DieHardBrownsFan Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 No on Bridgewater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 well as long as we don't have holmgren picking our QB then i'll give this FO achance. 2 years down the line the guy doesn't pan out, then they are gone as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 anymore I really don't want to hear about a qb's physical gifts like speed or arm strength or can he hit someone's butthole from 20 yds out. We've been regaled with all these combine stats for years from these fantasy league playing dooshbags. What I want to know, and don't know about any of those qb's coming out next year....is can they read defense's? Can they figure out what's coming pre snap and make the adjustment? Luck has it. Does RG even have it? Or did he make it look like he did cause he can buy himself time with his wheels? We all know now that qb's that rely solely on their wheels have a limited run in the NFL. Luck is going to be around as long as Manning. RG may not be in the league in 3 years. It sucks but it is what it is. Vick was the exception to that rule but that's only because I think he did nothing but study defense in prison. But yeah he's hurt again too. BINGO! All those "measurables" are worthless if not backed up with intelligence & knowledge of the total game. I have maintained for years that a 4.6 smart player will play faster & more productively than a 4.3 stupid player. A player who understands the game will see, adjust, & react MUCH faster than a player who doesn't. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 it's heart, the desire to win and most important of all is the smarts. some people come with it naturally. johnny manziel is a perfect example of this. he plays like the college game is slower than he is and does things naturally that others could only hope to do. mariota sorta in that same category but is bigger. do i think either could make it in the NFL? i think mariota would have a better shot only because of his size. has everyone seen the pounding RG3 is taking this year? seriously he got slammer jammered last week and you know it's taking a toll not only on his body but in his confidence to do what he could do in college. i'm all for the 'wait and see' about hoyer. is he going to be 100% will he be affected mentally from his injury and not be the same guy? i'd love to see hoyer be healthy with all the confidence in the world (and have taken a 'sliding' class or 3) come back and make it hard for the FO to go all-in on someone that is unproven at this level. sure he's only played a few games but at least he played a few games. weeden in the big 12 or whatever ok.st. conf is in was probably the best because they played nobody and he was ahead of the game at that point. coming into the big leagues is a whole other game charlie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 30, 2013 Report Share Posted October 30, 2013 1. Trent Dilfer was literally 14 years ago. We're in leap time and it's a different era. Since then, the Super Bowl has been about Brady, Manning, Manning, Favre, Warner, Roethlisberger, Brees, and Rodgers... a lot of future HOFers. And we went five years where the 10 teams had an average rank of 23rd in rushing, including 3 ranked dead LAST. 3. Matt Miller (NFLN and BR) says Bridgewater is his 2nd rated QB of the past five years and Mariota is 3rd (both behind only Luck). And if either has a bullet, it's Mariota. He's a freak athlete but becoming a truly elite passer. As someone on the national level said, you can get blown away by the measurables (legit 4.4, faster than RG3, as fast as Vick ever was), or the stats (500 yards rushing, 65% completion, sick 20/0 ratio)... but more than anything, just watch him play. He has elite arm talent and accuracy. He's smart. He makes great decisions. Have we seen a guy that tall, that fast/quick, with that much arm talent come into the league lately? No. Which is why he's giving a legit #1 overall like Bridgewater (and he's damn near perfect) such a run. Those two would be in the running for #1 overall in just about any draft of the past decade. Any draft in the last decade? Really? First, Shep, I'm hard pressed to think of a single member here that agrees with you on Bridgewater. I don't... Second, I can only think of a couple that like Mariotta. I'm not sold after my first viewing, but I am still looking... Third... wasn't Boyd "your guy" just a couple weeks ago? You haven't mentioned him lately. While we all agree you need a QB to win in this league, we simply do not agree that there is anyone in this draft worth giving away the store. And your latest HOF QB list does not help you make your case. Unless I'm mistaken only the Manning brothers were high 1st rounders. I know I'm right that Warner was a UFA... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shep Posted October 31, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 No position player in all of team sports influences everybody and everything else like a quarterback. They aren't the beneficiaries... they are the causes. With Manning? Playoffs, year after year. Without Manning? 1-15. Draft Andrew Luck? Back to the playoffs. If the Browns had Manning, Brees, Rodgers, or Brady, we'd be 11-5 this year. That position aside, the Browns are like most other teams: We have lots of good football players. It's the quarterback that makes the difference. Truth. Stafford hurt? Lions suck. Stafford healthy? Lions headed for playoffs. Goes on and on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 No position player in all of team sports influences everybody and everything else like a quarterback. They aren't the beneficiaries... they are the causes. With Manning? Playoffs, year after year. Without Manning? 1-15. Draft Andrew Luck? Back to the playoffs. If the Browns had Manning, Brees, Rodgers, or Brady, we'd be 11-5 this year. That position aside, the Browns are like most other teams: We have lots of good football players. It's the quarterback that makes the difference. Truth. Stafford hurt? Lions suck. Stafford healthy? Lions headed for playoffs. Goes on and on. Dammit, no one is debating you a stud qb isn't important in today's NFL. But we can sure debate where and how you find that stud qb makes a world of difference. Don't give me any crap draft strategy is way better now than it was in 1999. The record speaks for itself. Here's the list of QBs taken in the top 15 since the Browns return- with a few notable exceptions. Couch McNabb Smith (1st massive bust) Culpepper McNoun (#12 massive bust) Vick Carr (got Carr-ted off the field too often) Harrington (Remember him Shep? You were still pimping him when I freaking TOLD you every Lions fans in the world knew he sucked Donkey Balls.) Palmer Leftwich (nice backup for a top 10 pick) Boller (#19 overall, bust) E. Manning Rivers Rothlisberger Alex Smith (on to the SB with the stud KC D) Vince Young (BUST!!) Matt Leinart (you were blowing smoke up his sorry ass too) Cutler (OK with Da Bears- and they didn't draft him either) JaFattus Russell (MASSIVE BUST #1 OVERALL) Ryan Stafford Sanchez (smart move there Mangini) Freeman (#17 overall) Bradford- Andrew Luck he ain't Fig Newton Luck RG III (per ESPN today- struggles in the pocket- now that he can't take off- and gee- has another knee owie) Tannehill ______________________________________________________ Want to look at some of the shit that got drafted top 15 and still tell me it's worth it to sell the ranch on a prayer? For all you know- Bridgewater (the only guy I've scouted to date) may be another Mike Vick- zero SBs, IIRC. Mariotta? Remember another Oregon stud qb by the name of Akilli (worm burner) Smith? I haven't forgotten how Sports Science was oohing and ahhhing about Weeden's ability to bust clay pigeons with a football. Maybe he can get a job at County Fairs doing the same stunt- after the Browns cut him in January. Another thing I'm factoring in- and the Brown's FO certainly will before they sell the Ranch on a prospect is "The Brian Hoyer effect". Sure he may be the next Kelly Holcomb- but hmm..... just what if the Browns finally got hit by lightning for a change, and found the next Kurt Warner? If their thinking runs in that direction, they sure as hell won't be spending multiple picks to move up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenew23 Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 Based on ^^^ I am even more interested in making sure we take a QB in the top 15. On that list, I'd rather have had 14 of those guys than any of the QBs we have had since '99. That is HALF. So, if you're telling me we can make it 50-50 on getting a good QB, I'll take it... and if it doesn't work, I'll try it every year after that... I'm NOT at all interested in pulling a Redskins trade, especially not if you're talking about Bridgewater or Mariota... I AM all for doing what we need to do in order to get the QB that fits our system. If we have to use 2 1st round picks to get him, no problem... If we trade 3 1st rounders +... I won't be happy, but guess what? It'll be about 50-50 he has success... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 23, 50/50 you say? How do you come to that number? Does anyone think that Indianapolis would trade Andrew Luck for both of our first round picks and our second? Do you think they would trade Andrew Luck for Bridgewater and Mariota and Boyd? WSS WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 There's not a QB worth trading up for. We will get a good QB with our first pick, which will be a Top 10 pick. However, even though this draft is QB deep, it doesn't mean it's deep with good QB's. According to the Law of Averages, of the top 4 QB's: one will excel, one will be good, one will be mediocre and one will be garbage. It's a crapshoot as to which player does what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 We all know that the Browns have a ton of talent, and a pretty good oline. When Peyton went to the Colts, his left tackle was already a first round pick ahead of him. Measure the qbs... how to you measure their ability to see the field? I don't see Mariotta being a fiery leader...yet. Joe Flacco was picked in the bottom half of the first round. Big stupid BR was out of the first ten. Eli Manning and Alex Smith - questions about them being busts were common. That special "it" factor is what the Browns need. And trading valuable picks for an Eli or Alex isn't about "It". This Browns staff and FO will know the guy who has "it", and will get him. I don't see the top two in this draft being "have to have". The Browns need a Hoyer/Sipe/Nelson/Kosar - smart qb in this next draft. Needs the instincts, the qb smarts, the leadership to put all that Browns talent together. Even if he doesn't have the biggest "nfl" arm. ********************** Are Alex Smith and Eli Manning busts? - Yahoo! Answers Best Answer: Alex Smith--definitely can't call him a bust yet. He definitely showed a lot of promise last year. At the very least, he showed last year that ... answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070603124427AAZcVVI - Cached More results from answers.yahoo.com » The official Eli Manning is a BUST thread - New England ... Eli has been in this league long enough and has been erratic at best,I thought for the past several games that maybe he turned the corner to being a solid pro but ... www.patsfans.com/new...official-eli-manning-bust-thread.html - Cached Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 23, 50/50 you say? How do you come to that number? Does anyone think that Indianapolis would trade Andrew Luck for both of our first round picks and our second? Do you think they would trade Andrew Luck for Bridgewater and Mariota and Boyd? WSS Steve, Luck was one of those rare, rare birds- the can't miss prospect that couldn't miss. Elway level talent. Scouts tried to pick apart his game looking for weaknesses- and couldn't find any. The Colts turned down RG III level trades to take him. LOL, now the Browns could offer the Colts their entire 2014 draft for Andy, and they'd get flat turned down. There's not a QB worth trading up for. We will get a good QB with our first pick, which will be a Top 10 pick. However, even though this draft is QB deep, it doesn't mean it's deep with good QB's. According to the Law of Averages, of the top 4 QB's: one will excel, one will be good, one will be mediocre and one will be garbage. It's a crapshoot as to which player does what. That's exactly it TC. Every year draftnicks and scouts cream their pants over the current crop of college qb prospects. BTW, if we draft in the top 10, I'm hoping it's because we had to trade up. I really don't care where we draft our stud qb, as long as we draft one. Otto Graham was even before my time & you'd have to be well into your 30s to remember Kosar's few great years. . Like I commented to Steve- the very top quarterbacks, the Elways, Marinos, Bradys ,and Brees are rare birds- maybe every three years or so- and you don't necessarily need to have a top 2 pick to land one of them. I can't recall an instance were a team successfully sold the Ranch to get a talent like that. Walter's football was laughing at us for not giving up three firsts and a second to land RG III- well, who's laughing now? Redskins fans are sweating bullets, praying nightly, and ordering up cases of Lourdes water that Griffin doesn't turn into a Ki-Jana Carter injury bust. If he does- to put it bluntly- they're screwed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 Golf has female steakers? Cool... suck on it soccer... Dammit, no one is debating you a stud qb isn't important in today's NFL. But we can sure debate where and how you find that stud qb makes a world of difference. I haven't forgotten how Sports Science was oohing and ahhhing about Weeden's ability to bust clay pigeons with a football. Maybe he can get a job at County Fairs doing the same stunt- after the Browns cut him in January. Another thing I'm factoring in- and the Browns FO certainly will before they sell the Ranch on a prospect is "The Brian Hoyer effect". Sure he may be the next Kelly Holcomb- but hmm..... just what if the Browns finally got hit by lightning for a change, and found the next Kurt Warner? If their thinking runs in that direction, they sure as hell won't be spending multiple picks to move up. 1. Exactly... may have gotten thru this time... 2. LOL 3. Yup... Fits with what I have posted. It's Hoyer's job now. Campbell is a placeholder. It will remain Hoyer's job in the minds of most fans until he shows he cannot recreate the excitement he did for 2 games in 2013. However, even though this draft is QB deep, it doesn't mean it's deep with good QB's. ... at the next level... But odds also improve that at least one in the 2nd round or lower will be "good". I'll settle for that one... Measure the qbs... how to you measure their ability to see the field? Watching lots of wide angle footage we don't get to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 Golf has female steakers? Cool... suck on it soccer... Whoops, that was supposed to go in Gipper's "Streaker" thread. But we'll leave her here, looks like she has a good 40 time. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 Watching lots of wide angle footage we don't get to see. I'd guess, things like watching the eyes, seeing whether the head moves as they go through progressions and how quickly, whether they can 'look off' the safeties, reading a zone, seeing how the zone transforms, as ours did a lot against Kansas at the weekend, whether they can do these things when running a play action, and especially when under pressure. But probably more things as well that are well above my football IQ. Then you get on to all the pre-snap reads, audibles etc. if a guy hasn't done it at college level, can you expect him to do it at the pro level? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 Yup... and good question... So many times now QB and entire Offense looks to sideline for any pre-read audible... I hate that... tells you nothing good about the QB. Key is does the QB lock onto a reciever or a key defensive player at the snap? If the former, then you have a thrower, e.g., Wheezy. If the latter, then you just may have a QB. If the QB shows that he can read coverage on the fly, then pre-snap is a "snap". Another test is where the QB's eyes go when flushed out of pocket. As we are told ad nauseum during broadcasts, the good ones keep their eyes downfield... the also-rans only see the rush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 An NFL scout said Jameis Winston of Florida would be the number 1 pick if he was eligible. That kid is a stud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark O Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 Article on SI.com mentions the Rams might be willing to deal Sam Bradford this offseason. Any interest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 There's not a QB worth trading up for. We will get a good QB with our first pick, which will be a Top 10 pick. However, even though this draft is QB deep, it doesn't mean it's deep with good QB's. According to the Law of Averages, of the top 4 QB's: one will excel, one will be good, one will be mediocre and one will be garbage. It's a crapshoot as to which player does what. I agree that these are certainly not odds that are worthy of a trade up. I bold faced above what, in my opinion, is the key statement. I don't think the top rated QBs in this upcoming draft can carry Luck's shoes, but that's just MY opinion. I have not seen a single scouting report that states any of this years' QB crop can take a D apart by reading it & that eliminates trading up. I still think McCarron's the guy this year & he lacks the "measurables" too many of these guys fall in love with for a #1 or #2 guy, but I DO think he has the mental skills coupled with good (maybe not great) physical tools to let him learn & develop behind Hoyer, who I still believe will come back to lead the Browns in 2014. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted October 31, 2013 Report Share Posted October 31, 2013 Article on SI.com mentions the Rams might be willing to deal Sam Bradford this offseason. Any interest? While there are signs that Sam has finally gotten "it" this year. I have to say no... Just feel that he's one of those tweeners. Good enough to get hopes up, but not take you home. Plus now he's injured for the 2nd time in his career. First was a "mere" high ankle sprain putting him out of six games in 2011. Now comes the ACL tear... Besides we already have one of the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted November 1, 2013 Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 There are three "reads" a QB has to make before he even makes his route reads: pre-snap, snap, and plant. Pre-snap is beaten to death on this forum. We all know that a QB has to be able to accurately guesstimate what the defense will do based on their alignments and posture. I say "guesstimate" because a god defensive coordinator, of course, hides his intentions. Many people like to say that Manning can read a defense before he snaps the ball. That's not the case, in truth. Normally, the pre-snap read is focused on identifying the CB assignment and identifying the mike. Half of the staff Manning does at the line is for show; trying to get the defense to force their hand. He can yell out "sixteen bologna, 52 mike, snake, snake!", it doesn't mean anything. All he's doing is bluffing. What Manning does read nearly instantly, however, is whether the CB's are playing man or zone. This will help him eliminate many routes that are low percentage against that coverage, and help him audible accordingly. A QB's pre-snap mental agility is no doubt one of the most important qualities. To me, however, the penultimate read is the snap read. This is the read the QB makes at the moment the ball is snapped. The snap read tends to be focused on the mike LB and/or the FS. When a QB is dropping back, in the second or two before he completes his drop, he needs to be able to tell if the safety is dropping to a half zone or single deep, if the mike is playing the RB, blitzing, filling a gap or sitting zone, and if his receivers made a clean break off the bump. All of this is one or two seconds. That's what all great QB's have in common. Not all walk to the line and wave their arms and scream nonsense. It's the quickness of the second read that they all share. Unfortunately, it's something that's impossible to scout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shep Posted November 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 Decent drop off from Bridgewater and Mariota, if you polled a dozen GMs. Not to say Manziel, Carr, Mettenberger, or somebody else couldn't end up awesome. But from what we know right now? They're 2 of the top 3 guys drafted. And most would tell you the Browns will go balls out for one or the other. Latest rumor is Mariota. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenew23 Posted November 1, 2013 Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 Decent drop off from Bridgewater and Mariota, if you polled a dozen GMs. Not to say Manziel, Carr, Mettenberger, or somebody else couldn't end up awesome. But from what we know right now? They're 2 of the top 3 guys drafted. And most would tell you the Browns will go balls out for one or the other. Latest rumor is Mariota. Your obsession is noted... thanks again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bringbackbrownie2 Posted November 1, 2013 Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 Decent drop off from Bridgewater and Mariota, if you polled a dozen GMs. Not to say Manziel, Carr, Mettenberger, or somebody else couldn't end up awesome. But from what we know right now? They're 2 of the top 3 guys drafted. And most would tell you the Browns will go balls out for one or the other. Latest rumor is Mariota. That's just it. Rankings don't mean shit. It matters how good they are once they play in the NFL. Weeden, Ponder, and Gabbert were all high round picks that sucked in the NFL. And your boy Tannehill looks far from impressive. Having a great QB is essential for long term success, but there are about 3 maybe 4 teams with top notch QBs. It's a team sport and I would hate to blow half our draft to move up for Bridgewater or Mariota when there are plenty of other QBs we can take not to mention Hoyer still being a possible long term solution... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted November 1, 2013 Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 Decent drop off from Bridgewater and Mariota, if you polled a dozen GMs. Not to say Manziel, Carr, Mettenberger, or somebody else couldn't end up awesome. But from what we know right now? They're 2 of the top 3 guys drafted. And most would tell you the Browns will go balls out for one or the other. Latest rumor is Mariota. How do you know that's true? Tell you what, how about you poll a dozen GM's and get back to us with the results. For the record, a dozen GM's is basically a third of the league, so I would actually lean toward siding with the other 66% of GM's who supposedly feel different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted November 1, 2013 Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 Decent drop off from Bridgewater and Mariota, if you polled a dozen GMs. Not to say Manziel, Carr, Mettenberger, or somebody else couldn't end up awesome. But from what we know right now? They're 2 of the top 3 guys drafted. And most would tell you the Browns will go balls out for one or the other. Latest rumor is Mariota. Source please? If the Browns finish 8-8, they'll have to give away 1\2 their draft, plus probably next year's #1 to move up that high. Dream all you want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted November 1, 2013 Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 Heh also a decent or even steeper drop off from Luck to Bilgewater ...... (just wanted to use that nickname for when he goes somewhere else ) WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shep Posted November 1, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 Wow... you don't like Bridgewater? I honestly don't have any problem with anybody hating on every QB draft (boards are notorious for that)... but I'm offering up the broader notion that most in and around the NFL see this as a very good QB draft if most or all of the eligible guys come out. Most also would bet you a thou or so that the Browns will be very aggressive about getting the guy they want with the first card they send to the podium. I believe it was Higdon who said "sources" say the Browns like both Mariota and Manziel a lot. Part of that is because Bridgewater is one of the higher rated QBs to come out in the past five years and a lock for #1, probably to Jax. MANY mocks think TB will take Clowney because they like Glennon and intend to continue developing him. But it's also because Chud wants a very mobile QB who can give him more options with the offense. I don't see them taking Mettenberger or Carr, frankly. Right now, they pick 11th and you're seeing a lot of Manziel there... but it's tough to find anybody who doesn't expect the Browns to be extremely aggressive trading up... partially because they said that's why they acquired the extra #1. They aren't being coy about it. There really are no mocks that DON'T have the Browns taking a QB. It's not an obsession. It's just reading and watching and taking the most reasonable stance. I like Hoyer. So does Mary Kay. So does Grossi. Neither believes for a second the Browns won't draft a quarterback early in round 1. Couch... you were joking on the math, right? I didn't say, "Find 12 GMs who say this is a great QB draft and then ask them if they think it's a great QB draft." Please say you were kiddin' around. I said poll a dozen GMs. The dozen you have access to, or randomly, and they'll tell you it's an excellent QB draft. They'll also tell you Bridgewater is a legit #1 overall pick at QB and there are probably four or five guys better than anybody in last year's draft. And as Peter King said, if the draft were held today, both EJ Manuel and Geno Smith would make more money. Not because they've been the best ever but because they've looked legit. Manuel probably wouldn't get past the Browns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted November 1, 2013 Report Share Posted November 1, 2013 Your obsession is noted... thanks again... LOL... Hang in there, Shep. I may disagree, but I admire your sticktoittiveness... There are three "reads" a QB has to make before he even makes his route reads: pre-snap, snap, and plant. A QB's pre-snap mental agility is no doubt one of the most important qualities. To me, however, the penultimate read is the snap read. This is the read the QB makes at the moment the ball is snapped. The snap read tends to be focused on the mike LB and/or the FS. When a QB is dropping back, in the second or two before he completes his drop, he needs to be able to tell if the safety is dropping to a half zone or single deep, if the mike is playing the RB, blitzing, filling a gap or sitting zone, and if his receivers made a clean break off the bump. All of this is one or two seconds. It's the quickness of the second read that they all share. Unfortunately, it's something that's impossible to scout. Nice breakdown... Yes, Defenses deceive. What a QB sees pre-snap may or may not be true. The snap read either confirms the pre-snap or not... and normally the movement of either the ILB or FS are the key. Disagree that second read talent is impossible to scout. Where the QB looks (who he looks toward) during his drop can be seen. Then you grade the decision he makes. Certainly easy to spot an 'F' student like Wheezy or DA. And your boy Tannehill looks far from impressive. .. Tannehill still has a ways to go to be sure, but still has the greatest upside of his draft. Based upon the progress he's made, I believe he will end up second to only Luck in his draft class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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