is a pretty good analyst.

"This video is about to be a damn hour long because I can't get over throwing a pick to a post safety on a post route"

Appreciate the nod. 

 I have more work, both bad AND some good of Baker,  actually, sitting on my desktop needing to be typed out and organized.     But I'm battling covid symptoms still and sleeping a great deal.   I'll get around to it at some point along with the off-season topics I wanted to tackle. 

Sadly NFL.com doesnt keep the All-22 from previous seasons archived and available,  so I'm going to reach out to a couple guys on reddit.  I really need the screenshots to go back and connect things I'm trying to show.

I'll check out that video after the game.

[tiamat63]

Two things I've been saying before and throughout this season.

- Joe Woods isn't the issue 

- Baker is the largest issue. 

 

Sad some of you need such disgustingly blatant examples to realize this.  

Also, if you didn't like my play breakdowns....

 

 

 

[hoorta]

2 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

Two things I've been saying before and throughout this season.

- Joe Woods isn't the issue 

- Baker is the largest issue. 

 

Sad some of you need such disgustingly blatant examples to realize this.  

Also, if you didn't like my play breakdowns....

 

 

 

Baker's QB play today was horrendously bad. Sure, there were drops. But damn, the accuracy just wasn't there at least 50% of the time. Batted down balls- staring down his receivers, and sacks where he had plenty of time to just throw the ball (four seconds) into the seats...  That was a sub college level backup performance. I'm pissed off at Stefanski for not benching him when he went 1 for ten on completions. What more did you need to see Kev? Grow a set, and sit him against the Bengals.  

I dare anyone to post and break down every one of Baker's misses... It's not going to be pretty. Damn, when you can't even hit your running back on a designed inside screen from 10 yards away?  That blows.    

[SkippinTurtles]

On 12/29/2021 at 5:38 AM, SkippinTurtles said:

17 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

Guess what, Baker Mayfield is most likely going to be your guy, my guy, EVERYONE'S guy next year. Get him his surgery, his rehab, and continue to improve the roster around him. 

After next season? We'll see. 

Bring in Big Ben and Antonio Brown.  Shake it up.

 

[tiamat63]

Zombo, Cal, Nickers, Steve and a few more of you.  This thread brilliantly describes what I've hinted at before.  The whole "I'd rather lose with Baker than win with anyone else".

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/Gbush91/status/1478291982128664582?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1478291982128664582|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fs9e.github.io%2Fiframe%2Ftwitter.min.html1478291982128664582

 

[Westside Steve]

24 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Zombo, Cal, Nickers, Steve and a few more of you.  This thread brilliantly describes what I've hinted at before.  The whole "I'd rather lose with Baker than LOSE with anyone else".

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/Gbush91/status/1478291982128664582?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1478291982128664582|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fs9e.github.io%2Fiframe%2Ftwitter.min.html1478291982128664582

 

That's ridiculous so I fixed it for you.

Let me ask honestly is it your opinion we would have won with Case Keenum/Mullins/Lauletta at the helm?

WSS

[calfoxwc]

22 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Zombo, Cal, Nickers, Steve and a few more of you.  This thread brilliantly describes what I've hinted at before.  The whole "I'd rather lose with Baker than win with anyone else".

https://mobile.twitter.com/Gbush91/status/1478291982128664582?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1478291982128664582|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fs9e.github.io%2Fiframe%2Ftwitter.min.html1478291982128664582

 

Garrett Bush ? Whines about Baker? and last year doesn't matter? - Baker played great last year. Baker's injury is the matter.

Nothing matters to him but blaming the qb? Even Doug Dieken was commenting on how the Browns wr's  - NONE OF THEM WERE GETTING OPEN.Perhaps Garrett won't be happy that the Browns will? draft a star wr next year.

Your contention is stupid. Most of us want to WIN - and they WON LAST YEAR WITH BAKER.

You Baker haters think the grass is greener on the other side of the fence, when you can't see over the fence.

I'd rather listen to Dieken talking about how no wr's were getting open again and again, than Garrett Bush. lol

[tiamat63]

1 minute ago, Westside Steve said:

That's ridiculous so I fixed it for you.

Let me ask honestly is it your opinion we would have won with Case Keenum/Mullins/Lauletta at the helm?

WSS

As I've said before, especially when it comes to minimizing turnovers, Keenum would have been the wiser start for quite some time now. 

Do we win? It's possible we still lose, but some of the "how do you throw THAT int?!?" would likely have been cleaned up.  The pick to DPJ is my commentary in a nutshell.   Fewer turnovers gives your team a better shot at winning. Period.

That Twitter thread brilliantly captures some of the mentality on this board that I've hinted at.  

That doesn't absolve Stefanski for last night either. I'm not sure what is running through his head right now but it's unbecoming of a decent NFL HC.

Enjoy the off-season, I have work to do.  Feel free to check back in for any of my future segments. 

[tiamat63]

"YoU dOnT kNoW wHaT bAkErS fIrSt ReAd Is"

"WrS aReNt GeTtInG oPeN"

 

[Westside Steve]

17 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

As I've said before, especially when it comes to minimizing turnovers, Keenum would have been the wiser start for quite some time now. 

Do we win? It's possible we still lose, but some of the "how do you throw THAT int?!?" would likely have been cleaned up.  The pick to DPJ is my commentary in a nutshell.   Fewer turnovers gives your team a better shot at winning. Period.

That Twitter thread brilliantly captures some of the mentality on this board that I've hinted at.  

That doesn't absolve Stefanski for last night either. I'm not sure what is running through his head right now but it's unbecoming of a decent NFL HC.

Enjoy the off-season, I have work to do.  Feel free to check back in for any of my future segments. 

Oh well. Can't sign into Twitter so...

I guess I'll have to go to your backup Colin Cowherd.

😀

[BernieSuperBowl2]

I can't wait to see what the Baker apologists have to say this week. But, but his shoulder. But, but the play calling. But, but the refs. No. Just no. Good or bad shoulder, the play calling, good or bad WR's - Baker just blows. He's a bottom 10 QB. People cling on to last year because we got into the playoffs. That's old news. The current news is we have to pay Faker Fakefield $19 million next year, which means our supporting cast will be worse. Imagine how bad Baker will be next year without a top 5 o-line and the best RB corps in the NFL.

 

 

[calfoxwc]

15 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

YoU dOnT kNoW wHaT bAkErS fIrSt ReAd Is"

"WrS aReNt GeTtInG oPeN"

Oh, please. That is ONE PLAY???? lol. He's looking right at him, I guess he was shocked he just got open, and threw him the ball? Do I need to mention how rapistblonker didn't see his TE totally wide open in the end zone in a game?

https://www.si.com/nfl/browns/browns-maven-features/4-thoughts-on-browns-ravens

" Wide receivers cannot get open "

You know, Chris Collinsworth was a wide receiver right? Without Landry - wr's can't get open. End of most of the passing game.

*******************************************

https://www.brownsnation.com/cris-collinsworth-says-one-browns-position-needs-to-step-up/

Collinsworth pointed out that when Jarvis Landry is injured or covered, Mayfield has struggled.

The Browns need a second receiver to step up especially against the Ravens because Collinsworth believes the Ravens will be all over Landry.

*********************************************

 Tiam - the Browns will draft a WR high. for the same reason - that the Bengals drafted Ja'Marr Chase fifth overall when they already had Ty HIggins and Boyd. And it has meant everything to the Bengals offense. Same qb.

 

[jrb12711]

58 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

As I've said before, especially when it comes to minimizing turnovers, Keenum would have been the wiser start for quite some time now. 

Do we win? It's possible we still lose, but some of the "how do you throw THAT int?!?" would likely have been cleaned up.  The pick to DPJ is my commentary in a nutshell.   Fewer turnovers gives your team a better shot at winning. Period.

That Twitter thread brilliantly captures some of the mentality on this board that I've hinted at.  

That doesn't absolve Stefanski for last night either. I'm not sure what is running through his head right now but it's unbecoming of a decent NFL HC.

Enjoy the off-season, I have work to do.  Feel free to check back in for any of my future segments. 

Let me just ask you this simply, as I am indeed a simple man. First, it goes without saying I have serious concerns about Mayfield as the dude moving forward. Last week was beyond a turd, it was a shit sandwich. I didn't even watch the second half of last night candidly.

But, the simple fact of the matter is the Browns are at least an average team with Mayfield, and he has shown that when fully healthy can play the position at an above average level. QBR is just a measure of it, but Mayfield finished 10th in that stat last year.  Maybe the dude did get figured out, that's very possible. But, overall at least this team is playing competitive football outside the last month. The wheels have seem to fall off the bus for the rest of this season, but it's been a dang refreshing change of pace to A) be in the playoffs and B ) be actively a part of the playoff discussion with two weeks left. I mean this with sincerity that I don't think I can actively be a fan again of another decade of 2-4 win seasons. I'd much rather be "middle of the road" or the "Kirk Cousins special" and hope for a spark (a la the Titans formula) than the shit we saw for so long.

This all leads me to the conclusion that there were MANY mitigating factors to Mayfield's (and thusly, the team) success this season, starting with a bum shoulder. I think it's worth it strongly to re-tool this offseason and see if Mayfield can bring back that 2020 play with Stefanski God willing getting his head out of his ass. That could easily result in 2022 showing us that Mayfield just got figured out. But watching the first two-ish weeks of the season, it's like watching a different QB. Based on what you see, do you agree with that sentiment or do you feel like it's time to hit the reset button?

[LBC mike]

I just think it's funny the sky is falling mentality.   

[Kegeratorz]

I can not imagine KS is that stupid, I’d gather he’s smarter then us. I’d also think he’d know losing wouldn’t look good on his resume and wouldn’t self sabotage his career. 

I wonder if the HC/organization said here you go Baker. Go out win us a game with your arm. Put the team on your shoulders and earn that contract. Go out and be the leader you keep telling us you are.

I. Don’t. Know. 

[tiamat63]

54 minutes ago, jrb12711 said:

Let me just ask you this simply, as I am indeed a simple man. First, it goes without saying I have serious concerns about Mayfield as the dude moving forward. Last week was beyond a turd, it was a shit sandwich. I didn't even watch the second half of last night candidly.

But, the simple fact of the matter is the Browns are at least an average team with Mayfield, and he has shown that when fully healthy can play the position at an above average level. QBR is just a measure of it, but Mayfield finished 10th in that stat last year.  Maybe the dude did get figured out, that's very possible. But, overall at least this team is playing competitive football outside the last month. The wheels have seem to fall off the bus for the rest of this season, but it's been a dang refreshing change of pace to A) be in the playoffs and B ) be actively a part of the playoff discussion with two weeks left. I mean this with sincerity that I don't think I can actively be a fan again of another decade of 2-4 win seasons. I'd much rather be "middle of the road" or the "Kirk Cousins special" and hope for a spark (a la the Titans formula) than the shit we saw for so long.

This all leads me to the conclusion that there were MANY mitigating factors to Mayfield's (and thusly, the team) success this season, starting with a bum shoulder. I think it's worth it strongly to re-tool this offseason and see if Mayfield can bring back that 2020 play with Stefanski God willing getting his head out of his ass. That could easily result in 2022 showing us that Mayfield just got figured out. But watching the first two-ish weeks of the season, it's like watching a different QB. Based on what you see, do you agree with that sentiment or do you feel like it's time to hit the reset button?

The issue with that line of thinking is believing that the emergence of this Browns team has more to do with Baker than it does Chubb, the running game and Oline.  Too much credit has been given to Mayfield.  The man who has put Cleveland on his shoulders (legs) has been Chubb more often than not.   Toss in improved Oline play with favorable schedule (weaker defenses) and that has been the winning recipe since mid 2018.

Browns fans have long contended that we'd be, at worst, a competitive team with average QB play, defense and a good supporting cast (running game)   You caught a glimpse of that with Hoyer. Baker isn't so important to this team that his play can't be duplicated.   And for all the talk about "last year", his last year stats were pretty pedestrian in the grand scheme of things.  

I've mentioned this before, but Bakers stats from 2020 are similar down to a single percentile with Case Keenums'sfrom that 2017 season with the Vikings.  

 

There is enough talent and stability on this roster that bringing in a QB that is even somewhat above average but NOT turnover prone means that this team can still be competitive.    

[Westside Steve]

12 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

 

There is enough talent and stability on this roster that bringing in a QB that is even somewhat above average but NOT turnover prone means that this team can still be competitive.    

So it's the turnovers? Interceptions?

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/player-stat/passing-plays-intercepted

Don't know if this list is stated or not

WSS

[tiamat63]

2 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

So it's the turnovers? Interceptions?

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/player-stat/passing-plays-intercepted

Don't know if this list is stated or not

WSS

I'm failing to see the point you're trying to make here.

[Westside Steve]

1 minute ago, tiamat63 said:

I'm failing to see the point you're trying to make here.

Sorry to bother you.

WSS

[hoorta]

2 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

"YoU dOnT kNoW wHaT bAkErS fIrSt ReAd Is"

"WrS aReNt GeTtInG oPeN"

 

Yeah, how many guys ARE open on that play?  Guess we'll just have to let the apologists believe whatever they want to....  

BTW, and I duly noticed this too...  WKNR Goldhammer is a Steeler fan, and even he admitted...  "Is this a football game, or a six hour tribute to Big Ben??"

[jrb12711]

48 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

The issue with that line of thinking is believing that the emergence of this Browns team has more to do with Baker than it does Chubb, the running game and Oline.  Too much credit has been given to Mayfield.  The man who has put Cleveland on his shoulders (legs) has been Chubb more often than not.   Toss in improved Oline play with favorable schedule (weaker defenses) and that has been the winning recipe since mid 2018.

Browns fans have long contended that we'd be, at worst, a competitive team with average QB play, defense and a good supporting cast (running game)   You caught a glimpse of that with Hoyer. Baker isn't so important to this team that his play can't be duplicated.   And for all the talk about "last year", his last year stats were pretty pedestrian in the grand scheme of things.  

I've mentioned this before, but Bakers stats from 2020 are similar down to a single percentile with Case Keenums'sfrom that 2017 season with the Vikings.  

 

There is enough talent and stability on this roster that bringing in a QB that is even somewhat above average but NOT turnover prone means that this team can still be competitive.    

I for sure hear you. My worry? is that we have the "grass is greener on the other side of the fence" mentality of trying to get that "just be better than Mayfield" and the team regresses. When you look at the landscape of potential QB's, I'm just not sure anyone fits that mold save a trade. A wild card trade I'd love would be Derek Carr- I think he fits what you're saying to the letter. I just don't like the idea of drafting a new dude, at all.

[tiamat63]

26 minutes ago, jrb12711 said:

I for sure hear you. My worry? is that we have the "grass is greener on the other side of the fence" mentality of trying to get that "just be better than Mayfield" and the team regresses. When you look at the landscape of potential QB's, I'm just not sure anyone fits that mold save a trade. A wild card trade I'd love would be Derek Carr- I think he fits what you're saying to the letter. I just don't like the idea of drafting a new dude, at all.

I would find it difficult to believe that if you had a QB who didn't throw ill-advised INT's at the worst possible times, that the rest of the team magically would "regress".   If anything, that is what tends to cause the regression.

Derek Carr is an interesting, vet savvy name.      For all the talk of the QB's from the 2018 draft, Kurt Benkert remains my long-lost darkhorse.   I still believe he offers upside as a quality backup and average NFL starter.

[Canton Dawg]

1 hour ago, tiamat63 said:

I'm failing to see the point you're trying to make here.

I’ll be your huckleberry…WSS is pointing out the number of interceptions BM has thrown this season.

He’s thrown the same amount of INT’s as Mahomes and Lamar Jackson.

Baker has thrown less INT’s than 8 other QB’s, namely Lawrence, Stanford, Allen, Heinicke, Burrow, Carr, Tannehill, and Herbert.

I know it doesn’t fit your narrative, but thems some facts.

[jrb12711]

4 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

I would find it difficult to believe that if you had a QB who didn't throw ill-advised INT's at the worst possible times, that the rest of the team magically would "regress".   If anything, that is what tends to cause the regression.

Derek Carr is an interesting, vet savvy name.      For all the talk of the QB's from the 2018 draft, Kurt Benkert remains my long-lost darkhorse.   I still believe he offers upside as a quality backup and average NFL starter.

One interesting factor to Carr is the game-winning drives. I didn't realize this, but dude is relatively clutch. Has 29 already in his career: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/gwd_career.htm just behind a dude like Russell Wilson. I saw this stat after he beat the Browns, definitely interesting. I could see the intrigue for a straight swap and us adding a good incentive based pick (2nd that can turn into a one for 2023) for example. I'd be in for that 100% at this point.

[tiamat63]

5 minutes ago, Canton Dawg said:

I’ll be your huckleberry…WSS is pointing out the number of interceptions BM has thrown this season.

He’s thrown the same amount of INT’s as Mahomes and Lamar Jackson.

Baker has thrown less INT’s than 8 other QB’s, namely Lawrence, Stanford, Allen, Heinicke, Burrow, Carr, Tannehill, and Herbert.

I know it doesn’t fit your narrative, but thems some facts.

I don't do "narratives", I operate in fact.  So... let's talk fact.

 

- Lamar is having a terrible season and is having trouble sustaining drives in a past first offense.   You yourself have upvoted comments that call him a "RB playing QB"    So why would I want to draw the parallel of Baker and Lamar?  Both are struggling and playing incredibly mediocre.  I've said that before.

- Mahomes started off the year good and then went into an absolute flurry of turnovers that cost the chiefs games.   True to any good to great QB, the problems that ailed his played and held back his team he began to resolve and the Chiefs are once again considered a good team.    In no small part because Mahomes decided to pull his head out of his ass and stop throwing ill-advised passes which sometimes would be brilliant, but other times hurt his team.   Being smart about when to take the former at risk of the latter is crucial... find the balance.   He's also a Superbowl winning QB with a historic start to his career.

- Lawrence is a rookie on the worst team in the NFL.  Why would we want that comparison brought up?   

- Heinicke is an UDFA playing on a bioplar team.   Baker is the former #1 overall pick... again another comparison you really don't want to make.  

- Stafford has had a stretch of questionable games with multiple turnovers yet still found ways to put TD's on the board when needed, including a GW drive this weekend.   He's thrown for 38TD's to 15INT's.   Still better than a 2:1 ratio.

- Herbert has cost his team with his bipolar play at times, but his ceiling has been much higher than the cost of his floor.  4,631 yards 35TD's to 14INT's in a pass first offense by a 2nd year QB.   Again, greater than a 2:1 ratio

- Burrow started out the year incredibly questionable throwing the majority of his picks the first 8 games.  Since that point he's turned it up to 11 and been one of the best young QB's in the NFL despite having his first year cut short by injury.  4,611 yards, 34 TD's to 14INT's.    Still greater than 2:1 ratio.

Carr & Tennehill are above average QB's who aren't good enough to consistently shoulder the load on offense to produce elite teams, I've said that for some time now.    Tannehill also functions behind one of the most medicore Olines in the NFL minus Julio, Brown and Derrick Henry.    I think the good people of Tennessee know that Tanne isn't some long-term franchise savior.    Derek Carr isn't all that far behind.    This isn't the flattering company I need my potential franchise to be in, and if it is I need to be honest about his abilities and pay him according to said abilities.   Which means Tannehill is currently being paid about 8million more than what he's worth.  

The comparison Steve attempted to absolve Baker with was against QB's who have been in the NFL less than half the time of Baker, who have shown flashes of greater ceiling, damn near pro-bowl nod, dismissing that while they've dealt with turnovers, they've had stretches of brilliant play on pass first teams.    Mayfield cannot say the same at any point in his career.

 

It was a limp wristed attempt to say that somehow Baker is comparable those names.  He isn't, save for Lamar, Carr, Tannehill and Heineke.  And those aren't names I want my QB to emulate aside from maybe Carr when he plays out of his mind.   

Bakers turnover problem, and penchant for batted passes (he leads the league in both categories since 2018) is not made up for by the rest of his play.    

 

I don't deal in narratives, I deal in fact.  Baker's play has been deficient since the 2019 season and I've had to watch him make consistently questionable decisions no franchise level QB does for the length of time he has.