Baker Mayfield

[hoorta]

4 hours ago, Zombo said:

Larry, I don't know what the fuck your deal is lately,  but digging in against our best qb since 1993 is not a good look.

You idiots are dissecting one play like you are NFL coaches or something,  and it's embarrassing.  He went for the hot read thinking he had a catch or a PI instead of a checkdown third and 4, and it's all OK.

You wanna live and die on this one play, fine. Tim Couch would have thrown it over OBJ's head, Brandon Weeden would have thrown an interception, Charlie Frye would have been sacked, and Johnny Manziel would have been in Vegas. We all are so sorry the high percentage pass fell incomplete.

Ya'll are a bunch of bitches, I'm glad ODB is gone, and you don't deserve Baker.

Z

Digging in nah- as Tia said, it wasn't a hot read, it was a poorly thrown ball- every NFL QB makes them on occasion.  I truly hope Baker is the long term answer for the Brows at QB, but I'm also not blind. As to hanging our hats on ONE play- you're in total denial. That was just a fer instance. There's been  a few dozen- or notice he's almost never short on his throws? They're almost always high and\or wide. Or as Orion pointed out- there was that completely bonehead play where Baker rolled out right- had Felton past the sticks for an easy first down right in front of him. So what's Baker do? Takes off running and gets stuffed. He hasn't been the same player since he dislocated his shoulder. Period. League leading 80% completion percentage- and now it's a lot more pedestrian.  I'm just not giving him a free pass for his current regression. Don't like it? Too fn' bad.  

Latest unbiased ranking has him right in the middle of starting QBs @ #15- and currently- MHO- that's exactly where he belongs.  You apparently are a wishin' and a hopein' that all the chatter coming from the NFL talking heads is dead wrong- that Baker will never be anything more that a rehash of Andy Dalton. Great- I hope they're wrong too. Yup- Baker was missing around 5 of his starting offensive players- and couldn't overcome that handicap. Speaking of Andy- he was as good as his supporting cast- too early to put Baker in that category, but frankly I'm starting to get a tad concerned. Don't forget I go all the way back to the days of Frank Ryan and Milt Plum. I'm way past the stage of RAH!!RAH!! Sis-Boom Bah!!! Sorry if I'm coming off as cynical, but you're being a total Baker Fan Boy. That Mayfield is better than the motley collection of bums you just mentioned- I'll add in Brady Quinn and Deshone Kizer for good measure. SURE. But just stop acting like he's currently playing like a top 10 NFL quarterback- because he isn't.  

Hint: Stop doing those stupid Progressive commercials Baker, and concentrate on football. You're not even close to Aaron Rodgers level yet. 

 

[Hempman]

Yeah, Baker is a one read qb who is talented presnap and has some good instincts. But once he loses the scripted play, he needs to hopefully gyrate around awhile until something comes open. For a wco perfectionist like KS, it probably sucks. He made it work against a soft, covid hampered defenses last year, but things are back to normal this year. 

Mayfield is not a absolute bust like Weeden or Quinn. But not a homerun either. Haley's offense was the best for him. Much like it did for fellow one read qb Benny boy back in the day with the Steelers.

[Orion]

8 hours ago, Zombo said:

Well we wanna make O'Dell happy , don't we?

Yeah, I said that rather tongue in cheek.   But, from the view of someone sitting on the couch watching replays of the game a couple of days after the fact...things like this come to mind.  Hell, it'd be a positive play and you keep the receiver(s) happy all in one fell swoop.

[7moses7]

1 hour ago, Hempman said:

Yeah, Baker is a one read qb who is talented presnap and has some good instincts. But once he loses the scripted play, he needs to hopefully gyrate around awhile until something comes open. For a wco perfectionist like KS, it probably sucks. He made it work against a soft, covid hampered defenses last year, but things are back to normal this year. 

Mayfield is not a absolute bust like Weeden or Quinn. But not a homerun either. Haley's offense was the best for him. Much like it did for fellow one read qb Benny boy back in the day with the Steelers.

Agree, although Baker is the best QB since Bernie he is not the one who can get it done in the 4th quarter he has proven that. 

[Zombo]

19 minutes ago, Orion said:

Yeah, I said that rather tongue in cheek.   But, from the view of someone sitting on the couch watching replays of the game a couple of days after the fact...things like this come to mind.  Hell, it'd be a positive play and you keep the receiver(s) happy all in one fell swoop.

I get it, I do.

I find it fun to defend Baker, because he's out there hurt, balling, and 95% of the time he makes the right decision, the NFL is brutally tough, and I like to root for our guys.

The second down throw does not eat at me, but the third down draw call does. Stef admitted his fault there, so I've moved on.

As for OBJ, I tried to root for him. I think everyone in the organization tried as well ... but it never felt right. 

This was a John Dorsey deal, and he didn't fit either, and neither did Freddy Kitchins. Now, it's completely Berry's show, and Stefanski fits perfectly. 

And Baker Mayfield fits perfectly.  He's always felt like exactly the quarterback we needed at this time and place, and I'm proud that he's a Cleveland Brown. I thought he handled the OBJ press conference perfectly. 

That does not make him above criticism as a player, some of it is very fair. But if a guy is out there with one wing fighting his tail off for the Cleveland Browns, dealing with major injuries to his stars all around him, and a major unproductive distraction as his "#1" receiver... I'm gonna pull for him, and I'm gonna defend him. That's what makes being a fan fun for me, when you believe in a team, or a player, you go all in. I'd defend Chubb, Myles, and many others the same way ... but QBs are always open to the most criticism. 

Either that ... or I'm just a homosexual "fan boi".

But I think it's the first thing.

Z

[nickers]

I just think it was shitty how O'Dumbell and his daddy used soc' media to play the Browns and basically shit on Baker and the rest of the team... I hope he flops wherever he winds up...

[tiamat63]

I was just thinking of something Peyton Manning said during one of their Monday night casts a few weeks ago. One of the new trends on offense is pre-snap motion in an attempt to get your z receiver on a draw against a WILL backer. It was something he said he had seen more and more offenses working to use regularly.  

Which might help to understand the play call with Hollywood on the motion in 11 personnel and drawing Derwin, who would act as a WILL in this case.  If the idea is to attack that backer or S vertically, you have to move Adderly quite a ways.   Makes me wonder if this was a 2 man choice with a middle field read.   If so, it makes sense and Baker made the correct decision going to Higgins.   But the execution, the ball placement was poor.   He's capable of throwing better, but the questions from me are - how much is injury related and how much is related to a history of up and down ball placement vertically?

I'd love to be a fly on the wall in these offense meetings because it would go a long way in taking my educated guesses and making them facts.

[SdBacker80]

So Stef calls a draw against the Vikings and it goes for big yardage to convert a third down and I believe it set up critical points before the half. He’s brilliant.

Calls the same play against the Chargers it doesn’t work and he apologized for it.

I know how it works which is why I don’t dwell on that play.

Last week I didn’t like the Chubb wide zone run off tackle on 4th and short …and I think Stef has suffered from a lack of situational awareness in some of these games (not taking points)…But by and large I’m not highly critical at least not to the extent I see on here and other places.  He started the Steeler game with 7 of the first 8 plays as a pass…we had to do that at times last year too when teams sold out early trying to contain our run game.  No problem there either. In fact, the one smart decision that Tomlin made (he didn’t make many) was making a concerted effort to scheme and stop our run game with two important interior defenders out.

Back to the Bolts game and If we are going to go back the Charger game.  I’d prefer to focus on the PI call against us and the god awful wide open deep shots for TDs one where I didn’t even see Browns defender in the screen. 
 

Truth is You could probably diagram five or six plays a game where Baker doesn’t see an open guy or makes the wrong read. 

[Canton Dawg]

22 minutes ago, SdBacker80 said:

Truth is You could probably diagram five or six plays a game where Baker doesn’t see an open guy or makes the wrong read. 

You can make this same statement on the majority of the QB’s in the league right now.

[SdBacker80]

10 minutes ago, Canton Dawg said:

You can make this same statement on the majority of the QB’s in the league right now.

Yes and No. This is a team with or at least had Super Bowl aspirations right?  So the situation is magnified a bit.  And he’s making a lot of the decisions with no duress.  I’d happily cut the guy some slack if he had a 290 pound DT in his lap while trying to make these decisions. That was year 2.  So we drafted a LT.  Even though some pointed out he was leaving clean pockets all too often

And then you have times where he’s making the right read and missing horribly.

Year 4 same offensive system finally with great supporting pieces in place - expectations are higher. 

[calfoxwc]

58 minutes ago, SdBacker80 said:

Year 4 same offensive system finally with great supporting pieces in place - expectations are higher. 

wait, Stephanski was hired in 2020. Coach of the Year. This year, everything is going wrong, and it isn't on Baker, not much.

Infantile pouty whiny obj - glad he's gone. Too bad he still gets paid.

[nickers]

1 hour ago, calfoxwc said:

wait, Stephanski was hired in 2020. Coach of the Year. This year, everything is going wrong, and it isn't on Baker, not much.

Infantile pouty whiny obj - glad he's gone. Too bad he still gets paid.

Amen Cal...

[SdBacker80]

1 hour ago, calfoxwc said:

wait, Stephanski was hired in 2020. Coach of the Year. This year, everything is going wrong, and it isn't on Baker, not much.

Infantile pouty whiny obj - glad he's gone. Too bad he still gets paid.

I’m not following here.

Im not blaming Stefanski.  I’m saying one of the Baker excuses prior to 2020 was third system in three years.  That can obviously be a detriment but how is that an excuse with two offseasons and familiarity with the same system.  Shouldn’t Baker be more comfortable now?

OBJ was a great decoy (when his head was screwed on straight) but never reached #1 WR status on this team.  But I’m not ready to anoint  the OBJ departure as a remedy for what ails Baker 

 

[mjp28]

44 minutes ago, SdBacker80 said:

I’m not following here.

Im not blaming Stefanski.  I’m saying one of the Baker excuses prior to 2020 was third system in three years.  That can obviously be a detriment but how is that an excuse with two offseasons and familiarity with the same system.  Shouldn’t Baker be more comfortable now?

OBJ was a great decoy (when his head was screwed on straight) but never reached #1 WR status on this team.  But I’m not ready to anoint  the OBJ departure as a remedy for what ails Baker 

 

OBJ's departure may be just getting rid of an unwanted source of media attention and maybe a cancer in the clubhouse....... regardless of what talent he has left.

And age 29 is generally the peak of a WRs talent before rapidly decreasing, in OBJ's case that's already begun.  Just check the TD production of even good WRs it just happens.

So adios OBJ,  I'm sure we'll hear about you again...... somewhere.

[hoorta]

7 hours ago, Zombo said:

I get it, I do.

I find it fun to defend Baker, because he's out there hurt, balling, and 95% of the time he makes the right decision, the NFL is brutally tough, and I like to root for our guys.

As for OBJ, I tried to root for him. I think everyone in the organization tried as well ... but it never felt right. 

This was a John Dorsey deal,  

And Baker Mayfield fits perfectly.  He's always felt like exactly the quarterback we needed at this time and place, and I'm proud that he's a Cleveland Brown. I thought he handled the OBJ press conference perfectly. 

That does not make him above criticism as a player, some of it is very fair. But if a guy is out there with one wing fighting his tail off for the Cleveland Browns, dealing with major injuries to his stars all around him, and a major unproductive distraction as his "#1" receiver... I'm gonna pull for him, and I'm gonna defend him. That's what makes being a fan fun for me, when you believe in a team, or a player, you go all in. I'd defend Chubb, Myles, and many others the same way ... but QBs are always open to the most criticism. 

Either that ... or I'm just a homosexual "fan boi".

But I think it's the first thing.

Z

Hey- I appreciate Baker going out and playing...  but not if his injury is affecting his play... Yeah- he's the best we've had since Bernie, and he's not going anywhere.....   

I bolded John Dorsey for a reason.  Want to take a wild guess which team is #1 on the waiver wire, and take another wild guess who's the senior personnel executive for the Detroit Lions? We're going to ship you off to football Siberia for the rest of the season for being an a-hole Odell.     

[Orion]

9 hours ago, Zombo said:

But if a guy is out there with one wing fighting his tail off for the Cleveland Browns, dealing with major injuries to his stars all around him,

First let me say that I loved your post.   Yeah, he's a warrior out there.  But he STILL shoulda' thrown the ball to Felton who was just standing there, not moving, all alone, 2 yards past the sticks, on 3rd down.  Instead he tried to run it.  An incredibly dumb decision.  And he's no rookie anymore.  I'm assuming Keenum throws it to Felton in that situation.  And I know Baker's a warrior, but he certainly doesn't want Keenum out there winning games while he's on the sidelines.  Who knows, maybe Stef decides to stick with the hot hand.

I've always supported Baker, and any other player that is brought in.....until they demonstrate reason enough for me to lose my support for them.  I still support Baker, I'm just not so sure that he's the answer any more.  I supported OBJ up until he didn't come out and say something about his Dad's video upload not being a good idea.  At which point, one can determine that he's not with us but against us.  

I'm thinking that Berry sees Baker a lot like I do (and probably all of us).  We have to see a better and more consistent Baker going forward.  And that includes decision making as well as accurate throws.  

[hoorta]

1 hour ago, Orion said:

I supported OBJ up until he didn't come out and say something about his Dad's video upload not being a good idea.  At which point, one can determine that he's not with us but against us.  

The events of the past week took the rose colored glasses off of a lot of us regarding OBJ. It probably never was about the TEAM. It was always about OBJ and his stats, which concomitantly raises his asking price on his (likely) final big payday.  Well, he pouted his way out of town in search of greener pastures and bigger numbers which he still thinks he's capable of. Lotsa luck. 

[Zombo]

4 hours ago, hoorta said:

Hey- I appreciate Baker going out and playing...  but not if his injury is affecting his play... Yeah- he's the best we've had since Bernie, and he's not going anywhere.....   

Ya, his injury dropped six balls and fumbled away a scoring drive this week.

Z

[Zombo]

2 hours ago, Orion said:

First let me say that I loved your post.   Yeah, he's a warrior out there.  But he STILL shoulda' thrown the ball to Felton who was just standing there, not moving, all alone, 2 yards past the sticks, on 3rd down.  Instead he tried to run it.  An incredibly dumb decision.  And he's no rookie anymore.  I'm assuming Keenum throws it to Felton in that situation.  And I know Baker's a warrior, but he certainly doesn't want Keenum out there winning games while he's on the sidelines.  Who knows, maybe Stef decides to stick with the hot hand.

I've always supported Baker, and any other player that is brought in.....until they demonstrate reason enough for me to lose my support for them.  I still support Baker, I'm just not so sure that he's the answer any more.  I supported OBJ up until he didn't come out and say something about his Dad's video upload not being a good idea.  At which point, one can determine that he's not with us but against us.  

I'm thinking that Berry sees Baker a lot like I do (and probably all of us).  We have to see a better and more consistent Baker going forward.  And that includes decision making as well as accurate throws.  

Ya ... he should have thrown the ball to Felton ... that's ONE play. I can find one boneheaded play from all 32 starting qbs pretty much every week.

Every game I watch, QBs miss open guys or do something aggravating ... Brady, Rodgers ... you name it.

He's accurate, he has a gun, he's a strong leader, he exudes confidence. If you don't know if he's the answer then you must have enjoyed those 20 years of questionable play by questionable quarterbacks we all lived through. What do you want to do? Hit the draft again? You gotta be kidding me.

Z

 

 

[Dutch Oven]

2 minutes ago, Zombo said:

Ya ... he should have thrown the ball to Felton ... that's ONE play. I can find one boneheaded play from all 32 starting qbs pretty much every week.

Every game I watch, QBs miss open guys or do something aggravating ... Brady, Rodgers ... you name it.

He's accurate, he has a gun, he's a strong leader, he exudes confidence. If you don't know if he's the answer then you must have enjoyed those 20 years of questionable play by questionable quarterbacks we all lived through. What do you want to do? Hit the draft again? You gotta be kidding me.

Z

 

 

Baker Mayfield is our Andy Dalton.

Andy Dalton was a solid starting QB for years for Cincinnati, but it became obvious that he was limited. A guy who can win some games, but doesn't really elevate the players around him.

So they let him go, and got Joe Burrow. 

[Zombo]

12 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

Baker Mayfield is our Andy Dalton.

Andy Dalton was a solid starting QB for years for Cincinnati, but it became obvious that he was limited. A guy who can win some games, but doesn't really elevate the players around him.

So they let him go, and got Joe Burrow. 

Joe Burrow has thrown 9 interceptions this season ... Baker has 11 over the last TWO seasons.

And he's won 15 games over those two years, Burrow has won 7.

Fucking rats bailing on the ship so soon cracks me the fuck up.

Guy leads us to our first playoff win since 1993, and now he's "limited" because we're 4-4 in a myriad of injuries.

I am disappointed in Browns Fan Humanity. 

Z

[Dutch Oven]

6 minutes ago, Zombo said:

Joe Burrow has thrown 9 interceptions this season ... Baker has 11 over the last TWO seasons.

And he's won 15 games over those two years, Burrow has won 7.

Fucking rats bailing on the ship so soon cracks me the fuck up.

Guy leads us to our first playoff win since 1993, and now he's "limited" because we're 4-4 in a myriad of injuries.

I am disappointed in Browns Fan Humanity. 

Z

Baker has always been limited as a NFL QB. Doesn't mean he's bad or he sucks as some people on here contend, it just means his ceiling is only so high.

And there probably isn't a GM in the NFL that would take Baker Mayfield over Joe Burrow. 

[Orion]

2 hours ago, Zombo said:

What do you want to do? Hit the draft again? You gotta be kidding me.

Lol....after posting my thoughts, for shits & giggles, I went and looked up the top 10 college QB's.  I like the tall ones with strong arms.  Carson Strong, Nevada, 6 ft 4. 

Of course Baker is the best WE'VE had in the last quarter century.  Hands down.  Most everyone wants him to be the one.  The way he debuted against the Jets that Thursday night was magical.  But now, if we're trailing late in the 4th quarter and need to get down the field and score...well, I can't remember the last time we've succeeded in winning one of those games.  I'm sure it's not too long ago though.

Now, with our WR situation deteriorating (OBJ gone, Landry gimpy, DPJ seeming injury prone), RT out....this season has the potential to go to hell in a handbasket.  (in which case I'll take Carson Strong  )  But on the other hand, did DPJ ever dream of being a #1 WR in the NFL?  This is his chance.  Can Higgins get back into sync with Baker?  Can Landry stay healthy?  Can we get consistent production from the TE's?  Can we get back to running the ball effectively?  The answers can certainly be yes.  In which case we'll be good enough to string a bunch of wins together and make a playoff run.  -  Let's hope for that.  Because nobody wants us to be back to square one.  

[hoorta]

3 hours ago, Zombo said:

Joe Burrow has thrown 9 interceptions this season ... Baker has 11 over the last TWO seasons.

And he's won 15 games over those two years, Burrow has won 7.

Fucking rats bailing on the ship so soon cracks me the fuck up.

Guy leads us to our first playoff win since 1993, and now he's "limited" because we're 4-4 in a myriad of injuries.

I am disappointed in Browns Fan Humanity. 

Z

1) As has been said- there isn't a GM in the NFL right now who would trade Joe Burrow for Baker right now- straight up. FWIW, living in Bengal Land- I'll 100% agree.   

2) We're NOT bailing- we just dont have your 100% homer glasses on like you do.  

4 hours ago, Zombo said:

Ya, his injury dropped six balls and fumbled away a scoring drive this week.

Z

I didn't put that loss on Baker. Drive killing drops. If it's not one thing, it's something else. Get ready Z- a loss Sunday (I'm expecting it) and scouting college prospects gets into full swing. We haven't beaten a team with a winning record yet.  

[Zombo]

5 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

Baker has always been limited as a NFL QB. Doesn't mean he's bad or he sucks as some people on here contend, it just means his ceiling is only so high.

And there probably isn't a GM in the NFL that would take Baker Mayfield over Joe Burrow. 

What exactly are his limits?

Z

[Zombo]

2 hours ago, Orion said:

Lol....after posting my thoughts, for shits & giggles, I went and looked up the top 10 college QB's.  I like the tall ones with strong arms.  Carson Strong, Nevada, 6 ft 4. 

Of course Baker is the best WE'VE had in the last quarter century.  Hands down.  Most everyone wants him to be the one.  The way he debuted against the Jets that Thursday night was magical.  But now, if we're trailing late in the 4th quarter and need to get down the field and score...well, I can't remember the last time we've succeeded in winning one of those games.  I'm sure it's not too long ago though.

Now, with our WR situation deteriorating (OBJ gone, Landry gimpy, DPJ seeming injury prone), RT out....this season has the potential to go to hell in a handbasket.  (in which case I'll take Carson Strong  )  But on the other hand, did DPJ ever dream of being a #1 WR in the NFL?  This is his chance.  Can Higgins get back into sync with Baker?  Can Landry stay healthy?  Can we get consistent production from the TE's?  Can we get back to running the ball effectively?  The answers can certainly be yes.  In which case we'll be good enough to string a bunch of wins together and make a playoff run.  -  Let's hope for that.  Because nobody wants us to be back to square one.  

He did everything you are questioning last year, so yes ... he/we can.

As for "can we get back to running the ball effectively " ... are you shitting me? We are #1 in the entire league in yards, y/a and tds. In our 8th game we "only" got 95 yards and a TD, and now we're not effective? You fuckers are the doomiest and the gloomiest.... Did Soju convert everyone while I was sleeping one night?

Z

[Zombo]

1 hour ago, hoorta said:

1) As has been said- there isn't a GM in the NFL right now who would trade Joe Burrow for Baker right now- straight up. FWIW, living in Bengal Land- I'll 100% agree.   

2) We're NOT bailing- we just dont have your 100% homer glasses on like you do.  

I didn't put that loss on Baker. Drive killing drops. If it's not one thing, it's something else. Get ready Z- a loss Sunday (I'm expecting it) and scouting college prospects gets into full swing. We haven't beaten a team with a winning record yet.  

I didn't realize that living in Dayton made one a Joe Burrow expert.

I guess I'm a Brady and Tua expert then, let me know if you have any questions.

The fact that you are expecting a loss tells me everything about you right now.

We'll win this game, and we'll win the division. And then I'll have Baker shit on a plate and I'll slice it up for you guys.

Z

[gumby73]

5 hours ago, Zombo said:

What exactly are his limits?

Z

is?... what it is? The gut'zie Player...

Baker has done nothing, but shown his.. love.. leadership.. and team-mate-warrior-ship.. that still will run through a wall to win a game... he loves playing the game..

including the guts to go make a tackle (the how) ...or block (still) when needed... 

now others are finding ways to use this against him.. to... _______________ yada/yada/yada

I'm not here to toss arrows at the facts of how #6 got hurt 🎯 

Berry has all the game-tape/ The Room.... to make a honest choice at the position...

[Dutch Oven]

6 hours ago, Zombo said:

What exactly are his limits?

Z

For one, his height.

He often times struggles to throw from the pocket, hence why Stefanski designed so many roll-outs or play-action passes for Baker. Problem is, teams are starting to get hip to that, and the roll-outs are becoming more difficult to execute. I also believe why so many of Baker's passes are high is because he's trying to throw behind a wall of OLinemen much taller than he is. High passes from Baker are not specific to just his recent injury. 

To be fair, I also suspect Stefanski's offense is somewhat limited too. Many have criticized Baker for his inability to lead game winning drives, but I don't think this offense is one that is built to come back from behind either. Basically, I don't think Baker or this offense is all that good at passing when everyone knows they need to pass. 

[Zombo]

15 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

For one, his height.

He often times struggles to throw from the pocket, hence why Stefanski designed so many roll-outs or play-action passes for Baker. Problem is, teams are starting to get hip to that, and the roll-outs are becoming more difficult to execute. I also believe why so many of Baker's passes are high is because he's trying to throw behind a wall of OLinemen much taller than he is. High passes from Baker are not specific to just his recent injury. 

To be fair, I also suspect Stefanski's offense is somewhat limited too. Many have criticized Baker for his inability to lead game winning drives, but I don't think this offense is one that is built to come back from behind either. Basically, I don't think Baker or this offense is all that good at passing when everyone knows they need to pass. 

Not sure how height is a limitation when I see the careers of Drew Brees and Russell Wilson.

He's had 7 game-winning drives as a starter, but none this year, however you think that is more of a Stefanski thing.

Staggering case you have presented, Counselor. 

Z