Draft Talk

[Tour2ma]

Trubisky/Garrett/McCaffery

 

Pretty decent analysis...

 

Pretty terrible plan...

[hoorta]

From what I gather, Ohio State only must lose 4 seniors: OC Pat Elflein, backup WRs Dontrel Wilson and Corey Smith...and their punter.

Others that could go include Barrett, Samuel, Hooker, Billy Price, Garreon Conley, Tyquan Lewis, Raekwon McMillan.

 

Right now Walter Football has Pat Elflein mocked mid second round. I say take him @ 33, depending on what we do in the first round. Almost anything is better than Erving.

 

BTW, Barrett is going to have to switch positions like Pryor did. He's no NFL level qb.

[calfoxwc]

 

Right now Walter Football has Pat Elflein mocked mid second round. I say take him @ 33, depending on what we do in the first round. Almost anything is better than Erving.

 

BTW, Barrett is going to have to switch positions like Pryor did. He's no NFL level qb.

I agree - the four players I listed, I think I had him at 33, definately second round.

If Quentin Nelson, OG, ...ND? leaves school - watch out. But I believe he and the OT are staying...so far.

I'd draft Nelson with the second first rounder if he goes NFL in a NY second.

[Clevfan4life]

Trubisky/Garrett/McCaffery

 

Call it, it's a wrap.

 

I don't think the Eagles pick is going to be high enough to take Garrett with it. If we take Trubisky at 1, Garrett isn't lasting till picks 10-15 where they're projecting that eagles pick to be. We'd have to trade up.

[calfoxwc]

interesting - some nfl folks reportedly don't think Garrett is the best in the draft.

 

So far, Neslon, ND OG and Hooker, Ohio State, are rumored to be staying in school....

 

that leans me towards a top cb, or a top safety, which is Adams, LSU.

 

way too early. dammit.

[Canton Mike]

 

Right now Walter Football has Pat Elflein mocked mid second round. I say take him @ 33, depending on what we do in the first round. Almost anything is better than Erving.

 

BTW, Barrett is going to have to switch positions like Pryor did. He's no NFL level qb.

 

 

 

I don't believe he's NFL caliber, period.

Mike

[tiamat63]

If QB isn't first pick you can bet your ass it's DE or Oline.

 

Either way Oline is going to be one of your top 2 picks, so identify whom they are now.

[wargograw]

interesting - some nfl folks reportedly don't think Garrett is the best in the draft.

 

So far, Neslon, ND OG and Hooker, Ohio State, are rumored to be staying in school....

 

that leans me towards a top cb, or a top safety, which is Adams, LSU.

 

way too early. dammit.

 

Adams is a thug. You sure you want him? Would ruin your whole narrative.

 

Garrett is the most talented. Is he the best player? Not really.

[wargograw]

 

I don't think the Eagles pick is going to be high enough to take Garrett with it. If we take Trubisky at 1, Garrett isn't lasting till picks 10-15 where they're projecting that eagles pick to be. We'd have to trade up.

 

Read his post again. He talks about trading so we have the first two picks.

[LogicIsForSquares]

 

Adams is a thug. You sure you want him? Would ruin your whole narrative.

I think if Vontaze Burfict was a Brown that everyone would be overlooking his propensity for being a scumbag.

[gftChris]

I think if Vontaze Burfict was a Brown that everyone would be overlooking his propensity for being a scumbag.

Yup.

[jiggins7919]

I think we all know that the draft will look drastically different come April, but it sure is fun to talk about. Hell, we need SOMETHING fun to talk about, right?

 

I've heard a few analysts say that Ogbah's numbers would vastly improve if he had a dominant force opposite of him. They cited numerous times in recent games where the QB would simply fade to his right to avoid Ogbah's pressure, and then fire the ball away. I started thinking about it, and it made sense. If there is opposing pressure, the QB has nowhere to go. Shelton has really turned into a player that other teams have to respect, and I've seen him collapse the pocket by bull-rushing his man towards the QB. I think the HOPE was that Nassib would be the opposing force, but I don't know if he's really been progressing. Certainly his hand injury didn't help matters, but drafting a blue chip pass rusher is almost NEVER a bad idea.

 

The problem, when you're as bad as we are, is that we have giant holes ALL over the place, and obviously we can't fill each one during one draft and offseason. I thought our defense had their best game Sunday, but it was still pretty obvious we needed more pressure. More pressure for sacks, fumbles, and forced passes that can lead to interceptions (you remember those, right?). There is no pick out there that is a "sure thing", I think we all know that. But Garrett and Allen are pretty close. Clowney was a physical freak who had incredible gifts, but even his immense physical abilities were drastically cut by injuries and subsequent microfracture surgery. Another guy who went #1 at a similar position was Mario Williams. I remember him being an immediate threat, and his size/speed was apparent as soon as he played. Myles Garrett isn't quite as thick as Williams, but he's definitely a bit faster.

 

At this time, the only QB who has rising stock (in my feeble mind) is Mitch Trubisky. This could and probably WILL change in the coming months, but as of right now, Mitch is looking more and more like the first QB off the board. If Chip Kelly is still at San Fran, I don't think Kizer fits his preferences. Mitch isn't a PERFECT fit, but I think he fits better nevertheless. We can't get Garrett or Allen AND Mitch...not without a trade that would severely damage our ability to grow. The more realistic scenario to me is trading a high pick to Patriots for Garoppolo. Yes, we still lose a pick, which hurts, but essentially we'd be "drafting" Garoppolo with that high pick, whereas if we traded to move ALL the way up for Mitch, we'd be giving away far more than just one high pick.

 

Watch for the Garoppolo rumor to start picking up steam soon. ESPECIALLY if Patriots have their division and homefield locked up early and Garoppolo gets to start a couple games and performs well. We've done business with the Patriots a few times already, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if the trade has already been discussed at length. Hue has already intimated that he has his eye on a particular QB...but we're left to wonder exactly who he is.

[LogicIsForSquares]

The Patriots are not trading Garoppolo if he is a capable starter. Their starting QB is 2 years older than an ancient Josh McCown.

[gftChris]

The Patriots are not trading Garoppolo if he is a capable starter. Their starting QB is 2 years older than an ancient Josh McCown.

And we've seen the broncos struggle to move on from Manning. The pats aren't going to get the number one pick and get Andrew Luck. When the pats have another couple games won they'll have AFC no1 seed sewn up they'll play the kid more.

[jiggins7919]

The Patriots are rumored to be enamored with their rookie, Jacoby Brissett. That's the reason they'd part with Garoppolo. Obviously, this is ALL speculation, and Brissett didn't exactly light it up, but he also didn't have a ton of practice time.

[The Gipper]

 

Right now Walter Football has Pat Elflein mocked mid second round. I say take him @ 33, depending on what we do in the first round. Almost anything is better than Erving.

 

BTW, Barrett is going to have to switch positions like Pryor did. He's no NFL level qb.

OK, on both statements.

[The Gipper]

 

I don't think the Eagles pick is going to be high enough to take Garrett with it. If we take Trubisky at 1, Garrett isn't lasting till picks 10-15 where they're projecting that eagles pick to be. We'd have to trade up.

Well, yes, the discussion was all about what would have to go to trade up to get the #1 and #2 picks........And lets just say: the entire rest of our draft practically.

[One Post]

Let's draft 12 qb's. One of them should pan out.

[The Gipper]

I think we all know that the draft will look drastically different come April, but it sure is fun to talk about. Hell, we need SOMETHING fun to talk about, right?

 

I've heard a few analysts say that Ogbah's numbers would vastly improve if he had a dominant force opposite of him. They cited numerous times in recent games where the QB would simply fade to his right to avoid Ogbah's pressure, and then fire the ball away. I started thinking about it, and it made sense. If there is opposing pressure, the QB has nowhere to go. Shelton has really turned into a player that other teams have to respect, and I've seen him collapse the pocket by bull-rushing his man towards the QB. I think the HOPE was that Nassib would be the opposing force, but I don't know if he's really been progressing. Certainly his hand injury didn't help matters, but drafting a blue chip pass rusher is almost NEVER a bad idea.

 

The problem, when you're as bad as we are, is that we have giant holes ALL over the place, and obviously we can't fill each one during one draft and offseason. I thought our defense had their best game Sunday, but it was still pretty obvious we needed more pressure. More pressure for sacks, fumbles, and forced passes that can lead to interceptions (you remember those, right?). There is no pick out there that is a "sure thing", I think we all know that. But Garrett and Allen are pretty close. Clowney was a physical freak who had incredible gifts, but even his immense physical abilities were drastically cut by injuries and subsequent microfracture surgery. Another guy who went #1 at a similar position was Mario Williams. I remember him being an immediate threat, and his size/speed was apparent as soon as he played. Myles Garrett isn't quite as thick as Williams, but he's definitely a bit faster.

 

At this time, the only QB who has rising stock (in my feeble mind) is Mitch Trubisky. This could and probably WILL change in the coming months, but as of right now, Mitch is looking more and more like the first QB off the board. If Chip Kelly is still at San Fran, I don't think Kizer fits his preferences. Mitch isn't a PERFECT fit, but I think he fits better nevertheless. We can't get Garrett or Allen AND Mitch...not without a trade that would severely damage our ability to grow. The more realistic scenario to me is trading a high pick to Patriots for Garoppolo. Yes, we still lose a pick, which hurts, but essentially we'd be "drafting" Garoppolo with that high pick, whereas if we traded to move ALL the way up for Mitch, we'd be giving away far more than just one high pick.

 

Watch for the Garoppolo rumor to start picking up steam soon. ESPECIALLY if Patriots have their division and homefield locked up early and Garoppolo gets to start a couple games and performs well. We've done business with the Patriots a few times already, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if the trade has already been discussed at length. Hue has already intimated that he has his eye on a particular QB...but we're left to wonder exactly who he is.

Garropolo may be Ryan Mallet part two.

[hoorta]

Watch for the Garoppolo rumor to start picking up steam soon. ESPECIALLY if Patriots have their division and homefield locked up early and Garoppolo gets to start a couple games and performs well. We've done business with the Patriots a few times already, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if the trade has already been discussed at length. Hue has already intimated that he has his eye on a particular QB...but we're left to wonder exactly who he is.

 

The Garroppolo rumor has already started in some quarters.

 

Garropolo may be Ryan Mallet part two.

 

Or Matt Cassell. If Bill thinks Jacoby Brissett is better than Jimmy- danger! warning! Why on earth would Bill part with his potential QBOTF, when Brady is going to turn 40 next August? This was hashed out at great length on the other board.

[LondonBrown]

If Garropolo was anything Brissett probably wouldn't be drafted. Patriots also passed on Brady remember they're not the QB evaluation yardstick.

[Tour2ma]

If QB isn't first pick you can bet your ass it's DE or Oline.

 

Either way Oline is going to be one of your top 2 picks, so identify whom they are now.

 

1. Why the hurry.

2. Ain't buying it...

 

Of all the positions to mine on Day 2, none are richer than OL... especially interior OL.

 

I think if Vontaze Burfict was a Brown that everyone would be overlooking his propensity for being a scumbag.

 

No... but some assholes would have applauded his cheap shots on Steelers.

 

Another guy who went #1 at a similar position was Mario Williams. I remember him being an immediate threat, and his size/speed was apparent as soon as he played. Myles Garrett isn't quite as thick as Williams, but he's definitely a bit faster.

 

Actually Mario started slow his rookie year... Did not record a sack until game 4 or so and then only totaled 5-ish in 16 starts as a rookie. It had the Texans very nervous as they'd passed over fan-fav RB and Heisman winner, Reggie Bush. But Year 2 Mario had his best year as a Texan... may have also been his best as a pro.

 

While Garrett is likely faster/quicker he is nowhere near as thick. Mario came out of NCSt at 295 and trimmed down as a Texan. Also posted 35 reps in the Combine bench press... something I'd forgotten...

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=11478&draftyear=2006&genpos=DE

 

The Patriots are not trading Garoppolo if he is a capable starter. Their starting QB is 2 years older than an ancient Josh McCown.

 

Nah... Tom's playing forever... or at least long enough to shuffle through a couple more prospects... or let Garoppolo bust as the starter somewhere else and return to the nest as an FA.

[Taco918]

Hey Tour, I know your OL guru around here so I was wondering if you had any expertise in TE's as well. I know it's not really the same thing but I figure there's some overlap there.

[Clevfan4life]

I think if Vontaze Burfict was a Brown that everyone would be overlooking his propensity for being a scumbag.

I was in that boat till he lunged at that NE TE's knee. It's just getting too much. One of these days he's gonna pull something like that and the other team is gonna put a 3rd stringer in to take dalton out.

[Clevfan4life]

Still love those steelers highlights though

[Tour2ma]

Hey Tour, I know your OL guru around here so I was wondering if you had any expertise in TE's as well. I know it's not really the same thing but I figure there's some overlap there.

 

Expertise? Moi? Nah... but like good art, I know what I like.

 

Occasionally when looking at OL tape I do see a TE that can block and then I pay attention to whether they can catch as well. CJ Fiedorowicz out of Iowa was the last TE that filled that bill and he's turning out to be a good, well-rounded one for the Texans.

 

Our Devalve did distract me when I was scouting some Princeton OL... who for the life of me I cannot remember now... but Seth was split out most of the time so it was not his blocking that caught my eye.

[Taco918]

 

Expertise? Moi? Nah... but like good art, I know what I like.

 

Occasionally when looking at OL tape I do see a TE that can block and then I pay attention to whether they can catch as well. CJ Fiedorowicz out of Iowa was the last TE that filled that bill and he's turning out to be a good, well-rounded one for the Texans.

 

Our Devalve did distract me when I was scouting some Princeton OL... who for the life of me I cannot remember now... but Seth was split out most of the time so it was not his blocking that caught my eye.

In that case, I'd like to ask if Sprinkle, the TE out of Arkansas, is capable of painting a picture that, at the very least, catches your eye. If, of course, you can fit it into your (hopefully) annual scouting reports.

 

 

At the very least, he should have a "Boy Named Sue" complex to him.

[jiggins7919]

Ah, that's right. Williams didn't start fast, it was his SECOND year where he completely blew up. Think he had around 15 sacks or something stupid like that.

[Tour2ma]

Ah, that's right. Williams didn't start fast, it was his SECOND year where he completely blew up. Think he had around 15 sacks or something stupid like that.

 

I was trying to remember what factors may have contributed to his sack explosion year 2 aside from his own development.

 

First was general team improvement... the Texans went from 6-10 to 8-8. I think they were in even more games late as well, meaning more passing by opponents.

 

Second may be a rookie DT they added, Amobi Okoye... a first round, #10 overall pick who posted 5.5 sacks his rookie year. I'd completely forgotten about him. He was a cat-quick, 300-pound, Louisville product who played RDT for the Texans. IIRC Mario primarily lined up at LDE.

 

Not exactly the pincer created by book end edge rushers, but pressure up the middle kept/put QBs in the path of mario's speed rush.

 

 

And I double checked... Mario posted 4.5 sacks his rookie year followed by 14.0 his sophomore... then 12.0. So our memories were in the ball park...

[TexasAg1969]

Depot leads the Browns braintrust into Draft Day 2017.