🟫⬜️🟧🟧⬜️🟫Official Gameday Thread Jets at Browns 🟫⬜️🟧🟧⬜️🟫

[Flugel]

20 minutes ago, Orion said:

So they got an onside kick against us?       

That's how the Jets got the chance for the final gimme the defense gave them.  EDIT: They scored 14 points in 2 minutes.

Edited September 19, 2022 by Flugel

[Dutch Oven]

12 minutes ago, Orion said:

So they got an onside kick against us?       

I'll give you the gruesome details of the end of the game Cliff's Notes style:

1. Nick Chubb scores his third touchdown of the game with less than two minutes to go. Browns 30, Jets 17.

2. Cade York misses extra point. Browns 30, Jets 17.

3. Flacco hits wide open WR for 60-some yard touchdown, apparently just like the Browns gave up to the Panthers last week. Complete coverage breakdown. Jets kick extra pojnt. Browns 30, Jets 24.

4. Jets kicker fakes onside kick to his right, kicks to his left, Cooper closest to it but doesn't get down to scoop up kick, Jets recover.

5. With about :15 seconds left, Flacco throws his fourth touchdown, Jets kick etra point. Jets 31, Browns 30.

6. From the Browns 40, on second down, Brissett throws interception to seal the deal for Jets. Game over. 

[Dutch Oven]

4 minutes ago, Flugel said:

This defense made Joe Flacco look like Joe Montana; and that's been a pretty difficult thing for defenses to accomplish in the last 3-4 years or so.  

FWIW, here's our backup QB Jacoby Brissett's numbers today: 22 of 27 for 229 yards 1 TD and 1 INT.   

Of the 5 incompletes, 2 of them were caught with WR's well covered but they couldn't get both feet down in-bounds. 1 of them was originally ruled a TD - then overturned by replay; because DPJ bobbled the ball and didn't secure it until one foot was out of bounds.  Another incomplete was Njoku's drop you acknowledged above. One was a throw away. The last one was an INT after the Browns inexcusably gagged on a 13 point lead to the suddenly unbeatable Jets offense today.  I'd say he did enough to help this team win, which is more than I can say for a lot of the defensive players that didn't do their job today.  The offense got them leads they couldn't protect.  Same with last week if not for a 58 yard FG from a rookie at the end of the game.

I absolutely loved the passing game today. Brissett was so efficient and accurate. 

I have a feeling, though, that this defensive collapse is something we are still talking about 10 years from now. I remember being pissed off about that 2001 Bears game almost up to the kickoff of the next game. I'm too old for that shit now, that or I have no real optimism for this season now that Watson is suspended for 2/3 of it. 

[Kvoethe]

3 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

I'll give you the gruesome details of the end of the game Cliff's Notes style:

1. Nick Chubb scores his third touchdown of the game with less than two minutes to go. Browns 30, Jets 17.

2. Cade York misses extra point. Browns 30, Jets 17.

3. Flacco hits wide open WR for 60-some yard touchdown, apparently just like the Browns gave up to the Panthers last week. Complete coverage breakdown. Jets kick extra pojnt. Browns 30, Jets 24.

4. Jets kicker fakes onside kick to his right, kicks to his left, Cooper closest to it but doesn't get down to scoop up kick, Jets recover.

5. With about :15 seconds left, Flacco throws his fourth touchdown, Jets kick etra point. Jets 31, Browns 30.

6. From the Browns 40, on second down, Brissett throws interception to seal the deal for Jets. Game over. 

We should be numb to this by now.

[Browns149]

1 hour ago, Neo said:

I'm sorry but that logo on the field has to go. And can we go back to the all dark brown uni's with the orange lettering? Good things seem to happen when we wear those.

The logo on the field represents EVERYTHING about this franchise. 

IT’S A FREAKIN CLOWN SHOW

[Dutch Oven]

5 minutes ago, Kvoethe said:

We should be numb to this by now.

If you think about it, the amount of absolutely crazy things that had to happen for the Jets to win in regulation is kind of staggering, yet, I was not surprised in the least that it happened. 

[Unsympathetic]

You hate to see it.

OBR calls for the head of Joe Woods

[Neo]

25 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

If you think about it, the amount of absolutely crazy things that had to happen for the Jets to win in regulation is kind of staggering, yet, I was not surprised in the least that it happened. 

Not surprised, but  disappointed. That through the years they still haven't learned how to finish a game. What has to happen for them to realize you have to play until the final whistle?

[gumby73]

Jeff Howard is the #Browns DBs coach/pass game coordinator. In the last 2 weeks,The #Browns defense has given up 55 points through two games. Highest in the AFC

34 of these were surrendered in the 4th quarter. SIXTY-TWO percent. 

The fact that Howard's players can’t communicate properly is on him.

mini bye after Thursday/  Howard 👉👈 Woods 

[blitzz2]

Still seeing red, iv'e seen better coverage playing sandlot and flag football. To hell with "scheme" go man coverage with help over the top. Why not KISStupid. No, i'm JW and scheming is my forte...

[SdBacker80]

36 minutes ago, Unsympathetic said:

You hate to see it.

OBR calls for the head of Joe Woods

I don’t know why we would ditch the three safety look when we’ve been critical of all three in some or most parts of the past two seasons.  Can we go with just one that can the job halfway decent!!!
 

We aren’t even being attacked properly yet (ground and pound style) but then again we are because we can’t cover either. Under 2 to go and after giving Nick Chubb a high Five for a 3 TD afternoon the leader of the secondary should gather the troops and mention to the unit that the Jets have no timeouts left and no one gets behind us and wrap and tackle in bounds.
 

Do we have guys a little slower on the football intelligence side? or is this scheme too complicated? Or is the scheme Just ill fit for this personnel?

I know one thing…what happened last week it should have been beaten into these guys it can’t happen again, but here we are…that kind of falls on coaching IMO.

 

 

[hoorta]

4 hours ago, mjp28 said:

Well guys it could be  0-2  right now......or 2-0.   Talk about laying an egg.

Some great offensive numbers.  The radio guys are ripping them up, and rightfully s O. 

Oh Pittsburgh lost....too.

And "All my Bengals"  lost to the Scowboys. Browns blew a golden opportunity.  With an unbelievable El Foldo....  

My POV... I had to leave early, my nephew had to get home for work...  Yeah 2:00 left, Jets out of time outs, let's head for the car... 99.999% probability we have this one in the bag.... Until we didn't.    Could not believe there was any conceivable way to blow this game, but we did.

3 hours ago, Ghoolie Always Ghoolie said:

Yes, WTF is wrong with Chubb putting us up 2 TDs with under 2 minutes to go? WTF is wrong with that guy? Whoever heard of going up 2 scores late in the game? That is idiotic.

Of course.....If we fumbled 1st and goal at the 2 and lost, you would be bitching that Chubb should have put the game on ice.

This is on ShitMyPantski and nobody else.

You're blaming the wrong shit Tom...  Defensive coordinator Joe Woods needs to be sent packing...  After the Carolina game.... We need to work on "communication" after Baker tossed that 75 yard bomb with no one in the same area code. Golly gee, we had the same problem. Shit and hell's bells, have your defensive backs playing far enough back that nothing gets past them. 

[Dutch Oven]

4 minutes ago, SdBacker80 said:

I don’t know why we would ditch the three safety look when we’ve been critical of all three in some or most parts of the past two seasons.  Can we go with just one that can the job halfway decent!!!
 

We aren’t even being attacked properly yet (ground and pound style) but then again we are because we can’t cover either. Under 2 to go and after giving Nick Chubb a high Five for a 3 TD afternoon the leader of the secondary should gather the troops and mention to the unit that the Jets have no timeouts left and no one gets behind us and wrap and tackle in bounds.
 

Do we have guys a little slower on the football intelligence side? or is this scheme too complicated? Or is the scheme Just ill fit for this personnel?

I know one thing…what happened last week it should have been beaten into these guys it can’t happen again, but here we are…that kind of falls on coaching IMO.

 

 

I'd pay good money to be able to sit in on film study tomorrow with the defense.

I would loooooooove to hear what is said from the coaches to the players. 

[Browns149]

56 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

If you think about it, the amount of absolutely crazy things that had to happen for the Jets to win in regulation is kind of staggering, yet, I was not surprised in the least that it happened. 

The worst part of it is,

IT’S GOING TO HAPPEN AGAIN 

This franchise DOESN’T do ANYTHING that is remotely smart

[hoorta]

4 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

I'd pay good money to be able to sit in on film study tomorrow with the defense.

I would loooooooove to hear what is said from the coaches to the players. 

Other than the DBs sucked, our "supposed" stellar defensive line wasn't able to get consistent pressure on Flacco.  

[Dutch Oven]

Just now, Browns149 said:

The worst part of it is,

IT’S GOING TO HAPPEN AGAIN 

This franchise DOESN’T do ANYTHING that is remotely smart

That's categorically untrue.

Trading a 5th rounder for Cooper is smart in any way intelligence could be measured, for example. 

Your anger is making you make silly goose comments right meow. 

That's right Browns149 - silly goose comments. 

[Dutch Oven]

2 minutes ago, hoorta said:

Other than the DBs sucked, our "supposed" stellar defensive line wasn't able to get consistent pressure on Flacco.  

I sincerely hope no one thought this DLine was stellar. 

Clowney leaving the game early definitely hurt. 

[syd]

fuck

[Orion]

We went ahead by 13 with 2 minutes to go and the Jets had no time outs?   And we lost?   Jesus Joseph and Mary, that's bad.  And our defense was supposed to hold us together until are starting QB was to be available.  And instead, the backup QB held it together and the D whiffed.   sonuvabitch!

[The Cysko Kid]

[Canton Dawg]

So the Browns “D” gives up 17 points in the 4th quarter against the Panthers & Jets.

Time to show Mr Woods the door.

On a side note, all of the AFC North teams lost today.

[hoorta]

27 minutes ago, Orion said:

We went ahead by 13 with 2 minutes to go and the Jets had no time outs?   And we lost?   Jesus Joseph and Mary, that's bad.  And our defense was supposed to hold us together until are starting QB was to be available.  And instead, the backup QB held it together and the D whiffed.   sonuvabitch!

If you haven't seen the blown coverage yet that gave the Jets a 66 yard gift touchdown, it's going to make you ill... WRs aren't supposed to get that wide open in the NFL  EVER. 

It took incredible bad luck...  Can't even recover an onside kick... 

[Westside Steve]

I would never bet against the Browns but at the 2 minute mark the couple of guys I watch with regularly responding the same old Browns thing. I didn't think they could choke that badly so I bet five bucks with each on the browns. Oh well. Shit happens. The football gods were generous to them last week they must have pissed them off.

PS I was worried about the same old Clowney getting hurt when he decided to sign.

WSS

[LeftEdge]

Joe Woods is the dumbest mother fucker in the league. He couldn't solve an escape room if it was made out of a paper bag. He's scared of blankets because they actually cover something. His wife still ties his shoes. Sincerely fuck that guy. We've drafted how many defensive backs over the past few years and this is what we have to show for it? Have we ever cut or replaced a single Andrew Berry pick?  We live with these assholes who have such limited, one dimensional talent and wonder why we get exposed. I'm just a year shy of 40 and I can honestly say this is the most embarrassing loss I've had the misfortune of witnessing. 

[LeftEdge]

1 minute ago, Ghoolie Always Ghoolie said:

Stefanski is the problem. Coordinators are coffee fetchers, nothing more.

Oh yeah Kevin in his infinite wisdom let hardly any starter play a single preseason snap since they are such savvy veterans. God forbid we see this shit and possibly correct it before the games count. Nope let's get torched for a few weeks and then we can maybe possibly make some changes so we can limit the times we are a national embarrassment to a handful.

[Westside Steve]

5 hours ago, LeftEdge said:

Oh yeah Kevin in his infinite wisdom let hardly any starter play a single preseason snap since they are such savvy veterans. God forbid we see this shit and possibly correct it before the games count. Nope let's get torched for a few weeks and then we can maybe possibly make some changes so we can limit the times we are a national embarrassment to a handful.

Which is a League wide problem I have to guess. The nflpa unfortunately aims for more money and less work for the stars. I get it and I really understand it. It's just that I don't think that it's good for the final show. I know the starters don't like the extra work but you wind up missing cues and getting hurt because you're not in as good of shape as you should be?

As far as stefanski? Hard to tell in this organization. Seems like they more than most have a chain of command leadership by committee. If his game plan is in any way dictated by Jimmy  Andrew Berry  DeePodesta or Dee as I have suspected over the years then he's too weak for the job.

WSS

[Flugel]

9 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

I absolutely loved the passing game today. Brissett was so efficient and accurate. 

I have a feeling, though, that this defensive collapse is something we are still talking about 10 years from now. I remember being pissed off about that 2001 Bears game almost up to the kickoff of the next game. I'm too old for that shit now, that or I have no real optimism for this season now that Watson is suspended for 2/3 of it. 

Well said!

Did our special teams even practice this week?  Situational football everywhere BUT Cleveland shows us the Jets tried a pass on 3rd and 1 knowing they're right near midfield, also knowing they're going to take 2 shots at getting 1 yard against a far less prepared opponent regardless of what formation they lined up in on 4th down.  If anyone remembers the last time the Jets beat us in the last few years - that kid Berrios returned either a punt or a kickoff for a TD.  Why did our STs Coordinator have our kicker putting air under the kickoffs so that kid could have a shot at repeating history when our kicker can easily kick them out of the end zone? Our punter kicked ass IMO but outkicking coverages with a dangerous return man like that can lead to trouble.  Fortunately, we had a real long one go out of bounds for no return later in the game so that was 1 thing to be happy about. 

Having said that, the Browns missed an extra point.  Also, they weren't any more prepared for the onside kick than they were for the fake punt earlier in the game. That old saying, "it's not about the size of the dog in the fight - it's about the size of the fight in the dog" you just witnessed it. That starts with your week of preparation or lack there of.  It also shows up in who outhustles who for any loose footballs on the ground.  It also starts with the self responsibility EACH PROFESSIONAL has to learn from his previous mistakes.   

Do you know what leads to a lot of arm tackles and bad open field tackling?  Guys aren't reading their pre-snap cues so when passes are completed while they are out of position to defend them, they now have to hustle to the ball which often shows them unable to square up to make the tackle in lieu of desperately reaching out to grab someone they aren't in position to tackle.  That's what often happens when you see a defender running past the guy he is supposed to tackle.  You play football with your eyes or you fail folks.  Our defense isn't playing football with their eyes.  I hate to say it this early, but there should be a short leash on Grant Delpit this week. A lot of people spent all last week only worrying about Brissett.  He PREPARED for the Jets a lot better than some of the starters on that freakin defense and maybe even some of our coaches on defense and special teams.  But hey, if some of you only want to worry about Brissett - feel free to waste your energy again this week!

If someone beats the Browns because they are better - I can live with that somewhat.  If someone beats the Browns because they out-prepared them and remained the hungrier dog in the fight overall - I'm very disappointed.  

[mjp28]

33 minutes ago, Flugel said:

Well said!

Did our special teams even practice this week? ......

....If someone beats the Browns because they are better - I can live with that somewhat.  If someone beats the Browns because they out-prepared them and remained the hungrier dog in the fight overall - I'm very disappointed.  

I sure hope special teams practice was NOT just like this......  "listen up guys".....

● Now onside kicks only work ??%  of the time.  No problem there.

● We have a great kicker, he made a 58 yard kick last week.

●  Nobody misses extra point attempts,  well almost never..

● Nobody blows a 14 point lead with our defense, well a 13 point lead.  

Well the barn door was left open that horse got away, not coming back. 

GO BROWNS,   just shake it off, win on Thursday Night Football  !

 

 

[Flugel]

7 hours ago, Ghoolie Always Ghoolie said:

Stefanski is the problem. Coordinators are coffee fetchers, nothing more.

Whether you are right or wrong Ghoolie, I'll get right to the question I always ask people thinking all we need is to fire the current Head Coach to hire the next Head Coach - Who hired him?  Who will be in charge of hiring the alleged upgrade?  If this was all we needed to do - wouldn't it have worked by now?  

Not for nothing, WHY didn't this organization RESEARCH DeShaun Watson "more than they ever researched any other QB prospect" back when the Browns had the 1st overall pick in the draft in 2017?  Wouldn't that have been a GREAT time to do that when he wouldn't have had to give up 3 first round draft picks and wait 11 games for a suspension to complete before putting the guy/starter on the field?  And how about this one?  Doing so, also would have meant the Browns would have only had to give him a contract that fit under the rookie salary cap vrs guaranteeing him $230 million of cap space.  When I hard that nonsense coming out of Haslam's mouth I though - have you even noticed all of the AFC North Teams have gone to Super Bowls with QBs they drafted?  This franchise has had the draft position to draft Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes, DeShaun Watson (before he was massaged), and countless others; but they've never put in the time or patience required to fully research/go after the RIGHT QB with upside vrs best football played in the rear view mirror/college.  That's why we're waiting 9 more weeks on a suspension until the Browns can play their starting QB.  

 

 

[tiamat63]

Few things I'm kicking around this morning. 

 

- Does Delpit return to his big nickel role and Harrison overtake the spot Delpit has?  Removes having a better athlete and also some of the size Harrison brings as a de facto nickel/dime backer in certain sets.  But also means you remove having a potential issue of busts vs simple looks.

- IDL is going to be a glaring weakness Thursday. Short week, questionable QB and oline play from the Steelers.   For anyone following along with my work, on paper the secondary and pass rush are quality. But the IDL is average at best.   And just like 2020 and 2021, the grind of a season will only reduce their already limited effectiveness.   This puts a ton of strain on your secondary to be perfect every play.  Is anything in the works to address this via late trade? I hope Berry see's what is coming, because there's a great deal of recent history to foreshadow it.

 

- Jets have a good young team in the making.  Early returns say they hit a home run this draft with Wilson and Sauce.  Just need to find a QB and get healthy on the Oline.  But their skill positions are solid and their Dline is pretty good.

- I know the late coverage bust is on everyone's mind, but I keep coming back to that flat TD to, I believe Reece? in the late 2nd qtr?  I want to go back and see who the boundary safety was.  If it was Delpit, I'd bet he gave the wrong check to Ward because when facing a 1 fast, 1back set with a reduced split from the WR against quarters is an automatic check to something like a c2. It's just too easy to get a back outside and flat for cheap yards off a little rub vs a curl/flat backer. Especially so close to the redzone.  And I keep wondering why Ward chased the #1 inside and voided flat.   

 

Edit:  And the calls to fire Woods. Be reasonable, there's nothing to support that firing a Dcoord makes the group magically better overnight.  The candidates to replace Woods in house aren't ideal, and you can forget bringing in a completely different coach to install a new system week 3.    There was noticable change and improvement in 2020, same same with 2021 where the defense put this team in place to win more games than it lost.   Does Woods need to be under the microscope? Yes.  Fired today? No.   Because there is no superior alternative in-season when you want to talk about it logically. 

 

All 22 should be out around 5pm EST.  Gives me time to get done with work, hit the gym and try to find some answers.   As usual, if anybody is on TBB discord, you're welcomed to join me as we hunt for answers.